oromagi

Is philosophy always 'art, though?

Well, I vaguely recall Plato disliking art, as he felt it 'wasn't useful to what he saw as an ideal society, in his book, The Republic.

Hitler, didn't like some modern art, as he thought it fostered degeneracy or something.

I am not a Republican and take great offense to my name even being associated with any political party. You are only as good as its worst most corrupt pedophile.

prove the rule of law exists ,

I see you completely ignore my example of why it no longer exists

 https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2021/05/15/dominion-voting-systems-and-maricopa-county-democrats-refuse-to-cooperate-with-the-arizona-audit-of-the-2020-election/

https://www.newsmax.com/politics/maricopa-county-auditors-2020-election/2021/05/07/id/1020526/

Since Democrats returned to power.

Yes their 3.5 trillion dollar infrastructure bill

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/just-under-6-percent-of-biden-s-infrastructure-plan-goes-to-roads-and-bridges/ar-BB1ffyNP

-->@oromagi

What is wrong with the idea that the fountain matches your subjective definition of art but not other people's?

-->@oromagi

Yes yes yes "the law" Since when did the rule of law mean anything? The law says you cant enter the country illegally , yet there are over 20 million people who entered this country illegally living here. The law is as worthless as two tits on a hog. The law is what ever asshole who can ignore , manipulate or not enforce the law says it is. 

Why are politicians blocking access to requested documents and info why are politicians refusing to even allow an audit?

Since when did wasting millions of tax dollars ever become an issue? 

-->@oromagi

By making them aware of the egregore that controls their minds. 

• Would you call that spirit YHWH?
  
• Is cyanide gas still your preferred method of release or do you recommend some more expedient measure?

(Also, I don't know enough about Bugattis to say whether or not I would consider them art.)

Are you are suggesting there exist objective criteria for what can and cannot be considered art and you simply don't have enough information to determine whether a Bugatti fits that objective criteria?

->@oromagi

Jews hate freedom accept [sic] for their own. In the video when hews [sic] were asked to say "free Palestine " they all refuse.

• Loving or hating freedom is irrelevant.  The question is whether someone respects other people's human right to liberty.
  
• All civil rights come with some limitation.  Your right to free movement ends at my nose for example.  Your right to free expression does not include shouting fire in a movie theater.
  
• Many people are incarcerated because they pose a substantial threat to the freedom of others.
  
• Senator Mark Kelly probably doesn't believe that his wife's assassin, Jared Lee Loughner ought to be free because he's quite violent and mentally ill.
  
• One cannot fairly conclude that Sen. Kelly therefore hates freedom.
  
• Jews and Palestinians have a famously violent history and may well harbor irrational biases toward another.  Such biases ought not be the only benchmark by which we evaluate respect for civil rights.
  
• Your irrational bias towards Jews is well established.  Shall we likewise conclude that you must hate freedom?
  

Which of course cant be proved because all the evidence has already been destroyed

@oromagi

Oromagi

Election frayd never happened. It is impossible for elections to be wrong

Duchamp's "Fountain" is basically an urinal with words written on it. Using 'utilitarianism, we could find that this artwork, if valued relatively objectively, brings LESS value than the average urinal since it is no different than the average urinal, but you aren't allowed to urinate in it because you are in a museum's exhibition section and not its bathrooms.

The things that make something admirable is not about how you look at it, but how you use it. I see no reason why it wouldn't be used as an urinal, it is built for that purpose. The fact I can't use it makes me admire it less.

This is different with classical artwork, where you have no intended use other than to look at it for Mona Lisa and other sculptures.

Of course, it could be categorized as a "sculpture", but it is a sculpture that could be used as an urinal and peeing on it doesn't make it less artistic:

Cleaning is required for every public restroom whatsoever! Even if there are morons who will just pee on the side and not the way you are expected to pee, even janitors could do the restoration works necessary to keep this piece artistic and useful.

The only problem is that this is a urinal. However, on that gender-neutral bathrooms exist, this would be something.  Oh, you can't use it? Great, is it an urinal anymore? It certainly could be used as one, just not here. No matter what, this artpiece could be given a useful purpose and yet it is locked behind glass bars. I don't like that. I want it to be placed in bathrooms, where everyone can not only see it, but use it.

Artpieces have been commercialized over the past century. Bugatti make art that are cars, and you wouldn't just not drive it because it is intended to be driven.

The same. The fountain urinal is intended to be urinated on, and not to be locked behind glass. Unleash its full potentials.  Change my mind.

@Wylted

They got away with it cause of Mail In Ballots

and RINOS stationed across the nation.

Won’t be happening in 2024

@oromagi

That really has nothing to do with why jews hate freedom. Please respond to the argument instead of using character attacks

PORTER TOWNSHIP, Ohio (WCMH) — A Porter Township trustee has admitted to voting twice — once as himself and once as his deceased father — in last November’s election.

According to a plea agreement, Edward D. Snodgrass is scheduled to enter a guilty plea next month to a charge of Falsification, for which he will spend three days in county jail and pay a $500 fine and court costs.

Snodgrass, a Republican, admitted to signing his father’s name, H. Edward Snodgrass, to his absentee ballot and sending it in, then later voting himself.

Snodgrass told NBC News that he made an error while trying to take care of his dying father, who he said requested the ballot, saying his father was suffering from advanced Parkinson’s disease and a broken arm at the time the ballot arrived. He added he had already been “signing for him.”

“It was there with a pile of other paperwork,” Snodgrass told NBC News. “I was sleep-deprived and not thinking clearly. But I’m not going to run away from it.”

He added he was trying to “execute a dying man’s wishes.”

Snodgrass was initially charged with Illegal Voting.

As of Tuesday, June 22, Snodgrass’ name remains listed on the Porter Township website as a township trustee.

CRIPPLE CREEK • Jan Wilson of Woodland Park was found guilty in Teller County Combined Court Wednesday of voting twice in the April primary election.

In the State of Colorado vs. Janis M. Cummer, Teller County Clerk & Recorder Krystal Brown cited Wilson with the misdemeanor offense in May after discovering that she had submitted two ballots. Wilson was arraigned in July and the case went to court Feb. 10.

Wilson, 74, also known by her married name of Janis Cummer, was cited with the misdemeanor offense in May after Teller County Clerk & Recorder Krystal Brown discovered she had submitted two ballots. She pleaded not guilty in July, records show.

During a one-day bench trial Feb. 10 in Cripple Creek, Teller County Court Judge Theresa Kilgore found Wilson guilty of voting twice and fined her $500 plus court costs.

In Colorado’s all-mail ballot election, Wilson received a first ballot but then changed her party affiliation and received a second ballot. “She voted twice, and turned them both in,” Brown said, in a report to the Teller County Board of Commissioners at its Feb. 11 meeting. “The woman felt she had done nothing wrong, that it was a mistake to turn in two ballots.”

Brown caught the double vote the night of the election. “The Duo machine captures the signatures,” Brown said, adding that she halted the vote count to correct the error. “It was time-consuming for the staff.”

In her report, Brown highlighted the divisive nature of the 2020 election. “I think it’s important to talk about this in this place and time,” she said. “We don’t take this lightly, just so everyone knows. Last year the vote was extremely important so we want to make sure people vote only once.”

After the meeting, Brown said she felt the law should be stronger when it comes to handing out fines, or other repercussions such as voter fraud.

Teller County uses the Dominion Voting Systems, which have been targeted by some supporters of former President Donald Trump in his claims of voter fraud around the nation.

Since the election of Joe Biden to the presidency in November, Trump’s supporters, including Republican politicians, have questioned the results, claiming Dominion Voting Systems were fraudulent.

“We used Dominion machines in 2016 when Trump won,” Brown said, implying that there were no questions about the results at the time. “It’s sad.”

Since the November election, Dominion has sued Trump’s lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, seeking $1.3 billion in damages due to his false claims of voter fraud.

In the case in Teller County, Wilson is a Woodland Park citizen who serves a member of the Downtown Development Authority and Keep Woodland Park Beautiful. She is well-known for her volunteer work around the city.

“The case is ridiculous,” Wilson told The Courier. “You can’t vote two ballots because the second one doesn’t count. It was just a mistake.”

Wilson acknowledges that she did change her party affiliation. “I did it for one reason, so I could support Erik (Stone) and Dan (Williams) for county commissioner,” she said, referring to the Republican candidates for Teller County commissioner, who each won a seat on the board. “It was a mistake to submit two ballots, and I didn’t even give it a thought.”

Wilson added, “If they want to make a big deal out of it, OK,” she said of her conviction.

Wilson was not represented by an attorney and said she does not plan to appeal the judgement.

“Do you think I’m going to pay an attorney $5,000 for a mistake?” she said.

Jonathan Meade West, Sr., of Hayes, was charged with a felony for attempting to cast two ballots in the 2020 general election. West first voted absentee at the Gloucester County Voter Register's office. He then returned four days later and tried to cast a second ballot. He was stopped from casting a second ballot when the election worker checked his information using a back-up to the VERIS (Virginia Election Registration Information System) system since it was not working that day. He was convicted of an amended misdemeanor charge of obtaining services under false pretense after attempting to vote twice. West, a self-described "unabashed conservative," was sentenced to a suspended sentence of 12 months, fined $500, and ordered to pay $96 in court costs.

Democrats have stated that there is no way any inaccuracies in the election happened.

Yet it is open knowledge Fulton county establishment double counted Biden votes.

Digital ballot images made public under Georgia’s new voting law show nearly 200 ballots — including one for West — that election officials initially scanned two times last fall before a recount. There’s no indication any vote for president was counted more than once in official results.

The discovery of identical ballots provides evidence to back up allegations of problems in the presidential election, but on a relatively small scale that had no bearing on the final certified count.  A group of voters seeking to prove the election was fraudulent say double-counting is just the beginning of what they hope to find.

Supporters of Republican Donald Trump have been searching for signs of fraud since his 12,000-vote loss to Democrat Joe Biden in Georgia. But two recounts confirmed Biden’s victory, and the courts have rejected lawsuits that sought to overturn the results.

Double-counted ballots were discovered by voters suing Fulton in an effort to persuade a judge to allow them to conduct an in-depth inspection of 147,000 absentee ballots. The judge ruled against the plaintiffs last month, but the case survived with new claims filed against the county’s five election board members.

“If we’re finding this in Fulton County, we’re probably going to find it throughout the state. The question is, why did it happen?” said David Cross, an investment manager working with the plaintiffs. “The simple fact that it happened and we found it here means that it probably occurred elsewhere.”

Election observers and organizations say it’s unlikely that double-counting occurred often or in large numbers.

The ballots counted twice would have given Biden 31 extra votes. After a recount, official results reflected that Trump gained a total of 121 absentee votes in Fulton. Biden won the county with 73% of 524,000 votes cast.

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution also verified the duplicate ballots in ballot images obtained under the Georgia Open Records Act and posted online.

The overall number of ballots counted in Georgia generally matched the number of voters who checked in at polling places or returned absentee ballots.   Manual and machine recounts found similar totals for each candidate.

“It’s Fulton failing to follow proper election protocols again,” said Carter Jones, an independent monitor of Fulton’s elections who found sloppy practices but no fraud. “Fulton is so poor at managing the actual process that if they had actually tried to rig the election, they would have bungled it and we would have found out.”

Jones said it’s possible that an election worker lost track of which absentee ballots had already been scanned in the initial count and then ran them through the machine again.

Jones, hired by the State Election Board to observe Fulton’s elections after last year’s primary, recommended that the county change absentee ballot processing during the recount and runoff, boxing up absentee ballots for storage as soon as they were scanned. The county followed his advice, reducing the chance that ballots would be counted twice.

The most obvious example of duplicates in the initial count occurred in a batch of 99 ballots first scanned the morning of Oct. 28, then scanned again about an hour later, with the second batch tallied in exact reverse order from the first. Those batches had 58 votes for Biden, 39 for Trump, one for Libertarian Jo Jorgensen and one for West.

Part or all of another batch of 98 ballots appeared to be scanned a second time within minutes on election night. Biden received 55 votes in the first of those batches and 56 in the second batch. Many of the ballots appeared to be identical.

“It’s something that should never happen,” said Mark Lindeman, acting co-director for Verified Voting, an election integrity organization focused on voting technology. “I’m not trying to make excuses for a blunder, but under really difficult circumstances, people do things that are inexplicable, and that seems to be the case here.”

Lindeman said he couldn’t recall another example of ballots being scanned twice anywhere in the country. He suggested stronger ballot tracking practices, with ballots divided into batches with unique identifying labels and cover sheets. Some jurisdictions imprint serial numbers on absentee ballots as they’re scanned for use during audits.

Fulton election officials declined to comment while the court case seeking a ballot inspection is pending.

County Commission Chairman Robb Pitts said allegations of widespread fraud are based on the “big lie” that the presidential election was illegitimate.

“Allegations of intentional wrongdoing or fraud remain untrue and baseless,” Pitts said. “The big lie is a dangerous conspiracy theory falsely claiming that tens of thousands of votes in Fulton County — and millions nationwide — were fraudulent, not that there’s the possibility of small-scale human error.”

The secretary of state’s office has been investigating Fulton’s elections management and could eventually bring a case for consideration before the State Election Board, which has the power to issue fines or refer allegations to the attorney general’s office.

Georgia’s voting law, Senate Bill 202, also gives the state board authority to replace county election boards and install an appointed administrator.

Other Georgia counties made larger vote-counting errors than Fulton’s during the initial tally.

Election workers in three counties discovered a total of more than 3,300 new votes stored on memory cards that hadn’t been loaded into election computers. A different issue in Floyd County led to 2,600 ballots going unscanned. Those ballots were included in the recount and in Georgia’s official certified results.

What’s next

Election skeptics plan to continue scrutinizing ballot images outside of court, looking for irregularities in Fulton County and other jurisdictions where a majority of voters supported Joe Biden. They’ll also continue pressing their case in court in an attempt to obtain higher-resolution images and an in-person inspection.

Attorneys for Fulton have said the case is meritless and will ask for its dismissal.

Also show me the evidence the photos of politicians cowering is fake. 

@oromagi

I claimed there were old people obeying partitions within the group.  Please point me to where that was refuted

I'm old enough to remember when Reagan would argue that Feds and States should butt out of education and let local school boards, teachers, and parents determine how best to teach students.  I didn't agree with Reagan then and don't now but can't help but note how this old Republican principle, like all other Republican principles, has been cast aside for just another demagogue.

FORT MYERS, Fla. – Dozens of people supporting anti-government protests in Cuba took control of Interstate 75 in Southwest Florida Tuesday night. Florida Highway Patrol had to divert traffic off of the interstate for nearly an hour, but no one was arrested or cited despite Governor Desantis’ new “anti-riot” law.

The law states that if people “willfully obstruct the free, convenient, and normal use of a public street, highway or road” they can be cited for a traffic violation or arrested.

“Just think about it…you’re driving home from work and all of a sudden you have people out there shutting down a highway,” said Desantis in a Tuesday afternoon speech. “We worked hard to make sure that didn’t happen in Florida. If they start to do that there needs to be swift penalties and that’s something that just cannot happen.”

Just minutes later that did happen. Protesters in Miami shut down a freeway there for hours Tuesday evening before the same thing happened near Fort Myers.

Governor Desantis has been an advocate for the anti-government protesters in Cuba since they began. Voting records indicate that many Cuban Americans in Florida did indeed vote for him which is leading some to question whether law enforcement and lawmakers may be going soft on the recent demonstrations for political reasons.

@oromagi

Wow you guys are brainwashed. You think politicians were literal threats to the elderly people who I saw videos of literally obeying the capital partitions and forming lines while taking the same tourist like photos of capital displays.   I wish I can share photos here so you can see the senior citizen qtards obeying partitions which bbn politicians who send people off to war,cowered. 

@oromagi

You skipped a lot of my direct questions but I think I have some sense of your subject now- a kind of utopian global anarchy.  Are you promoting a specific ism or just keeping it super vague?

Libertarianism

in what way?

I have in mind concepts like "meritocracy" or "general intelligence"....

Unity seems to be the trick and I agree that borders and militaries are obstacles to that unity but I don't buy that societies survive long or well without some government. 

It seems that your main contention

is that I do not directly identify these tendencies toward unification with classical liberal texts. In fact, the classical liberal position was much more ambivalent - it is characterised essentially by a kind of hypocrisy, in the sense of a tension between its implicit and its explicit tenets.

"In the United States, libertarian was popularized by the individualist anarchist Benjamin Tucker around the late 1870s and early 1880s.  Libertarianism as a synonym for liberalism was popularized in May 1955 by writer Dean Russell, a colleague of Leonard Read and a classical liberal himself. Russell justified the choice of the term as follows:

Many of us call ourselves "liberals." And it is true that the word "liberal" once described persons who respected the individual and feared the use of mass compulsions. But the leftists have now corrupted that once-proud term to identify themselves and their program of more government ownership of property and more controls over persons. As a result, those of us who believe in freedom must explain that when we call ourselves liberals, we mean liberals in the uncorrupted classical sense. At best, this is awkward and subject to misunderstanding. Here is a suggestion: Let those of us who love liberty trade-mark and reserve for our own use the good and honorable word "libertarian."

Subsequently, a growing number of Americans with classical liberal beliefs began to describe themselves as libertarians. One person responsible for popularizing the term libertarian in this sense was Murray Rothbard, who started publishing libertarian works in the 1960s.  Rothbard described this modern use of the words overtly as a "capture" from his enemies, writing that "for the first time in my memory, we, 'our side,' had captured a crucial word from the enemy. 'Libertarians' had long been simply a polite word for left-wing anarchists, that is for anti-private property anarchists, either of the communist or syndicalist variety. But now we had taken it over".

In the 1970s, Robert Nozick was responsible for popularizing this usage of the term in academic and philosophical circles outside the United States, especially with the publication of Anarchy, State, and Utopia (1974), a response to social liberal John Rawls's A Theory of Justice (1971).  In the book, Nozick proposed a minimal state on the grounds that it was an inevitable phenomenon which could arise without violating individual rights."

My main contention is that nationality and ethnicity are closely intertwined concepts, and that is what I mean by the fact that the idea of a nation-state built on a foundation of universality and blindness to race, is contradictory and abstract.

"Many articles in [Ron Paul's} newsletters contained statements that were criticized as racist or homophobic. These statements include, "Given the inefficiencies of what DC laughingly calls the criminal justice system, I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal."  An October 1992 article said, "even in my little town of Lake Jackson, Texas, I've urged everyone in my family to know how to use a gun in self defense... for the animals are coming."  Another newsletter suggested that black activists who wanted to rename New York City in honor of Martin Luther King Jr. should instead rename it "Welfaria," "Zooville," "Rapetown," "Dirtburg," or "Lazyopolis."  An article titled "The Pink House" said "I miss the closet. Homosexuals, not to speak of the rest of society, were far better off when social pressure forced them to hide their activities."  Another newsletter asserted that HIV-positive homosexuals "enjoy the pity and attention that comes with being sick" and approved of the slogan "Sodomy=Death."

A number of the newsletters criticized civil rights movement activist Martin Luther King Jr., calling him a pedophile and "lying socialist satyr".  These articles told readers that Paul had voted against the Martin Luther King Jr. Day federal public holiday, saying "Boy, it sure burns me to have a national holiday for that pro-communist philanderer, Martin Luther King. I voted against this outrage time and time again as a Congressman. What an infamy that Ronald Reagan approved it! We can thank him for our annual Hate Whitey Day."

10,000 characters is 3 pages.  We have learned the hard way that 3 pages is generally too much to expect Republicans to handle but Democrats happily consume 3 pages worth of information many times each day.  This is also why we use big words around Republicans.

Big words are all fun and games until you don’t have enough food

People with the intellect to handle 3 pages worth of information know I've already answered this question in this forum.

People that have no life or are self-centered narcissists use 3 pages to answer a question that has a 2 or 3 word answer lol

-->@oromagi

Competence precedes the nation-state necessarily.  Merit precedes the nation-state necessarily.  There were  noble kings and competent generals long before the Treaty of Westphalia.

Nobles or generals may have been seen as superior, or even had certain training as part of their position, but this is different from the modern concept of competence.

The Declaration of Independence asserts that nations may be formed artificially- that all government really just exists  by the consent of the governed and that dissatisfied people may dissolve all prior allegiance to kings and countries and choose instead to pledge our lives, honor, and fortunes to one another.

Regardless of what is asserted in liberal documents, any arbitrary mass of people today cannot simply dissolve and form new countries or nations at will, by force of assertion.  On what territory would they do so, and by whose authority?

These documents and the American people's expansive allegiance to all comers so inclined

Are you implying that the US has open borders?

Do you think babbit was a legitimate threat to those politicians?

Honestly nobody was.

It was boomer q tards who honestly would have just shouted at them.

You know politicians used to actually just talk to people instead of retardedly putting on masks and cowering at upset crowds of largely law abiding citizens.

The moral of the story is that Police suck unless they are protecting elite oligarchs in DC. Then and ONLY then they are not systemic racist murderers.

 why are the Feds covering up his name.

 No one has the time nor wants to take the effort to read 10,000 character posts.

Once again, what was the name of the officer who shot Ashli Babitt and why are the Feds covering up his name.