zedvictor4

Well.

That's all the same old argument, that achieves no conclusion.

And I thought that we were discussing a philosophical  argument.....An argument that I as a non-traditional theist, find neither morally relevant nor devastating.

And the Bible isn't steeped in folklore and myth?........That's not the way I see it.

A. Sneeze yep.

B. 

1. The clock might have been slow.

2. Scientology...Ask Hubbard.

3. Scalp whorls.....Why do birds fly?

C. Yes....Because necessities are variously constructed.

D.

1. Who knows?

2. Maybe for some...But definitively , no.

3. I would suggest that the possibilities of Space are a constant.

Perceiving and recognising differences is what everyone does.....In that sense we are all judgemental of each other.

Whether we behave with care and respect towards others or not, is a totally different issue.....In this sense I attempt to respond to all people equally.

As I see it, the term racist is a contradiction..... Whereby both sides of the perceived line are as guilty as each other, of highlighting and perpetuating bias based on perceived differences.

In the U.K we have moved on considerably in the last 200 years.....Perhaps the same cannot be said for other parts of the World.

Charles Darwin R.I.P.

@SupaDupa.

Anyone  from anywhere can be an expert on Ancient Greek society (Generally regarded as historians).....Being of Greek origin or in fact Greek doesn't necessarily make one an expert.

And we can all troll through data and come up with information and temporarily be pseudo experts on any subject.

What did the Greeks ever do for us.......Quite a lot.....As did the Egyptians, as did the Arabians as did the Romans etc.etc.....And here we are.

And if you defund the Police, what are you going to replace it with.....Martial Law I suppose.....Certainly as an interim measure.

Similar people, different uniforms.

@SupaDupa.

Always amuses me how so many people derive so much entertainment from other people playing ball games.

Why not play your own games......It's better for you (improves health and fitness and reduces stress) and is ultimately more fun....And probably cheaper in the long run.

Each to their own I suppose.

@RatMan.

Yes.....That is certainly the case.

Spirituality:

A physiological response to an external stimulus, or to an internally generated data sequence (Thought).

Religions:

Controlling cultural systems, loosely developed on the basis of providing answers to the unanswerable......To which we may or may not respond spirituality. (see above)

Whether any of this is necessary, is a multi-faceted question.

Though one might  suggest that, evolutionary certainty, dictates that everything is necessary.

@RatMan

Culture evolves.

Culture isn't static.

Interesting how you both view culture and cultural adaptation, as a religious issue........ Rather than issues of culture and cultural adaptation, including religion.

GODS are like Bigfoot or Yeti or Nessie etc....Loads of people have supposedly seen these mythical creatures, but none of them, as actually provided unequivocal evidence.

OA's Start a a point of uncertainty and "logically" arrive at a point of  assumed certainty.

A perhaps?.....Ahh... B so C so D so E so F so A.

Though there never was a real  A in the first place...... A is only ever G......G  is for gobbledygook.

No actual proof of A.... So B so C so D so E so F so Gobbledygook....This is logical.

Yep.

Data output relative to a conditioned state of mind.

You might not be wrong there.

And soon comes sooner than you first expected.

And when you're 60 you will be regaling  kids with tales of the Big Texan Freeze of 2021, and they will gaze at you in wonderment and disbelief.

An in wilderness, Tales From Arabia inter-club meeting...A bit like a Scout Jamboree as it were.

And a bit of how's your father however you fancy it, and a bit of form filling, and chanting and singing and dancing and getting drunk and bit more how's your father if you're not too bladdered.

And wake up with a sore head....Look at the drooling mess lay next to you...And feel slightly anxious.

And once you've recovered sufficiently, that instinctive urge kicks in again and it's more how's your father, any which way you fancy, followed by post coital anxiety and indifference.....And so on.

And get a puppy, or adopt if you're financially secure enough.

And the Tales from Arabia inter-club jamboree was in the wilderness, where ever that might have been.

What it is to be human.

Maybe hunter gathering was actually more fulfilling. 

What are "Religious People"?

How do they actually differ from people, apart from slight variations in data processing and output.

OCD is a mental health issue, and shouldn't be confused with general interest.

Events can be measured.

TIME is just the possibility.

Similarly, distance and volume can be measured

And SPACE is just the possibility

Only intelligent observers need to measure stuff.

The possibilities of TIME and SPACE are eternal.

Tales from Arabia.

Which the OA/OA's may or may not have pre or post dated.....Logical reasoning began?..... Who actually knows when?

Not sure of your point.

Though logical reasoning is only really logical if it is based  upon a sound premise.

And neither "The OA" nor Tales From Arabia can actually be shown to be based upon a sound premise.....An actual, specific, identifiable GOD, that actually spoke to someone.

The necessary structure of a syllogism.

A. B. therefore C.....Not  if A. then B.

And a syllogism is it's own necessity, which isn't necessarily necessary.....If necessary at all.

In your opinion.

And experts tell you how to spend money.....And  they expect a lot in return..... And never have to foot the bill themselves.

And 60 years ago when I was a kid, there was no central heating, Ice on the insides of the windows in the morning and an outside privvy.....And we survived just fine.

These days it seems like the molly-coddled even need someone to wipe their backsides for them.

Needs a bit of grammatic adjustment, improvement or simplifying,  to make it comprehensible.

A.F.S.F.S.M. is not particularly catchy....And also doesn't make a lot of sense.

Boomer...No post boomer, a 60's inbetweener, and British.

And Sr Seuss isn't big news over hear...In fact, not news at all.

And investors in a competitive market, whether that be public or private, will weigh cost against benefit.

And the risk from extreme weather events in Texas, was probably not regarded as significant enough to warrant the cost of future weather proofing power supplies.

One could also rightly argue,  that peoples indifference and unpreparedness for extreme weather events, raises a different social question.....The reliance on a Nanny State and the inability to think for oneself....After all what effort does it take to have suitable clothing and a few extra food supplies in for the Winter.

I would certainly survive quite well if the power was down for a few days...And probably quite enjoy the experience.

I could certainly manage without the TV and internet and mobile signal.

@Theweakeredge

Thank goodness for the Chinese then.

Though it all depends on what one considers to be the necessity of progress.

Nonetheless, religion certainly is one factor that impedes co-operation.

One factor of perceived difference relative to the culture of ancestry and perpetuated data.....Always living for the past, as it were....And disregarding the demands of the future.

And so the Chinese cometh.

Is Amazon the only retail outlet in the US?

I'm in the UK and never buy through Amazon.

Nonetheless Amazon is able to make up it's own rules of competition, and suppliers are free to supply who the wish to supply....Ergo free market.

And most folk will grab the best deal, irrespective of politics. 

And other really good  reading books are available. 

Suess is obviously bang on trend....That's the second Seuss quote I've responded to this morning.

What is it that's troubling you?

I display patterns of behaviour defined by inheritance, conditioning and social pressure..... Same as you, St 3RU7AL

And morals are a variable construct, to be found therein.

And if my neighbour collapses from starvation, I will be sympathetic....Though, if my neighbour collapses from starvation, whilst chatting on their mobile and smoking a cigarette, I will still call for an ambulance, but would be less sympathetic.

Having said that though....The welfare system in the UK is such that no one should starve....Maybe the US is less sympathetic.

To paraphrase Charles Dickens:

Income $500 expenditure $499, result happiness. Income $500 expenditure $501, result misery.

#75.

Well stated.

Well, you generally agreed with me.

And I will agree with you about conversation.

And Texas was without power because of the extreme weather....Funny how you didn't mention that.

And the Dr Suess, Pepe le Pew reference, just didn't work for me.....It's an age thing I suppose.

What does that mean Doc?

You should emigrate to Russia Doc.......You would love it there.

What Amazon will and will not sell is up to Amazon...And as such is Free Market Capitalism.

If one wishes to buy or sell "conservative" products, then one should go to an appropriate market place.

But no doubt it will be cost rather than politics that determines most peoples choices.

Unfortunately yes.

I don't bother with movies much.

In fact, I can't remember the last movie I watched.

Europeans. LOL.

And this is just another typical forum, where the conversation soon ended and the contentions began.

And Janesix is correct...Societies are naturally hierarchical.

Though the distribution of wealth does not necessarily match expectancy as it used to.

And Janesix is also correct when she says that despite hardship people tend not to go without unnecessary necessities.

And we are a selectively moral species, and will happily discuss the needy with reverence.

But how many of us will sleep uneasily tonight worrying about the poor person next door working for a minimum wage.

How intellect manifests in a hierarchical religious society is key to the issue.

What may or may not have been preached in the pulpit to the illiterate masses, was defined by intellect.

Servitude and obedience was the objective, and God was the controlling ideology.

I wasn't suggesting that the illiterate flock, studied their OA pamphlets at bedtime, as a change to not reading their bibles.

It's  currently PC spot on trendy.

And will be whilst it remains an asset.

Just be content in the knowledge that actually, no one is white and no one is black.

Bashing the past and blaming the present is what some people take pleasure in doing.

The majority of people just don't have the time to worry about such things.

Inferiority and superiority dictate hierarchy, and hierarchy dictates society.

I have a reasonable level of intellect, but it's fair to say that there will be others with a superior level of intellect, and also others with an inferior level of intellect.

The same could also be applied to, every other comparison that is there to be made.....Strength, height, speed, vision etc.

People are just not born equal ,or develop equally.....it's foolish to think otherwise.

To be honest.

Shamans and Faith healers were and are nothing new.

It's not surprising that they get a mention in Tales from Arabia.

@Ratman

Arbitrary and debateable.

Though ontologics are undoubtedly, possibilities based upon gobbledygook.

For example:   Blah de blah de blah....Therefore GOD.

Or:     Blah de blah de blah de Disney....Therefore GOD and Satan.

I would suggest that we probably all do that anyway.

Though if my understanding of someone is different to yours, that doesn't mean that you are right and I am wrong, or vice versa.

All that this reflects, is variation in conditioning and how we consequently assess incoming data.

Inferiority is and was demonstrable.

Though, that in no way precludes social evolution.

The 1800's aren't the 2000's....Global societies have evolved significantly, since then.

if Darwin was alive today he would obviously think differently.

We sometimes seem to forget that the past was the past, and now is now.

@RatMan

For example:

And if pickled onions and mango chutney..... Does that mean that the Moon is made of cheese?

Apologies but:

Your ontologics, typically offer a possibility based on gobbledygook.

Goddess Grace's gorgeous love triangle.

Memories.

Talk about having one's pi and eating it. 

@RatMan.

Mod's used to wear parkas and ride scooters.

Things have changed.

Though a few old men still go out, high days and holidays, on their beloved Lambretta's.

Belching two-stroke.

To reclaim Brighton's seafront.

@RatMan

What you are describing is human conceptualism, and  variously attributing derived ideas thereof.

Relativity.

O.K......So, time and colour etc..... All only relative to an intelligent observer.

Exactly....As everything.

That's why I refer to it as Darwin's Bit.

And natural selection, is hung up on Darwin's Bit.

Material evolution diverged, the moment a species had it's first idea.

Alternative Intelligence Big Bro...Moving forwards, faster than an evolving human.

And the clever thing is...WE did it, without being asked.

I never said that time could be measured.

The duration of an event relative to it's participating factors, according to the determination of intelligent recorders. Is what I stated.

Time and Space are infinitely immeasurable possibilities, irrespective of a measurable event.

If nothing is possible, then nothing will occur.

We do things to pass the time... If we have time on our hands, aside form that which is necessary for the fulfilment of daily necessities.... Whatever we might decide that our daily necessities might be of course, which might be just idling about passing the time of day.

Whether how we choose to use our time is wasteful or not, is more often an arbitrary and self righteous conclusion drawn by others, with time on their hands to do so.  Others who might or might not be wasting their own time, worrying about what others might get up to, when they have time on their hands.

Such is the luxury of modern living and all it's time saving opportunities and gadgets, which gives us all this free time to sit and worry about whether or not we or others are wasting all this free time,  that we have all been afforded the luxury of.

It isn't necessary for time to move or do anything other than be a possibility....So how can it be slowed down?

Events might slow down, and/or durations increase or decrease.

The speed of light determines the speed of light.....And things that occur at slower rates can also be measured.

And we also have the possibility of 3d space, which allows for event and duration.

Rate, distance and duration are all measurable.

Speed is simply the duration of an event relative to it's participating factors. Which are variously measurable, according to the determination of the intelligent recorder.

And scientists undertake scientific study....Though scientific theory isn't necessarily sensible.

Scientists like to make science complicated.

As I've stated previously, "spacetime" is a compound word, the meaning of which, corrupts the simplicity of Space and Time.

Time and Space are....And Events occur, and have duration.

And scientists  haven't as yet understood the reason for the event possibility.

Creation and evolution is a logical procession.

And material evolution is far bigger than the Darwinian bit.

And the Darwinian bit is is being rapidly succeeded by a clearly demonstrable, technological era....And was preceded by millions of years of inorganic development.

Discussions concerning evolution have a tendency to get hung up on the Darwin bit......Or more accurately....Hung upon ourselves and our mortal fears.

Mortality is......Mortality is the inevitability of  life.

Rather than awareness......Conscious awareness of mortality or instinctive awareness of mortality.

I would agree that conscious awareness "really begins" only when we have downloaded the relevant information.

I would also suggest that instinctive awareness occurs, only shortly before death.....Circumstances were such, that I am convinced that my father instinctively knew the day before he died.....Something that is not an uncommonly recorded coincidence, in both human and other species.

Certainly not the luxury of the over-fed....Whose lofty beliefs  tend to revolve around as many calories as are feasibly possibly.

Cancelling culture, would be cultural.....As would questioning the cancellation of culture.....As would something new that might be thought up tomorrow.

Inherited culture is persistent stuff that was thought up yesterday....Stuff that our predecessors don't want us to forget....So we get perpetually reminded of it.