Shila

Who laid down with the lamb?

what animal?

😂😂😂😂

- Whether you're christian or atheist or jewish or else, what is the most serious objection or question or scriptural quote or doctrine or experience... that shook what you believed in or at least made you uncomfortable or unable to deal with?

- From a scale of Jon Snow to 10, how much do you know about your belief system? From a scale of 1 to Jesus, how strong is your belief?

No problem.

🤣🤣🤣 Morons.

Christianity is basically authoritarian and as such it attracts authoritarian followers. The problem with such followers is that they don’t just want to submit to an authority they also want others to submit to that authority.

• English language churches have been preaching since at least the 1400's that the "Eye of the Needle" was a minor gate in the west wall of Jerusalem- so small that a camel had to be unpacked and made to bow to pass through.  Difficult, but possible.
  

This is why it's useful to look at what rabbis were saying during the time of Jesus. People who he talked to or whose works he read. The rabbis at the time used the same phrase. The rabbis he got the exact phrase from added commentary to it and made it clear that it just means, it is very hard to enter heaven. I want to name the branch of Judaism that Jesus heavily pulled from, but it has been so long since I studied this, that I have forgotten.

Do you have any evidence/arguments that would prove that humans have souls/immaterial minds?

Evidence against the immaterial part of the mind is Phineas Gage [1].

Popular reports of pre-accident Gage often depict him as a hardworking, pleasant man prior to the accident. Post-accident, these reports describe him as a changed man, suggesting that the injury had transformed him into a surly, aggressive alcoholic who was unable to hold down a job.

Damage to the Brain = damage to the mind, therefore mind is not separate from the brain. 

[1]

https://www.verywellmind.com/phineas-gage-2795244

How do you know what’s true?

Are Christians bootlickers?

I hope you’re sitting down. Maybe grab a stress ball or cuddle with your therapy dog.

Ready? Ok. Here goes.

The New Testament is filled with epistles that were not written by Paul or Peter. These are called “Pseudepigrapha” because, like other fake scriptures circulated in the late second and third centuries, they were not authored by the Apostle whose name appears on it.

The textbook definition of Pseudepigrapha is:

“Spurious or pseudonymous writings ascribed to various biblical patriarchs and prophets but composed within approximately 200 years of the birth of Jesus Christ.”

In other words, the New Testament you’re holding contains “scriptures” that are about as reliable as The Gospel of Thomas, The Epistle of Barnabus, or The Book of Enoch [which the New Testament book of Jude quotes, by the way].

Sorry to break it to you like this, but there was no other way.

You need to know the truth.

(the above is by Keith Giles in 2019) 

It seems that humans never listen.

Though perhaps the only way to learn is to make mistakes.

Nonetheless, the GOD hypothesis is but one.

And like all creation hypotheses, it falls down at the beginning.

Then they are wasting their time aren't they? The New Testament teaching is completely the opposite to that of the Quran.

With that said, they - Muslims-may have a case when pointing to the Old Testamant, which is nothing more than a book of war and conquest as is the Quran.

So why not give the three weeks a miss this year for a refreshing change.....Might turn out to be a good thing.

Though upon reflection, I would suggest that a routine lifestyle is perfectly normal, whereas habitual behaviour without consideration for consequences could obviously have a negative impact in the long term.

Anyway, thanks for the discussion and you stay safe too.

You are being disingenuous. 

Stop trying to make out that these two so called saints had established a full fledged established "church" with a congregation made up off the masses in Rome, they didn't.

They may well have founded a underground 'movement' which went against Rome. The persecution of Christians was rife at the time these two lived and Rome was still at war with the Jews. Jerusalem hadn't even fell at the time c 63-64 bc.  Rome had it own gods and no way were they ready to add another "god" to their own established pantheon , especially a Jew god . 

Well, the composition of the bible is such that variable conclusions can be reached and therein warnings can be seen.

So global climate is altering probably due to human influence, and so all of a sudden the bible predicts this.

Though it would have been more helpful if the bible had given us a scientific breakdown of the problems that could be expected from future population demands and associated industrialisation and dependency on fossil fuels.

Trouble is the bible is not quite so clear cut and prefers to issue riddle like warnings encoded in socio-ideological ramblings.

Though are you being cynical or serious?

I'm not going to help you preach under the pretense of debate. If you become interested in honest debate, let me know. :-)

A fully Mastered pastor

Why do Muslims always deflect to the Bible?

How so?

Incoherence

For sure.

Group activities can be fun.

And we find comfort in routine.

And safety in the pack.

But whether or not a pragmatic God would finds  rituals dedicated to it necessary, is unlikely.

But of course.

Whether or not there is a GOD, pragmatic or otherwise, is still to be confirmed.

And then which one.

Or which ones Poly.

Go dance naked around the camp fire, and enjoy.

On my sabbath I will be donning my lycra and cycling 50 miles with my pack of MAMIL'S.

Both were executed in Rome by Romans. 

Polytheist-Witch

Notice how it doesn't take the atheist long to fall back on anti-semitism, bigotry, death threats and rape jokes.  👍

The Roman historian and senator Tacitus referred to Christ, his execution by Pontius Pilate and the existence of early Christians in Rome in his final work, Annals (c. AD 116),

Yes, 116 years after Jesus was supposedly born.  I guess he read some of the myths the newly formed Christians were spreading.

Nope. No one witnessed a dead Christ.

The body of Jesus was placed in a tomb. So what?

Nope. Not a single person witnessed a dead three days old , stinking and rotting corpse come back to life.

Indeed therefore man, the bible says, was created as good as god... or as poorly designed.

Abrahamic is all 3, judeo-christian is only found in the J and C... Obviously...

And yes thanks, also many of those 4 billion don't believe it, they pretend to so that their family and friends don't reject them.

Jesus was never mentioned in any Roman sources and there is no archeological evidence that Jesus ever existed. Even Christian sources are problematic – the Gospels come long after Jesus' death, written by people who never saw the man.

Suffering is just a product of Poor Design.

So?  Also according to the bible we were created in his image".

So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Genesis 1:27

I dont believe in the judeochristian god... that god is impossible and defies our reality.

We adhere to or bosses, they don't need to be moral to do so, same with parents.

High priced precision pastoring. 

Rather an odd thing to say about members here considering your profile shows you to have been a member for only 4 fkn days.

Shila

A member since August 16, 2022

Shila (debateart.com)

I think your mask is slipping sunshine. Must try harder.

If god is real, god is amoral.

Does anybody disagree?

Experience and Testimony is Evidence, Reid's Principle of Credulity applied to god(s) existence

CONCLUSION

With this argument it ends up with the atheist or agnostic needing to now provide justification for their position in the debate. Counter-evidence needs to be provided or else theism is rationally concluded as true (tentatively). Not only must counter-evidence be provided, but they also must defend against arguments that it is not, in fact, counter-evidence. That is the strength of this argument, it makes it so no longer is the theist playing defense but the atheist and agnostic is.

I know this argument will be unconvincing to most people, but it is important to remember that an argument can both be sound and also be unconvincing. We are not purely rational beings after all.

Suffering is just a product of Poor Design.

Well it appears that is all one has to do is " unblock" themselves to become a "master", Deb.

"For some students an attunement can be a very wonderful, or emotional experience.

And if someone doesn’t feel a lot during an attunement, they often will have wonderful experiences later on, as long as they continue to use Reiki.

For example I had a Reiki class with 3 women, they were all friends. Two of them had intense experiences during the attunements, but one of them felt nothing. She was sad, that she couldn't feel anything during the attunements, but her friends did.

I told her that this is ok, maybe she needed to release some blockages first". 

What are Attunements? (gatelightelearning.com)

Is it any wonder that the Witch tells us that she comes here to only take shite?

Yes, it was a lovely day.

And the Earth was at a specific point of it's Solar Orbit, such that viewed from here, the duration between the sun rising and setting was at it's maximum.

And today, hopefully will be very similar but with a marginally shorter duration between sun rise and sun set.

And so on, until December 21st.

And so on.

Until such a time, when the Sun will eventually engulf the Earth.

And we will cease to be memories.

Unless we have escaped this Earthly prison.

You may be wondering why this topic about Evolution is not in the Science Forum, but here in the Religion Forum. Bare with me.

For the longest time, I was apathetic to Evolutionary Theory. It didn't speak to me. I come from a Physics/Mathematics background. So the whole thing didn't look serious to me. From someone who studied things like Quantum Mechanics, Gravitation & Particle Physics, evolutionary ideas looked too mechanical, too naive, too archaic. No maths. The world we commonly encounter in our daily lives is minimally energetic. That's why it looks as if things are mechanical, as if things affect each-other, as if we understand the parts of a problem, then we can understand the problem. In another highly energetic world the things we think of as common sense would become completely uncommon. That is the quantum realm, the femto-world, where things are highly energetic for their sizes, weird shite happens. The world is not a a large reductionist structure, it's a weird mysterious enigma. Evolutionary postulates, however, are reductionist champions. That's why they never made much sense to me. But they always held some romance to them. Maybe I just don't get it yet, maybe I'm not seeing what all these people are seeing. This, until I read Richard Dawkins book The Blind Watchmaker. This book completely changed my mind about Evolution. I thought I was in for a scientific adventure. What does the icon of Evolution have to say? To my astonishment, this was no book of Science. This was not terrible Science. The few psychiatry papers I read before were terrible. The alien articles I read were terrible. This was simply not Science at all, rather Literature, of the Myth genre. The entire premise of the book is: 'Evolution is true, therefore let's imagine how it happened'. A genesis story of creation with a materialist mythology. Hence the title, Imagination... I mean... Evolutionation.

For a theory which has been systematically & consistently taught for decades across the globe as a core science curriculum, Evolution fails spectacularly in gaining support. Despite all the promotions, the majority of people outside Europe & East Asia do not believe in mainstream Evolution. In the US, only 20% of Americans believe in the mainstream claims of Evolution, whereas 40% deny it, despite the decades long totalitarian tyranny the evolutionary narrative exerts over the country's education & academic arenas. The evolutionationists believe that it's the fault of the Church. In truth, it's the fault of the theory itself. The Church could not thwart antithetical scientific ideas about the cosmos from spreading when it had absolute power over the people. It is of highest absurdity that the Church would be able to thwart sensible scientific ideas when in a time where it is of ultimate powerlessness in state & academic institutions. Very few people insist on denying things they see with their eyes & realize to be true in favor of their dogmas. Certainly, the idea is simply not that compelling. The evolutionary narrative is a failed narrative. It had all the chances in the world & all the powers of the state to gain support, yet it barely managed to. 

For those of you who subscribe to this mythos. Before you get your panties in a wad, this has nothing to do with Creationism. I'm Muslim, the truth of Evolution does not add to or diminishes from my faith. In fact, the earlier theories of evolution emerged from the Muslim world. Ikhwan Safa taught that life progresses from plants to monkeys to humans. Ideas which have been adopted by many among the Mutazilites after them, eventually making it into Europe in early 19th century. Such is an idea which has been circulating in the Muslim world for over a thousand years, yet barely being able garner any serious support. Disgraceful! Maybe in 500 years we'll have a quantum theory of biology. But for now, this evolutionary story may very well be all that we can muster. That said, if you're a Christian, why do you believe in this evolutionary story while you have a more compelling life story in the Bible? If you're a naturalist, what makes you believe in the truth of this story knowing that it's unscientific?

America's wealthiest pastor Kenneth Copeland is worth $760 million and doesn't pay taxes on his $7 million dollar mansion.

What did Jesus mean when He said it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into heaven?

Any halfway intelligent person is well aware that the genuine practicing of witchcraft was not in any way associated with the "Witch Hunts" in history. Men and women who had in some way made enemies with those in political or religious positions were murdered using the term witch to kill them. While some of these people may have engaged in practices that were once done in the community by witches such as midwifing or herbal healing there's no proof they practiced genuine witchcraft. Most were probably Christian practitioners who were honoring and continuing a skill that they were taught by a parent. The term witch is still used as a negative in political and religious speech to target mostly women but also men who are outside or considered an enemy of that political/ religious persuasion. What does this have to do with the modern practicing of witchcraft? That people in general still view that practice as evil or somehow negative. And that the people engaging in it are evil and negative. This holds true in regards to atheism as well even though witchcraft is a series of practices and that it's an atheistic practice and that gods are not necessary to engage in it. It is still considered woo woo by non- spiritual atheist and the target put on a person who calls themselves a witch is done by both political / religious enemies as well as atheism. I'm attaching a video that was done by an archaeologist who is also participates in a variety of pagan practices. It explains how the genuine practice of witchcraft has been demonized and uses a political tool to hurt and kill people who were probably in no way shape or form engaging in what would be considered witchcraft by those actually practicing. 

youtu.be/KQ3iHdbWRaE

Interestingly, there have been modern-day attempts in Christianity to make God gender neutral. For instance, in the early 1980's the National Council of Churches released a new translation of the Bible that eliminated references to God as solely male. As an example, John 3:16 was changed to read ''For God so loved the world that God gave God's only Child, that whoever believes in that Child should not perish, but have eternal life.''

Is God male? If not, why should our translation of God's Word us the masculine pronoun?

My math major has showed me some signs of a higher power like the following:

1) sin(x)=x-(x^3/3!)+(x^5/5!)-(x^7/7!)+(x^9/9!) ...

2) cos(x)=1-(x^2/2!)+(x^4/4!)-(x^6/6!)+(x^8/8!) ... 

3) 4(1-(1/3)+(1/5)-(1/7)+(1/9)-(1/11)+)... = pi.

There's more, but I don't think this could all be by chance.

But when I converted to Christianity, their god initially told me to call him, "God".  I did this and I got my prayers answered.  Then he switched to, "Jehovah"(Jehovah's witnesses believe the exact same thing as standard Christianity except they call their God a different name(Jehovah)).  That worked for a little bit, but then he insisted on changing his name again.

This led me to believe that religion is in my head.

So if I'm not religious nor atheist, there needs to be an alternate source of the universe's existence.

This leads me to be a simulationist.  I think we are living on a planet that's in a universe that's in a computer simulation run by aliens and they sent math as proof of their existence.  They invented all these religions as an experiment to see what would happen if they gave humanity many different religions.  There are probably universes where there is only 1 religion and the aliens are collecting the data they are interested in.  The aliens are curious so they experiment on us by presenting stimuli and seeing how we react to this.  They are not all loving nor all powerful, they are just curious to see what happens when certain stimuli is produced .

https://www.biola.edu/blogs/biola-magazine/2013/did-the-apostles-really-die-as-martyrs-for-their-f

Info on the martyrdom of the apostles as historical fact

What do skeptics think of this argument?