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@Danielle
When you say Biden is a proven liar, are you referring to political things and if so can you specify?
A lot of his lies are, but the one that sticks out to me the most isn't political. Biden's first wife and his baby daughter were killed in a car accident. Investigations found the driver who hit them was blameless. But despite that, despite the fact that there was nothing to gain from it, despite the fact that he knew it wasn't true, Biden repeatedly and posthumously accused the driver of being drunk. He smeared the reputation of a dead man for no reason.
I feel like it's hard to be 100% truthful in politics (that isn't to say lying is excusable, but context matters).
I agree, but, as you said, that doesn't excuse it.
As far as assault, I hate to defend this (trust me) but Biden seems like your run of the mill creepy old man. I think we all know people that are too handsy. He seems to lack total wherewithal about why it's not appropriate to touch everyone. That is completely unacceptable but I don't think he means anything by it, especially with kids.
Sure, but being a creepy old man is, as you said, completely unacceptable.
And the plagiarism thing doesn't bother me. Virtually no politician writes their speeches anyway; they're all reading someone else's words.
There's a difference there. Yes, everyone knows that politicians have speechwriters, and politicians don't hide that. However, plagiarism is different than speechwriting. Speechwriters do get the credit for their work. Everyone knows they wrote it. However, with plagiarizing, it's just stealing someone else words and ideas without giving them credit. That's not the worst thing a person can do, but it's blatantly dishonest. What made it worse was that Biden plagiarized things such as saying that he was the first in his family to graduate college. That may have been true when Neil Kinnock said it, but it was a lie when Biden said it.
Was there a candidate whose character you felt was exemplary that Dems should have run instead of Biden?
Well, a candidate with an exemplary character is generally an oxymoron. That being said, I think Tulsi Gabbard would have been a better choice.
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@RationalMadman
It's a little late for that. Regardless, I don't think Biden is an improvement. His character is less bad, but his policies, in my opinion, are worse. I couldn't vote for either of them.
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@Vader
I'm down with testing pie this DP, but let's not waste the DP. There are still more people who haven't checked in yet.
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@Danielle
Which Dem candidates lack character? (Not disagreeing; just curious who you're talking about.)
I was referring to Trump and Biden. Trump is obvious. Biden is a proven liar, has been photographed violating women's personal space many times, and has been accused of sexual assault (though there's not enough evidence backing the accusation to draw any conclusions, and I'm a big believer in innocent until proven guilty). One of the major reasons Biden lost his first presidential campaign was because he plagiarized someone else's speech. While Trump is probably worse in each of these respects, excluding the plagiarism, Biden is still severely lacking in integrity.
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@Danielle
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Based on the Senate results, court-packing probably isn't going to happen. That's one positive, at least.
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@Username
Biden just took the lead in Michigan. He's only got a 0.64% lead in Nevada, though. It's really, really close right now.
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@Danielle
This is how I imagined conservatives would feel: torn, not ready and willing to take a bullet for King Trump.
Well, we can dream.
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@Danielle
I didn't catch that line, and I don't agree with it. Given the candidates they nominated, I don't think either party has much claim to "[valuing] character and competence."
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As of now, it's too close to call. If both sides win the states they're currently leading, Trump will win. However, that's far from guaranteed.
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@Username
It does. GP's prediction in post 2 is looking more and more accurate.
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What's really beginning to scare me is that the race is close enough that we may not know the winner for a while, and a 269-269 tie is still in play. I really, really hope that my ScumAnonymous prediction doesn't happen.
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Fox (I know, I know, but they are at least competent with reporting election results) is estimating a 90% chance the R's will hold the Senate.
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Trump is now leading in NC with 90% of the votes in. R senate candidate Tillis is leading as well.
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PA's only 27% counted, but Trump leads it by 27%. Trump could still lose this, but, for at least a brief moment, he's got a chance.
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It's not over yet, but Trump is leading Ohio by 4% with 77% of the votes counted. I'm seriously wondering if Trump is going to pull off a second upset. Still a long way to go, though.
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@Username
I started an election thread here.
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@Dr.Franklin
Yeah, Ohio is a must-win for Trump from what I've heard. There's still a long way to go, and anyone could win.
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As much as I dislike Trump, it's still sweet to watch Hispanic voters turn out for him in record numbers. It's almost like four years of the media hammering us with the message that the Republican party and Trump is racist against Hispanics was so much hot air. I just wish it could have been someone other than Trump.
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Vote Count:
Interested in Mafia: 0
Watching Florida: 11
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@MisterChris
I will say, though, that there is the possibility of him being a Jester.
I hadn't thought of that. I doubt it, though.
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@MisterChris
@Intelligence_06
What Chris said. If he's mafia, then he's not deathproof. Thus, lynching him wouldn't be a waste of time. However, I do see your point about going after mafia. I lean toward believing Pie, so we might have a better chance of catching mafia if we lynch someone else.
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The first votes are being counted. Now we will see if the polls are right or the silent majority materializes.
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@Juice
Actually Mopac is right.
Christians believe he stabbed to death on a cross.
No. Jesus was already dead when He was stabbed. That is why water flowed out of the wound. That only happens in cases when the person is already dead.
Christians believe that God is represented in the holy trinity, so Jesus is God.
Yes, but God the Father and God the Son are not the same person according to Christian doctrine. The Trinity is one God in three persons, so it is incorrect according to Christian doctrine that the Father and the Son are the same person.
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@Lunatic
@oromagi
@Speedrace
@MisterChris
@Mikal
What are your thoughts on Pie's claim? Should we test it this DP or not?
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@Greyparrot
Did my incoherent grammar look like a scum slip, or is that a reaction test?
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Danielle giving you no role at the start of DP1 does seem towny to me because I can't imagine why scum would do that.
I can't imagine why scum would claim that they had no role, that is.
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@ILikePie5
I’m DeathproofI can’t be killed in the night nor in the day by lynching. I urge everyone to LYNCH me today so that I may be confirmed in my assessment.
Interesting. I'm not sure whether testing your claim this DP is a good idea or not. Since you're deathproof, it would give a town-confirmed player that the mafia couldn't kill. On the other hand, I'm almost more inclined to believe you and lynch elsewhere this DP.
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@Greyparrot
I know. Danielle giving you no role at the start of DP1 does seem towny to me because I can't imagine why scum would do that.
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@Speedrace
I think GP is confirmed as well, that sounds like a Dani move lol
That's quite possible.
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@Speedrace
But now he's confirmed town to the rest of town so he'll die
That's true.
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@Lunatic
Good to see you're town-confirmed already. Now we know who not to lynch.
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@Lunatic
I hope that's a different person than MagicAin'tReal.
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@MisterChris
Not a giant trump fan but better him than the alternative.
Maybe, but I don't think that's good enough. Stalin killed a smaller percentage of his people than Pol Pot, so, in a choice between the two of them, Stalin is better than the alternative. However, I still wouldn't vote for him. That's an extreme example, obviously, but it illustrates the point that simply being less bad isn't good enough. Trump has sexually assaulted women and gone on to boast about it. I can't vote for someone who did that even if they are less bad than the alternative.
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@Greyparrot
Conservatism is a dead ideology.
I hope not, but I already knew that I'm a political dinosaur.
And you will never see another Bush, Romney, or McCain ever win a Republican primary ever again.
Pity. While I completely understand and to a large degree agree with the accusations that they were too moderate or even RINOs, they were (are) men of good character, and I would far prefer any of them as president than Trump or Biden. Honestly, I'd gladly vote for Romney if he ran again because he actually had the guts to stay true to his principles rather than sacrificing his integrity on the altar of Trump. I know that won't happen, though.
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I've been thinking about making this topic for a while, but I never had the time or the words. Thankfully, Dan McClaughlin had both. So here is the conservative case against voting for Trump (though not for Biden).
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