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I buy Moozer's claim. It fits mechanically with my role, which is a day killing role - hence, Pie might have wanted a night protective role to balance it out.
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@Moozer325
I think I get what you're implying here. What name did Pie give to your role?
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@whiteflame
My guess is that Savant panicked under pressure and used his question to ask Pie for a fakeclaim. Doctor seems like a natural attempt at a fakeclaim, since it's simultaneously fairly common but also unlikely to appear in this particular theme.
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Mmm... I don't buy it. Can you link me to any info in which it is specifically mentioned that Abhimanyu helps to protect others?
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@Savant
It's going to happen sooner or later. If you're pro-town, you'll claim now so we still have a chance to switch to another player before the day ends.
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Hmmm. You know what, I think my vote is staying where it is. The Joebob vote is opportunistic as heck.
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@Lunatic
Any thoughts on Savant's behavior rn? We have 24 hours, who's your top choice for a lynch?
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I still want to get a wagon going on Savant tbh. Cmon, let's do it
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Not liking Savant's decision to push yet another inactive, Moozer, instead of engaging or posting reads.
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@Savant
Also Joebob I suppose, although I'd rather not mislynch him for the 3rd D1 running (excluding Invincible)
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@whiteflame
So it seems like anything that can be defined as "Negative" is anything that interferes with or manipulates the results of a given role. I'll need to think on whether there's some other role that exists in more of a borderline state on that, but I think I get the gist from your list of roles. Thanks for clarifying, and thanks to Pie for addressing the question through you.
Any reason for the strangely formal tone of this post?
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We have a day left. We need to push on someone. I'm willing to do anyone in my null or lean scum list. And I still want a claim from Savant by the end of the day.
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@Savant
Haven't seen your read on JoeBob yet. I could see him being anything, honestly.
Oops, I forgot about him (sorry Joebob). I read him as a loose flavor of null. His tone is townish but his fluffy style of posting is similar to Battlebots Mafia.
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@Savant
Haven't seen your read on JoeBob yet. I could see him being anything, honestly.
Oops, I forgot about him (sorry Joebob). I read him as a loose flavor of null. His tone is townish but his fluffy style of posting is similar to Battlebots Mafia.
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@whiteflame
I'd like to understand this push on Savant better.Savant was not the first person to push on inactives (that would be me). I recognize that he did it shortly after you said you scumread him, but considering that you're the only person to do it so far, I have a hard time believing that he's just trying to distract attention. I also don't agree that his role claim got him killed - he claimed Miller, so that role claim certainly isn't what killed him.I do agree with you that it's kind of odd to point out that scum isn't going to claim they align with the Kaurava's. It's especially strange because that's only a plausible theme split at the moment. That being said, I think that his statement speaks to what we know about scum having knowledge of certain characters and roles being in the game, and might use that perceived theme split to their advantage. It's a bit of WIFOM thinking, and I think he should have been more straightforward in how he phrased it. I know I used to do that all the time and it got me killed fairly often whether I was scum or town.
Pushing on inactives is fine. That being the only substantiative contribution to the game is not.
Also, his role claim did get him killed - he mentioned an additional aspect of his role but refused to clarify it, leading scum to believe he was hiding some uber-powerful late-game power.
IMO it's not pointing out the problems with themesplit itself that's the problem, it's the strange tone - almost like he was hedging his bets - as he said it, which strikes me as odd.
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I was killed for being a pawn, which was my character. (Pawns can promote.) Read the endgame and the PM you sent me during that game.
Yes, but that wouldn't have happened if you didn't claim some other mysterious aspect of your role along with Miller. Also, what about Invincible?
Maybe that's true from your experience, but from what I've seen, it seems like a random thing to scumread me for. As town, why wouldn't I point out that scum is likely to just lie if we tell everyone what we think the theme split is?
WIFOM + why would you specifically mention it?
I'd been curious about Earth's reasons for not posting for a while, and I didn't even say he was probably scum. I just said I would like to see him post more.
Pushing on inactives is inherently pointless because the only way they would respond to it is if they intended to be active anyway.
Tbh Savant's responses mostly strike me as null. My read stays for now.
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Pandava's I believe. I'm not sure how useful this is given that no one is going to say they are aligned with the Kaurava's.
Newbie scum players struggle with direct lies, so mitigating responsibility or explaining how scum would lie is pretty common. Why not just say "I'm aligned with the Pandavas"?
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Pushing on inactives in response to being lightly sussed is very scummy tbh. Also Savant is having trouble ascribing clear motives to his actions - he mentioned that he is "more reluctant to give character information given that it got me killed the first night in the last two games", but it was his role claim, not his char claim, that got him killed.
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VTL Savant
Let's get a wagon going people. I want a char claim at the very least.
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@Vader
Lawyer is negative? Interesting, looks like Pie means negative for town, not negative for the player.
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@whiteflame
Any thoughts on the above? I'm valuing early claiming more this game because the theme seems difficult to quickly research.
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Gut reads so far:
Town:
Vader (claim is a niche role that I would expect to see in a Pie game (useful but not overpowered). Also some vibes regarding him mentioning IRL circumstances. I feel as scum he would have a greater obligation to his partner to not just replace out, based on what I know of him.)
Lean town:
Barney (extremely early char claim, also 21 feels very towny ("some inevitable but undeserved town cred")
Moozer (willingness to claim in line with last time, vibes)
Slight town:
whiteflame (behavior, willingness to question claims a bit and check theme)
Lunatic (vibes)
Null:
Earth (has literally posted once)
Slight scum:
Savant (fluffposting, asked a few questions not very relevant to the game, much more passive compared to previous ones)
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It’s hard not to see this as both a reason why you’re unlikely to be NK’d and as a means to push back on any potential lynches. It’s better that you mentioned it now, though, since it doesn’t come off as an excuse to shake off a wagon, so I see why you did it.
Yeah, that's why I called it sort of a SOP claim. For what it's worth, if anyone doesn't believe me and I scumread them back, then I would be happy to create a 1v1 where they hammer me (if they really don't believe me, they shouldn't have a problem with doing so).
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tbh wasnt planning on claiming at first but i think it would look scummy as hell if i claimd it with a wagon already on me (as if i was just trying to dodge a elim) so thats why im claiming now,
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also sop claim (idk if its rly sop but checkd online and looks like it:)
supersaint. automaticly kill person who hammers me.
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@Savant
d1 lynch is always good imo. nks give no info other than flip, reads are built on day voting patterns, pushes, reactions, etc. d1 nolynch brings us into d2 a player down with minimal benefit
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24 hours and only a page and a half? I'll chalk it up to the absence of Pie, not myself. I'll start participating tonight, but for now, no more claims please.
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Hi everyone, checking in. Don't expect activity from me for a day or two.
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@ILikePie5
My activity will be extremely low until Monday night (traveling for a chess tournament). Just a heads up.
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Ig I can see the confusion here. But Austin was even more confusing when he gave you that message and then gave me something contradictory from my POV
Eh, more ambiguous than contradictory, but I can understand the confusion there.
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Also tbh I think outing how your role worked would've been the right call. There wasn't a lot of utility in hiding it for another night
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@ILikePie5
Also you couldn’t use both lawyer and framer. Only one role from each list.
He could've framed Moozer and deflected actions on himself to Earth.
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@Barney
@Vader
@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
Pinged in case of interest
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@Lunatic
Tyvm, glad you had fun too. You and Vader worked well together
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General thoughts:
Setup:
-Very swingy.
-A little bit townsided. In particular, whiteflame's role was really powerful in hindsight, and could've screwed scum over if he got a chance to use it.
-Scum technically had a counter to everything with the JOAT ability, although it didn't quite work out that way in the game.
-Didn't anticipate Pie double-RBing Lunatic. Very high-risk play of Luna to accept both times, but it worked out very well.
-I still maintain that Earth's role and the way I explained it wasn't bastard, just non-standard. That being said, I definitely did mess up in not being consistent with the level or ambiguity of information I was giving to town members who asked about it. In the future, I will try to be more consistent about my info policy.
Lynch choices:
-Joebob... yeah, sorry Joebob. Your role was pretty scummy. I honestly didn't think you would out it like that.
-Barney was a little bit hyperaggressive with the defense. That being said, he did a good enough job that he pretty much outed Luna as forcing a mislynch. Town should've picked up on how hard Luna was pushing.
-Vader was correctly lynched. Gj town on that one, although POE made it easy.
-Moozer... honestly I'm not even sure why Pie lynched him other than POE. Dude was towny af throughout. Besides, you'd have to assume that he managed to come up with a brilliant fakeclaim with town's ONLY PROTECTIVE ROLE straight off the bat. Really?
Feedback:
Vader: Solid play throughout. Your behavior was pretty townie, but your claim could use work. It was a clear outlier compared to all the others.
Lunatic: Played excellently. Choice to buddy Pie hard was risky, and I think you took it too far at some point, but ended up carrying you the game. Mathematician was a brilliant fakeclaim.
Pie: How did you not notice Luna was blatantly buddying you??? I'm not going to criticize three mislynches because there were reasons behind all of them, but Luna was making it too obvious by the end.
Joebob: Sorry. You tried with a bad roll of the dice.
Barney: Good job not giving up on defending yourself, but the way you attacked the people trying to lynch you looked scummy from an outside POV.
whiteflame: Good play, unfortunately you got NKed right before the critical moment of the game.
Earth: Nothing much to say. Good choices of targets.
Moozer: You played EXCELLENTLY for your first game, to the extent that Pie thought you had a scumbuddy helping you. Don't claim early in the future though. Your scumreads were on point.
Savant: Nothing much to say, tough luck sometimes.
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ACTIONS:
DP1:
-Earth gives cop to whiteflame
-Pie requests donation from Lunatic
-Joebob lynched
NP1:
-Lunatic donates to Pie (forfeits night actions)
-Vader NKs Savant
-Vader selects Earth and Barney
-Barney selects whiteflame and Pie (in that order)
-whiteflame investigates Earth (Earth carries out investigation)
-Moozer waives
DP2:
-Earth gives cop to whiteflame
-Pie requests donation from Lunatic
-Barney lynched
NP2:
-Lunatic donates to Pie (forfeits night actions)
-Vader NKs whiteflame
-Vader selects Moozer and Pie
-whiteflame investigates Pie (Earth carries out investigation)
-Moozer doctors himself, strengthens Vader
DP3:
-Earth gives cop to Pie
-Vader lynched
NP3:
-Lunatic scouts Pie
-Lunatic frames Moozer
-Lunatic strongmans Earth
-Lunatic NKs Earth
-Pie investigates Lunatic (Earth carries out investigation)
DP4:
-Moozer lynched
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MAFIA WINS!
Vader - You are Anatoly Karpov! You are a former World Champion, and an incredibly strong one at that. You are known for your unique style called “prophylaxis”, which involves predicting the other player’s plans and then preventing them. In addition, you are still widely admired in the chess world despite being a Putin bootlicker. Thus, you are the Godfather Predictive Role Thief. If you are investigated by a cop, you will be investigated as innocent. Each night, you may choose two players. If either of these players are lynched the next day, then you will steal the remaining player’s role for the night, allowing you to use it and blocking them from using it. You win with the mafia.
Lunatic - You are Magnus Carlsen! You are widely considered to be one of the greatest world champions of all time. You have a powerful, universal style as well as incredible memory and calculation skills. In addition, you are especially strong in the endgame (the last phase of a chess game). Thus, you are the Progressive Super-JOAT. You can use as many abilities each night as the current night number: N1 = 1 ability, N2 = 2 abilities, N3 = 3 abilities, N4 and above = 4 abilities.
You can use the same ability on multiple nights, but you cannot choose two abilities from the same list on the same night.
List 1: Lawyer (innocent when guilty), Framer (guilty when innocent), Tailor (flip inv results)
List 2: Scout (track who a player visits), Lookout (watch who visited a player), Voyeur (see what actions were performed on a player)
List 3: Strongman (kill cannot be stopped by protective roles), Ninja (kill can’t be seen by watchers/trackers), Strengthened (kill cannot be roleblocked)
List 4: Redirector (redirect Player A’s action to Player B), Bus Driver (redirect actions performed on Player A to Player B, and vice versa), Deflector (redirect actions performed on Player A to player B)
You win with the mafia.
Pie - You are lichess.org! You are a free online chess server run by a self-described communist programmer. Everybody loves you. Due to your nonprofit nature, you rely entirely on donations for funding. Thus, you are the Donation-Dependent Innocent Child. Each DAY, you may select a player to solicit for donations. You must PM a choice to me before the flip (you can change your choice as many times as you want before then). As a day action, this will not interact with any night actions performed by other players. The following night, that player will receive the following PM:
“A player has asked you for a small donation. If you choose to donate, you will forfeit any night actions as if roleblocked. Do you choose to donate?”
You will be informed on whether you successfully received a donation. Once you receive two donations, you will be revealed as the Innocent Child.
You win with the town.
Joebob- You are algebraic notation! You’re a type of encoding system used to record the moves of chess games so that they can be reviewed, watched, and shared even after the game ends. This recording system involves tracking a piece to a square it moves to using an intricate coordinate grid. Thus, you are the Flipped Tracker. Each night, you can track a player, which will record which players they visited, if any. If/when you die, this notation sheet will be revealed with your flip. You win with the town.
Barney - You are the pin! You are a type of tactic – a pattern involving a certain configuration of pieces. It occurs when a less valuable piece cannot easily move due to that exposing a more valuable piece to attack. Thus, you are the Conditional Roleblocker. Each night, you may choose a “minor player” and a “major player”. If the minor player does not move, nothing will happen. If the minor player moves, then you will follow the minor player (finding out who received a visit from them that night), and roleblock the major player (preventing them from carrying out any night actions). You win with the town.
Whiteflame - You are the draw offer! The draw offer is a unique aspect of chess. A player can offer a draw to their opponent in any position, which can either be accepted or declined. A draw offer is often used to gain a tactical advantage. Thus, you are the Offering Gladiator. Once per game, you can “offer a draw” to another player during a day phase (this is done by saying [I offer a draw to (player)] and tagging me). I will then post the following message:
“whiteflame has offered a draw to [Player]! [Player] can choose to either accept or decline the draw offer. If [Player] accepts, then [Player] will forfeit his night action as if roleblocked, while whiteflame will be protected for the night. If [Player] declines, then votes will be reset and only whiteflame and [Player] will be votable for the rest of the day phase.”
You win with the town.
Earth - You are Stockfish! You are the strongest chess engine in the world – a type of program that analyzes a chess position and then calculates the best continuation. While most players use you for learning and studying, some players use you to cheat. At the end of the day, you’re a tool that can be used for good or for evil. Thus, you are the Controllable Cop. Each DAY, you may select a player to use you. You must PM a choice to me before the flip (you can change your choice as many times as you want before then). As a day action, this will not interact with any night actions performed by other players.
During the night, this player will receive the following message:
“You have been given the opportunity to use a chess engine to find the best move. You may input the name of a player and receive their alignment. If you choose to use it, then you will forfeit any night actions as if roleblocked. Do you accept?”
You will not be informed on whether an investigation was carried out, or the result/target of the investigation.
You win with the town.
Moozer - You are castling! This is a special move that allows two pieces – the king and a rook - to move in a single turn. This typically helps protect the king and activate the rook. It can only be done twice per game (once by each player). Thus, you are the two-shot Doctor-Strengthener. Two nights per game, you may select one player as a “king” and another player as a “rook.” The “king” will be protected from any lethal night actions, while the “rook” will have any active actions be unable to be tampered with. You win with the town.
Savant - You are the Pawn! The pawn is the least powerful piece in chess, capable only of moving one square at a time. Beginners tend not to value pawns very much, which is a shame. Pawns have a special ability to promote to a queen (the strongest piece) when they reach the final row of the board. Thus, you are the Miller Soldier. If you are investigated by a cop, you will be investigated as guilty. If at any point you are the last surviving town member, then town will automatically win the game. You win with the town.
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