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@Bullish
@Singularity
He hasn't claimed, although it would probably be a good idea given the pressure on him.
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@Greyparrot
@Discipulus_Didicit
@Singularity
Warren brought up the point of what justification Pie could have for Rhodey being a role cop. What do y'all think of this?
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UVC
ILikePie5 (3/7) - drafterman, warren, Supadudz
Bullish (4/7) - Discipulus_Didicit, Singularity, GreyParrot, SirAnonymous
WaterPhoenix (1/7) - WaterPhoenix
warren42 (2/7) - Lunatic, oromagi,
VTNL (1/7) - Ragnar,
Not Voting: ILikePie5,
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And I forgot to update the not voting players.
UVC
ILikePie5 - drafterman, warren
Bullish - Discipulus_Didicit, Singularity, GreyParrot, SirAnonymous
WaterPhoenix - WaterPhoenix
warren42 - Lunatic, oromagi,
VTNL - Ragnar,
Not Voting: ILikePie5, SupaDudz
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@ILikePie5
@warren42
I have no idea how rhodey would be a rolecop
Now that's an interesting question. I'd be very curious to hear the answer.
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Whoops. Forgot to update mine.
UVC
ILikePie5 - drafterman, warren
Bullish - Discipulus_Didicit, Singularity, GreyParrot, SirAnonymous
WaterPhoenix - WaterPhoenix
warren42 - Lunatic, oromagi,
VTNL - Ragnar,
Not Voting: warren42, ILikePie5, SupaDudz
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UVC
ILikePie5 - drafterman, warren
Bullish - Discipulus_Didicit, Singularity, GreyParrot
WaterPhoenix - WaterPhoenix
warren42 - Lunatic, oromagi, SirAnonymous
VTNL - Ragnar,
Not Voting: warren42, ILikePie5, SupaDudz
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@warren42
Maybe, but I'm bad at reads, so I don't trust my scumreads. Unless I have a really good reason to suspect someone, lynching an inactive is my backup plan.I don't care about your current read, I care about that logic which makes no sense to me.Shouldn't someone who has not at all posted be the truest "null" there is?
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@warren42
Why do you think Pie is scum? I honestly can't tell whether Pie or Bullish is scum (or both), so I'm good with lynching either of them.
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Not drafter. Ragnar. Drafter was the mod.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
You have a valid point. Half of us scumread drafter in the last game, but we talked ourselves out of it and lynched Singularity instead.
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@warren42
I have a natural inclination against inactivity. I'm town reading you now.
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@Vader
@Discipulus_Didicit
I guess that isn't such a good example, then. I remember reading that game. It was sad, really.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Was it on DART or DDO?
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@Bullish
I would guess those stats are heavily skewed because many short DPs are short because they have scum who were confirmed by the flip of the last player lynched, so I don't think correlation equals causation here.Early lynches are correlated with higher chance of lynching scum.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
That's just plain rude. It isn't town or scum. It's just rude.
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@Bullish
What's that supposed to mean?
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@Discipulus_Didicit
I'm okay with a Bullish lynch. VTL Bullish
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@Bullish
In that case it's probably not worth it. After five years, I doubt you'd behave in the same way.
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@Bullish
@Discipulus_Didicit
I second that. You haven't been mafia on this site yet, so I would like to see your DDO games as scum.
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@warren42
Your last post was about Lunatic being a lyncher. I honestly forgot that was ten pages ago now.
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@Bullish
I was TP in Speedrace's Quickfire mafia and town in Lunatic's and Supa's.
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@Bullish
I'm on a mobile device, so copy-pasting multiple links is a pain. I was mafia in The Office and QFS2. I was town in Lucid Dreamers, QSF1, and Survivor. I was also in several more QFs.
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@EtrnlVw
Firstly, who says the animal would need a voice box? All that's required is to move the animals mouth and have sound come out. Secondly, that's assuming it was a snake and not Satan taking the appearance of a snake. Thirdly, asserting something is absurd doesn't make it so.I don't believe any devil has the ability to make animals speak that have no voice box, that's absurd.
You're giving too much power away where it doesn't belong.God creating things through processes IS supernatural, but the devil doesn't have any power to do either of those things. He's not a creator, and he doesn't make animals talk.
How do you know the devil can't make animals talk? That doesn't require creation ex nihilo.
When you expect someone to believe such things they lose respect for what you wish to communicate.
Why? It's all fine to say such things are absurd and wave your hand vaguely at common sense. However, those are mere assertions. How do you know such things aren't possible?
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@EtrnlVw
So when you claim they are capable of doing things that break natural laws, we should see them occur all the time correct?
To begin with, are you saying God can't do miracles, or that He can, but doesn't? I can't tell.
Now, I would say that we would actually expect not to see many miracles. Most of the times miracles happened in the Bible, it was to validate a message from God. However, the Bible is complete, and the only prophecies left to be fulfilled concern the end times. Thus, I would not expect to see many miracles.
then what is figurative if not talking animals?
Parables, figures of speech, flowery language in the prophets and poetry books.
And since we know how human bodies were and are developed, we can conclude that being formed from dirt is a figurative expression.
Not so. An omnipotent God can easily change the molecular structure of dirt into a man.
It's how God uses the elements to form what it is God wishes to create.
How are miracles different from that? God created the universe; why can't He manipulate it?
There would never be any need for your parents if God erected human bodies from the dirt you stand on, think about that.
He doesn't create human bodies from dirt. He formed the first human from dirt; however, in order to do that, it would require changing the molecular structure of the dirt into cells.
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@warren42
Now that you're caught up, who do you want to lynch?
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@Discipulus_Didicit
I think that was his motivation for claiming. Without claiming, his arguments against GP were weak at best, so he seemed to feel it was necessary to claim because that significantly strengthened his case. That's my interpretation, anyway. I don't know exactly what he was thinking, although that interpretation was what made me blame myself for outing him. In hindsight, though, I don't know what I could have done differently. I hadn't noticed any signs that he was going to claim.Are you saying that you disagreeing with supa in a few posts prior to post 72 caused supa to make post 72?
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@Stephen
That's fine, but asking a question with a little all caps and plenty of bold gives a rather different impression.That's not the issue and it is irrelevant. I want to know is all.
I am aware of what it states in Revelation but I am not sure if that is the answer. You seem to think it is.
Yes, it is the best explanation.
Two people now appear to agree that the identity of the Eden serpent is Satan.. One states it is merely "symbolic" .
There are some Christians like EtrnVw who think large portions of the Bible are metaphorical or symbolic. I think they don't take it as literally as they should, but that's not the issue in the this thread.
God could only have been talking to the same snake as Eve had been talking to other wise, why curse another snake. What do you think?
I think He was talking to the same snake. However, He may very well have cursed all snakes. They're not sentient creatures, so they wouldn't know the difference anyway. I don't see how it makes much difference either way.
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@Mopac
Yes, although a simple yes or no would have sufficed.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
And Singularity didn't reveal everything until post 98 at the bottom of page 4.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
He didn't start hinting at his role until post 70 on page 3, and didn't explain his role until page 4.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Yeah okay except he revealed on page 2 lol.
Yes, it took me a while to realize the consequences of what I'd done.
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@Mopac
That doesn't really answer my question.I'd rather get on the ark than risk riding out the flood on driftwood personally.
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@WaterPhoenix
No problem. I don't think anyone wants to lynch you this DP anyway.
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@warren42
Keep it up. This stream of consciousness is both interesting and enlightening.
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@warren42
Keep reading, but GP isn't TP, and it's highly unlikely he's scum. You'll see what I mean.
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@Mopac
Do you think it's possible for someone who isn't part of the Orthodox Church to be saved?It only matters what The Orthodox Catholic Church believes.Those outside the church belong to heterodox churches.
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@rbelivb
Then how do you define conservatism if it is independent of ethnicity? What are you trying to conserve?
Well, I can't speak for all conservatives (no one person can), but I can tell you what I think. "Conservative" is a bit of a misnomer because there's no one place in history I can point to and say, "That's what I'm trying to conserve." I'm trying to conserve the ideals that the Founders had for this country. They famously wrote that all men are created equal and are entitled to the rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Of course, they didn't implement that perfectly, or anywhere close to it. However, that ideal is what I want to see happen in this country. I believe that everyone should have an equal opportunity to succeed without being discriminated against over their skin color, sex, or religion, and that their rights to say, write, and believe what they want should be protected. I also believe that the inherent human right to life should be protected.
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@Stephen
It does to me. I want to know the identity of the Eden serpent.
Why?
Revelation suggests it to be the "Devil and Satan". Revelation 12:9 and Revelation 20:2
So if you're aware of this answer and have provided the biblical support for it yourself, why are you asking?
Ok, then simply say that you do not understand and your business here will be done.
Well, you've provided the biblical support for the serpent being Satan yourself, so it wouldn't be accurate to say I don't understand who the serpent was.
And entitled to his opinion all the same. Do you not agree. if you believe his opinion to be totally wrong, then simply start a thread of your own laying out why he is wrong and with evidence to prove him to be wrong. As far as I am concerned he is trying to give his interpretation, without evidence.
Of course he's entitled to his opinion.
Well you said at post #4 above that I supplied "strong evidence " that answered my own question. I have simply asked that someone who believes him/herself to be in a position to know or not if that is actual "strong evidence" that I supplied.then you are just the man I am looking for. And then you agree that the "ancient serpent" of Revelation is the same serpent written about in the Eden story of the serpent also called Satan & Devil?
Yes, that is the best explanation of the passage.
So you are not sure now then?
I'm mostly sure. Even if the serpent wasn't Satan himself, I have no doubt that Satan was responsible for its actions.
That's non of your concern. I have asked a question as to the identity of the tempting serpent, and up to this point I have been told it is " only symbolism" , "that it is Satan" that " it is the Devil", and that "I have answered my own question".
No, it isn't my concern why you've asked the question. However, it seems to be a useless question to ask. It's as though I asked you why my pizza tasted bad while simultaneously pointing out that my pizza has pineapple. You would then respond, "It probably tastes bad because there's pineapple on it," to which I would then reply, "But you don't know for certain, do you? Why does my pizza taste bad?" You're using bold, underline and all caps to ask a question that you've provided a good answer for yourself. You've provided good evidence to accept that answer. But even if that answer is wrong, it proves nothing. It wouldn't create any contradictions. However, you're still asking it like it's some kind of earth-shattering question. I don't understand what you're trying to do here.
Ok. I hope I don't get too confusing here but , let me point out, that the story starts already with a "serpent" (you call it a snake) Genesis 3.
Serpent and snake are synonyms. There's no need to put that much emphasis on such a minor distinction.
It appears to me at least that we are talking two different snakes/ serpents. You see the one that tempted Even is already a "snake". But when we get to Gen 3:14 we read of something or some one only now being cursed & condemned to crawl on it belly like a snake for the rest of its daysThis is why I asked you " if or not the serpent/Satan Devil at Genesis 3:1 is the same serpent Satan Devil as the one cursed Genesis 3:14
Let me get this straight. You're wondering why the curse says that the serpent will be condemned to crawl on its belly if it is already a serpent. Is that what you're trying to ask?
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Supa isn't correct that I admitted to pressuring him. What I said was this:
Oh, I see how I outed Supa and Singularity. I am an idiot. I panicked and wasn't thinking straight.
Throughout pages 3 through 6, Supa had been trying to argue that GP's claim was scummy and that it made the game imbalanced. I had been arguing that GP's claim wasn't scummy or imbalanced. The problem was that the reason Supa thought it was imbalanced was because of his own role. So in order to convince me and others that GP's role made the game imbalanced, he revealed his own role. So by arguing against his accusations that GP was lying, I had inadvertently forced (or at least, Supa thought I had forced) him to reveal his role. Basically, Supa's only argument against GP was that his and Singularity's role would be imbalanced if there was also a suicide. In order to convince everyone that GP was scum, he thought he had to reveal his role, and I had been a major reason he thought that because he couldn't convince me without revealing his role.
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@Dr.Franklin
That's either the same guy or a rather clever troll imitating him to troll people here.
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@EtrnlVw
How are those things obvious metaphors? God is supernatural. So is Satan. They are capable of doing things that break natural laws because natural laws don't apply to them. If you accept the existence of supernatural beings, then you must accept the possibility of supernatural events.
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But as always, I'd like to hear from the remaining inactive player before lynching.
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I'd be fine lynching Pie, Bullish, or Lunatic. It's likely that either or both of Pie and Bullish are scum. Lunatic would be a lynch based on math. Simply put, he counts as scum in the mafia-town ratio, which could complicate things down the road.
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@oromagi
Heh heh heh, if only you knew. We really appreciate the money we sto-you gave to us, though.I just assume everybody but me and Dr.Franklin are one big Russian spy lab, hacking the 2020 election, drinking warm vodka straight from the bottle and smoking lucky strikes and playing mafia in front of a bunch of laptops in the same room. Every time I post you guys laugh and say, "**** this guy" and take another 20 cents out of my debit account.
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Third Party:
Lunatic (Lyncher, T'Challa): He's claimed lyncher. There is one way he could be lying which I explain in my read on GP, but it is rather implausible. I don't see any good reasons for him to lie.
Town:
SirAnonymous: I know I'm town.
Greyparrot(Suicidal, Helmut Zemo): He was Lunatic's lynch target, so it is highly likely that he is town. There are a few other possibilities, such as that Lunatic is scum and was bussing to try to town-confirm GP and TP-confirm himself. However, this is quite implausible, because it risks a CC from the real TP.
Lean Town:
Supa/Singularity (Lovers, Steve Rogers and Bucky Barnes): They've claimed lovers, so they probably have the same affiliation. Singularity says that her role PM said Supa was town, but I noticed that Supa hasn't said the same about Singularity (Supa, please clarify this point). Thus, it is possible that Singularity is scum and Supa is town, whereas the opposite scenario doesn't seem possible, unless I'm forgetting something. Both of them are playing consistently with their prior styles and haven't given any reasons to suspect them, so I'm town reading them for the moment. I don't like how they tunneled GP, but it does make sense given their role. And now that I think about it, their characters go well with their role.
Disc: His actions have been very pro-town so far, and I like his analysis. That being said, I've read the other games on this site, and I know he's hard to catch as scum. Still, I'm leaning town on him.
Null:
Water: He's largely inactive, so there isn't much to go on.
Ragnar: Again, there's not much to go on. From what little I've seen, his posts seem more genuine, but I would like to see a lot more of them.
Drafter: I need to go back and read games where he's scum, because I'm not familiar with his scum play. However, he does seem to have plenty of pro-town analysis and has good contributions. I want to know how he plays as scum before town reading him, though.
oromagi: He's only been moderately active, which is normal for him. He hasn't posted much of substance beyond read lists, with a few exceptions.
Lean Scum:
warren: Inactive.
Pie(Role Cop, Rhodey): Behaviorally, I town read him. However, I think drafter is right that scum was on the GP wagon, so Pie is a suspect.
Bullish(Claimed a Cap-aligned character): Same as Pie.
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@oromagi
Obviously, I value anonymity. Lunatic asked why Singularity wanted to be anonymous. I replied with a rather rhetorical sentence. I was trying to make the point that anonymity is something that people can want for its own sake. This is especially valuable on the internet. If you seriously suspect that Singularity is my alt, or vice versa, you can ask Mike or Virt to check our IP addresses. I don't have any alts, and I'm not an alt myself.
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@warren42
Ok, I'm finally at a computer, so it's time for reads. Before I begin, VTL warren for activity. You're a good player, and we need you on here.
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@ILikePie5
I just see quarrels with Bullish and no analysis
I'm getting there. I haven't been at my computer since this morning, and I don't do analysis on mobile because it's too much typing.
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