How to explain real Christianity, to non-belivers.

Author: YouFound_Lxam

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#211
zedvictor4
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@Sidewalker
And the above post #210 isn't loaded with what you might refer to as trolling?



Nonetheless, learned  points of view that might not agree with your point of view, are exactly what the are and also inevitable.

And for sure, an indeterminate topic such as modern religious ideology, is going to be loaded with satire and logical criticism.

And satire and logical criticism will undoubtedly seem like trolling to the religiously conditioned.

Such is the nature of data transfer and conditioning, and the variability of available human knowledge.


So consequently from my point of view. An accusation of trolling, especially within a religious context, is the epitome of a strawman argument.


None of which alters the fact that Bro D and Stephen have a greater knowledge of biblical scripture than most people on this site.

Which is sort of ironic, is it not?
#212
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@zedvictor4
You aint a troll to me.

Your.
Well. 
Your like a praher ( that )  takes me there 
I mean its more like. 
Your like a dream to me.  
Yeah . 

No but. 
Driving down the road 30 mins ago and heard that song on the radio 
Its in my head man.

Good day Sir.
#213
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@Deb-8-a-bull
Always good to hear from you Deb.

Drive carefully,

Enjoy the music.
#214
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@Sidewalker
And they all sit and wonder why the site doesn't grow. The white male atheist here basically admit that they're just here to troll and they make the site miserable for every single person that post here. Except the other white male atheist who think they're just hysterical. And I love how Google and cutting pasting the Bible makes you an expert on Bible knowledge. And at least a third of the posters here are drunks or drug addicts.
#215
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@YouFound_Lxam
He did, but stopping us from making that mistake, would be taking away our free will. 
You argument is logically incoherent: there can be no free will if god (a) planned for everything and (b) knows the outcome of every person's every decision, ever. You can't design something specifically to make errors and then get mad at them making errors. It's your design, you set up the rules, you fix it. 

No, he could but it would contradict his own teachings. If he was in the presence of sin, then he would not be pure, sinless, or omnipotent. 
This makes sin more powerful than god, is that what you believe? It's kinda like god's kryptonite?
#216
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@YouFound_Lxam
But something must have left because otherwise, you would be alive. 

So what do you believe to have left?
Scientists are still studying what most people would call your soul. Something beyond your brain.

Nice. Now can you answer the question. It's above in bold & underlined , in case you missed it.


What most people call your soul

What do scientist call it?...



#217
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@The Witch

-->@Sidewalker
And they all sit and wonder why the site doesn't grow. 


That will because the likes of you are fixated on "flying & fucking".<<, your own words, Witch.#48


And telling us that:
Witch wrote: And at least a third of the posters here are drunks or drug addicts.

While also saying:

Witch wrote: Christians are paranoid psychos #31

Yes, You leave plenty of "room for growth" there, haven't  you Witch?


Witch wrote: The only one in the Bible raising the dead is Jesus, dumb fuck.#42

Nope. There were others. Stop wasting your time on Christian scripture and stick to what you are supposed to know about but are afraid to discuss. Or try to learn and adhere to those  Reiki Attunement principles that you are  proud of.

The Polly-Witches course in Reiki Attunement., 🤣
Polytheist-Witch's 5 Reiki Principles For Increasing Ease And Rhythm In Your Life

"WOO" indeed.🤣
#218
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 And at least a third of the posters here are drunks or drug addicts.
Poly, quit attacking Trump voters. Did you know  that Albert Einstein was a founding member of the German Democratic Party?
#219
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Don't forget the mention you like to imagine my kids with brooms between their legs.
#220
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@zedvictor4
And the above post #210 isn't loaded with what you might refer to as trolling?
No, I’d refer to it as a dialog, I responded to your post.

Nonetheless, learned  points of view that might not agree with your point of view, are exactly what the are and also inevitable.
No shit, and if this was a debate site there would be discussions and debates.

And for sure, an indeterminate topic such as modern religious ideology, is going to be loaded with satire and logical criticism.
Yes, especially when Fundamentalist Atheists are threatened by Theism as a competing faith.

And satire and logical criticism will undoubtedly seem like trolling to the religiously conditioned.
Nope, it seems like a religiously conditioned response to Theism, evangelical Atheists are religiously conditioned to defend their religion from what they see as a competing faith.  Most are “acting out”, there is some religious person in their life they are afraid to talk to, so they do it here, that’s why they never get tired of it, they can scream at some proxy for the person they are afraid of every day, but it’s never going to be enough, because it’s never going to be the person they are angry with.  I said that to Steven once and he immediately blocked me, I guess it was just too close to home LOL.

Such is the nature of data transfer and conditioning, and the variability of available human knowledge.
Such is the nature of the troll site.

So consequently from my point of view. An accusation of trolling, especially within a religious context, is the epitome of a strawman argument.
LOL, yep, racists say it racist to call them racist, and trolls say it’s a strawman argument to call them trolls.   The deeply philosophical argument of "I'm rubber and you're glue", that is quite the logical argument LOL.

None of which alters the fact that Bro D and Stephen have a greater knowledge of biblical scripture than most people on this site.

Which is sort of ironic, is it not?
LOL, yeah, I suppose Google Scholarship looks like knowledge to the uninformed, and yes, it is ironic.  And there you go, you accidently answered my question as to what is so fulfilling about trolling, so it’s a matter of “pride” among fellow trolls, interesting.  Still seems pretty empty to me, but hey, if that’s all you got and it’s what floats your boat, then good for them, at least they have something.  

#221
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@Polytheist-Witch
And they all sit and wonder why the site doesn't grow.
Yeah, Wylted trolled the election and won LOL, he said he would increase membership and apparently, they voted for him to go find more trolls. 

The white male atheist here basically admit that they're just here to troll and they make the site miserable for every single person that post here. Except the other white male atheist who think they're just hysterical.
They don’t just think they are funny, they also think they are smart. As children they saw the Bible as a story book about an invisible man in the sky that grants wishes to those who pray.  As most children age and mature their conception of God and their understanding of faith develops and matures beyond such childish ways of understanding things, but these guys did not mature as they got older, and they feel they are really smart to not believe in the invisible man in the sky.  That’s why they are always ranting about how much more intelligent, rational, and mature they are than people of faith, it’s why these grade school intellectuals are so obsessed with comparing theism to Santa Clause, the Easter Bunny, and unicorns, they think that’s deep LOL.  They aren’t mature enough to understand that no adult Theist believes in the God they don’t believe in, and yet, they really seem thrilled with themselves for their deep intellectual achievement.   As you said, they think they are hysterical, and in fact, that’s what everyone else thinks too, everyone else is laughing at them.

And I love how Google and cutting pasting the Bible makes you an expert on Bible knowledge.
That’s the case with all Google scholarship, no matter what the subject, the ease of looking something up has dumbed us down. They think they are smart because they can Google facts, but it’s not knowledge and they don’t understand the facts they have found; they don’t have a clue how the facts might fit together, and they remain ignorant about the subject. 

And at least a third of the posters here are drunks or drug addicts.
Been there, done that, when my first wife died I gave it a try for a couple years, wasn't fun, didn't see much future in it, so I gave it up.
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#222
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@ludofl3x
You argument is logically incoherent: there can be no free will if god (a) planned for everything and (b) knows the outcome of every person's every decision, ever. You can't design something specifically to make errors and then get mad at them making errors. It's your design, you set up the rules, you fix it. 
Your looking at it the wrong way.

God made us. He made us with free will. So we have free will to either follow, or run away from God. 
The bible even says time works differently here than in heaven, so you can't make a logical distinction from that.
The bible uses this as a reference that God made time, therefore has control of time, and knows the whole past present and the future. 

God doesn't get mad at us for making errors, he is upset with us, when we don't have full faith in him. Him, knowing what we are going to do, doesn't logically contradict us having free will. He knows what mistakes we will make, but those mistakes, we made. 

He didn't design us to sin. He designed us to be with him, but to have free will. Adam and Eve caused that sin to enter the world, so it wasn't by his own design that we sin. 


This makes sin more powerful than god, is that what you believe? It's kinda like god's kryptonite?
When you have good, there has to be evil as well. Otherwise everything is either perfect, or the opposite.

God is perfect, with no sin in his presence. If sin were to enter into his presence he wouldn't be a perfect God anymore now would he?
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#223
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@Stephen
So what do you believe to have left?
Your soul. What makes you, you. 

What do scientist call it?...
Again, science is still trying to do tests, on what makes you, you, and how that connects to your physical body. Of course they probably won't ever get any results from it, because it is something supernatural, and does not follow the laws of science. 
#224
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@YouFound_Lxam
So what do you believe to have left?
Your soul. What makes you, you. 
And you have evidence for what Christians call the "soul" actually existing while scientists cannot even name it never mind prove its existance.


What do scientist call it?...
Again, science is still trying to do tests, on what makes you, you, and how that connects to your physical body.

So they don't call it anything at all.  I believe what make me, me, is my own genetic make up passed down from my linage. my environment and up bringing.


Of course they probably won't ever get any results from it, because it is something supernatural, and does not follow the laws of science. 

I see. Oh well. That explains it all then. But Christians know what it is and can prove it to actually exist. 

I bet I could find a scientist that has ruled out the existence of the soul completely if I tried.


#225
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@YouFound_Lxam
God made us. He made us with free will. So we have free will to either follow, or run away from God. 
He made us with free will, so he DIDN'T know who would or wouldn't follow his teachings, is that right? 

God doesn't get mad at us for making errors, he is upset with us, when we don't have full faith in him. Him, knowing what we are going to do, doesn't logically contradict us having free will. He knows what mistakes we will make, but those mistakes, we made. 
So then he has no plan for each person, right?
#226
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@Sidewalker
If google repeats the bible verbatim, then it's as valid an information source as the bible itself.

And it's understandable that a theist should be irked by an atheists greater knowledge of the bible.

And let's be honest, anyone with good reading skills and comprehension can easily acquire an in depth knowledge of biblical scripture.

After all the bible is just a collection of Middle Eastern folk tales, and not rocket science.
#227
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Definition of a Bible scholar for an atheist: an atheist who can cut and paste Bible verses. LOL
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#228
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@Stephen
And you have evidence for what Christians call the "soul" actually existing while scientists cannot even name it never mind prove its existance.
Only evidence we have of a so-called soul, is that there is something in us, that holds moral values, and our personality's, that isn't connected to our physical body. The rest is just faith. 
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#229
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@ludofl3x
He made us with free will, so he DIDN'T know who would or wouldn't follow his teachings, is that right? 
He did. You're still misunderstanding. 

He knew what we would do before he even created us. But what do you want God to do about that? Stop us from sinning? That would just be taking away our free will. 

So then he has no plan for each person, right?
He has a plan for each person, doesn't mean we have to follow that plan though. Following God and having faith in him will lead you to places you can't even imagine, but that doesn't mean that God is forcing everyone to follow his plan for them. 

#230
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@YouFound_Lxam
He knew what we would do before he even created us. But what do you want God to do about that? Stop us from sinning? That would just be taking away our free will. 
Ok, so he knew, while creating us, that we would sin. Did he also know it would make him mad? More importantly, could we have been created without sin as a possibility, do you think? Or was that beyond god's power? Does god know SPECIFICALLY what sins you'd commit before you're born? 

I don't want god to do anything, I don't believe in god. I'm trying to understand how you make sense of any of this, mister "I can explain Christianity to the non believer!" 

He has a plan for each person, doesn't mean we have to follow that plan though. 
So if his plan doesn't include me departing from his plan, then he doesn't know everything, right?
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#231
YouFound_Lxam
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@ludofl3x
Ok, so he knew, while creating us, that we would sin. Did he also know it would make him mad? More importantly, could we have been created without sin as a possibility, do you think? Or was that beyond god's power? Does god know SPECIFICALLY what sins you'd commit before you're born? 
This question is boxing God into a human mind. 
God is not human, he created humans, so God knew that humans would disobey him.

He couldn't have created us without sin, because then we wouldn't have free will. 

God wanted true love. You can't have true love without that person willingly loving you by their own accords. 
God could have created us in heaven, but that would have forced us to be good, because no evil exists in heaven.

God had to give us a choice between him and sin, in order for us to truly love him. So, sin was necessary. 

So if his plan doesn't include me departing from his plan, then he doesn't know everything, right?
He knows what you will do, but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have a plan for you. You can write down a strategy even after the war. 
#232
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@YouFound_Lxam
You're losing the plot, bro. 

 God knew that humans would disobey him.

He couldn't have created us without sin, because then we wouldn't have free will. 
So, he created us in the only way he could (again, here sin is more powerful than god, unless he COULD make us without sin, and chose not to...but then that makes him something else entirely). He put humans together wired in such a way that there is NO WAY for us not to fall short of his standard. It's a feature, not a bug, in other words. When they do, he manages to get mad about it. 

God wanted true love. You can't have true love without that person willingly loving you by their own accords. 
Interesting. So to you, true love comes with an "or else" component. "Love me, or it's into the torture chamber for you." That's not true love. That's just extortion. In this case, people are the victims, and god is an emotionally needy tyrant baby. 

God could have created us in heaven, but that would have forced us to be good, because no evil exists in heaven.
So if this is what he wants to begin with, to party with all mankind in heaven, why is earth (or sin) necessary, do you think? It seems like you believe god has a goal in mind. Is that fair to say?

He knows what you will do, but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have a plan for you. You can write down a strategy even after the war. 
Correct: he knows what I will do, and therefore has a plan for me to do it. If he DOESN'T know, then I can depart from his plan. If I can depart from his plan, then it isn't his plan. 


#233
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@Stephen
 bet I could find a scientist that has ruled out the existence of the soul completely if I tried.
Yes, life after death theories collapse under scientific scrutiny because the field of particle physics has "ruled out" the possibility of humans having a soul, renowned physicist Brian Cox has claimed.
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#234
YouFound_Lxam
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@ludofl3x
So, he created us in the only way he could (again, here sin is more powerful than god, unless he COULD make us without sin, and chose not to...but then that makes him something else entirely). He put humans together wired in such a way that there is NO WAY for us not to fall short of his standard. It's a feature, not a bug, in other words. When they do, he manages to get mad about it. 
God never gets mad at the people. His anger is directed at sin, that consumes the people. He is sad for us as humans, when we choose to run away from him. 

And your conflicting "his standard" with entering into the kingdom of God. His plan for us, doesn't = passage into heaven, because if that were the case, then no one would be in heaven, because no one is perfect except Jesus. 

As for sin, if you think about it intellectually, you can't have good without bad right?

If you just have good, you have the inability to choose bad, therefore, no free will.
If you just have bad, you have the inability to choose good, therefore, no free will. 

So, in order for us to choose God, you have to have the ability to sin.
In order to have free will, you have to have the ability to do bad and do good. 

Interesting. So to you, true love comes with an "or else" component. "Love me, or it's into the torture chamber for you." That's not true love. That's just extortion. In this case, people are the victims, and god is an emotionally needy tyrant baby. 
God doesn't send people to hell. We send ourselves to hell. 

So if this is what he wants to begin with, to party with all mankind in heaven, why is earth (or sin) necessary, do you think? It seems like you believe god has a goal in mind. Is that fair to say?
To separate the good from the bad. Free will. 
#235
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@Polytheist-Witch
Definition of a Bible scholar for an atheist: an atheist who can cut and paste Bible verses. LOL
And they are all literalists, deep Bible scholars that don't believe there is a bearded man in the sky LOL.

I can’t help but recall the image of a little child I saw on vacation a few years back,  he was clinging to the wall of the hotel pool with his legs kicking as fast as he could while yelling “Mommy, mommy, look at me, I’m in the deep end just like a grown up”.

They use Google, and that makes them deep and intellectual grown ups  LOL

#236
zedvictor4
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@Poly

Metaphorically speaking.

The transfer of biblical information is no more or less cutting and pasting.


The theist reads the bible and the atheist reads the bible.

The theist looks on google and the atheist looks on google.

Makes no difference who reads it, the words are all the same


And lets be honest, how many people who label as theist have ever studied or even read the bible?

Theist is just an arbitrary label relative to an assumption, and perhaps a bit of a wet head when one was a nipper.
#237
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@Sidewalker
I remember being a little kid at Sunday School.

Same old non-sense then, as it is now.

The narrative never changes.

As I just explained to our resident multi-theist, it doesn't matter who reads what, or where they read it. The words are all the same.

And just because you might have a label on your forehead which says Christian, doesn't make you any more proficient in reading or interpreting bible stories.
#238
Sidewalker
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@zedvictor4
I remember being a little kid at Sunday School.
Bible, Santa Clause, Easter Bunny, and Unicorns

Same old non-sense then, as it is now.
Yep, same old mentality

The narrative never changes.
Sure it does, now you got science and you're more logical, rational, scientific, and smarter than any Theist...woo hoo

As I just explained to our resident multi-theist, it doesn't matter who reads what, or where they read it. The words are all the same.
The literal words are literally the same but the dispositions of the readers are different, you are more rational, logical and scientific when you read the story book, Theists are irrational, illogical, and unscientific when they read the story book...woo hoo

And just because you might have a label on your forehead which says Christian, doesn't make you any more proficient in reading or interpreting bible stories.
Right, and not only that, but "Mommy Mommy, look, I'm swimming in the deep end just like a grown up".
#239
Sidewalker
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@zedvictor4
Metaphorically speaking.

The transfer of biblical information is no more or less cutting and pasting.
Yes, that's how information works now, it goes from screen to screen, much more effiecient than back in the old days when it wetook that unnecessary detour into a brain where you had to think about it, much better to take the middleman brain out and streamline the process.   That eliminates extraneous things like knowledge and understanding.

The theist reads the bible and the atheist reads the bible.
Cutting and pasting is nuetral, it doesn'r recognize labels.

The theist looks on google and the atheist looks on google.
Yes, and you find what you look for.

Makes no difference who reads it, the words are all the same
I see, so a postulate of your faith is that all people are the same, cutting and pasting knows no differences.

And
lets be honest, how many people who label as theist have ever studied or even read the bible?
I don't know, how many?

Theist is just an arbitrary label relative to an assumption, and perhaps a bit of a wet head when one was a nipper.
Yeah, but Theists still believe in the bearded man in the sky...silly Theists.
#240
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@YouFound_Lxam
God never gets mad at the people. His anger is directed at sin, that consumes the people. He is sad for us as humans, when we choose to run away from him.
Could god change this condition that makes him so sad that he tortures the people he never gets mad at?

As for sin, if you think about it intellectually, you can't have good without bad right?
Can god have good without bad?

God doesn't send people to hell. We send ourselves to hell. 
People didn't make hell, though, right? Nor did we set up the conditions that sentence people to it, right? WITHOUT believing in god, which one can I get into, heaven, or hell?

So if this is what he wants to begin with, to party with all mankind in heaven, why is earth (or sin) necessary, do you think? It seems like you believe god has a goal in mind. Is that fair to say?
To separate the good from the bad. Free will. 
Please answer this question directly: does god know if you are good or bad, on the whole, before he creates you, or is he surprised?

You keep saying "free will" but have not yet demonstrated it can exist in a universe where god knows everything, is responsible for all things, and has seen all of time. Let's look at an example: Judas Iscariot. Did he deserve what he got in the end (a grisly death and a name synonymous with treachery)?