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@SirAnonymous
Playing as mafia is easier.
Agree.
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@Vader
What is also veyr dumb is because there was logical reasoning to claim the role I did because of GP's claim. If the game were balanced with the removal of that Suicidal shit, I would have not have claimed.
I am glad you learned your lesson. Now hopefully you will never use balance analysis to form a read ever again because it turned out that the reasons I told you not to in-game were exactly what turned out to be the case.
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@SirAnonymous
The reason I was able to toe the line so well was that I wasn't toeing the line. After my despairing comments about outing the siblings on page 6 of DP1, I resolved to win as town if at all possible. After that, I had managed to almost entirely divorce my mind from the reality that I was Judas
You will be a very good scum player then. It's really just as simple as divorcing your mind from the fact that you are scum during the DP and not being an idiot in the NP. Just what you say here but reversed. Harder to do because of subconscious influence from the info advantage but just as simple a concept.
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We had two power roles and five (arguably four) negative utility roles in a nine player town versus a vanilla TP and three scum power roles...
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@Bullish
Your role description implied cap vs iron man.
Black Widow switched from iron man to cap in the description. Did Iron Man have enough heroes on his side to fill a nine player town? I brought this up in the game but got no answer (drowned out in the 1k posts I guess).
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@Lunatic
Oh, have not read last 2 pages of the game yet. When I saw SA was judas I assumed he was NK'ed NP 2.
If I was judas I would be desperately trying to get myself lynched after that NP 1 fiasco lol.
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@Speedrace
I do not think that this was TERRIBLY misbalanced. Judas was what made it so bad.
Omfg there was a judas too? Did town have any power roles at all? Holy crap.
Speed I told you this before and I will say it again the key to making balanced games is to think to yourself "what is the best case scenario for town? What is the worst case scenario for town?" Then ask the same about mafia.
Worst case scenario for town in this setup was losing without even getting to DP 2. This could have happened NP 1:
Lynch Judas (very easy mislynch considering the 'test lynchproof claim' idea).
Suicide bomber targets town
Mafia kills lover pair
This would have brought the game instantly to 4v1v4.
Worst case scenario for mafia still got them to DP 2 at least smh.
General rule of thumb is that if no roles exist the number of allowed mislynches equals the number of scum. Town was cripplingly underpowered from the start in this one. Even without the judas DP 1 loss was possible and very nearly happened.
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@SirAnonymous
Oro is on drafter. Let's see if we can convince the others and only lynch you as a last resort.
VTL drafterman
Off to work now.
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@Lunatic
From a different perspective other than yours and SA's, it makes most sense to do the no lynch by testing SA and figuring out who to lynch tomorrow
That's fair. I, like SA, would prefer to lynch drafter but am willing to lynch SA if needed.
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@Lunatic
Sure, you're right. I don't have any slam dunk indicating drafter as scum to anyone that can't see my PM. Just throwing thoughts out there.
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I guess there is still technically the possibility of drafter being town and SA lying in an attempt to get drafter mislynched so we utcould lynch him then drafter just to cover our bases but I find that scenario unlikely.
1) As scum SA could have said he was roleblocked to support mislynching me, much less risky.
2) Behavior-wise SA is so town it hurts.
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@Lunatic
good morning. Whats your plan to secure us to dp5?
Well SA came forward and said he did not get role blocked. That was quite unexpected on my part, I was sure that drafter would have taken the "msg if blocked" aspect into account given it was a primary reason bullish got lynched.
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@Lunatic
From my seat though, it looks a bit weird. I have to buy that drafter bussed pie from the beginning of the day phase and fully intended on lynching pie just for town cred (which he didn't really get from anyone other than me so far anyway)
1) I think the fact that he has had no significant wagon on him until now indicates he did get plenty of town cred. I for one had him as town that whole time.
2) If he had gotten no town cred it is still plausible to say that he was hoping to get some but just didn't.
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SAs response quite useful. I no longer am worried about drafter being potential town.
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@oromagi
What is the alternate explanation you mentioned in post 119?
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@drafterman
P.S. plz answer the questions I asked in earlier post
P.P.S. goodnight
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Ok I have a plan about 40% worked out that I think town can agree to. I will finish it in my head then write it down in the DP... After I wake up from sleeping. I think I can make it so that town survives at least to DP 5.
Sleep time for real this time.
Unvote again just in case
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@Lunatic
@drafterman
Oh I like this kill SA idea.
However, the three of us need to decide drafters target before NP begins
And we need to hear from SA before ending too
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Nvm that is stupid what I said. I need some sleep lol. I am going to sleep now, hopefully will have something better come into my brain soon. Good night folks.
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@Lunatic
We could always vtnl and have drafter prove he is roleblocker by targeting warren, oro, or ragnar.
Unvote
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I was on the wrong lynch every time. I am clearly playing to my town meta.
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@drafterman
Forgot to tag you in post 72.
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@SirAnonymous
If you did not get a message NP 1 saying that you were blocked then drafter is confirmed scum so say so now.
If you were blocked then we need you to claim please.
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Yeah I started getting a bit suspicious when your last posts of DP 2 made it obvious that you were lurking there the whole time.
So, on the off chance that this is somehow not the last DP let's narrow you down to some specifics.
Are you odd-night/even night or regular?
Are you infini-shot?
What is your role justification?
VTL drafterman
I assume SA is your scum buddy then. Good game
So, on the off chance that this is somehow not the last DP let's narrow you down to some specifics.
Are you odd-night/even night or regular?
Are you infini-shot?
What is your role justification?
VTL drafterman
I assume SA is your scum buddy then. Good game
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@drafterman
@Barney
@warren42
@oromagi
@SirAnonymous
So you mean to tell me that none of you have any results to out from either DP?
We are in MyLo, people! Show 'em if you got 'em!
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@drafterman
Ermergerd stop lurking and use that scum radar of yours to tell us who to lynch lol.
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@Lunatic
DD's question was different than mine though didn't he?
That is why we got different answers, yes.
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@Lunatic
Then you are lying. Literally right after you made this post, speed confirmed that 2 maf, 2 town 1 third equals LYLO meaning I count as town numbers.
Check again. Speed said 2-1-3 is Lylo, not 2-1-2.
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@Speedrace
Would 2 mafioso 1 TP 3 town be considered game over if TP can't joint win? I honestly don't even know how I would work that if I was mod.
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@SirAnonymous
VTNL would put us at 2-1-3. We are in LyLo I think.
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a panicked potentially rushed decision.
Any rushed decision is a stupid decision if you are scum. Any scum that doesn't have every reasonable contingency planned out at least one DP ahead is not doing their job.
You and I need to be scum together some time.
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@Lunatic
Maybe you aren't lying though. I just find the mechanics of your role a bit strange, considering the game that just barely happened. Speed being new to modding, seems weird he would switch mechanics up like that when he literally just saw how that role functioned in a different game
Idgaf what you find strange. If you want to scum read me for behavior that's cool but if you are going to imply that I am so bad at playing scum that I would fake claim a role I never even heard of without taking my own advice in post 142 of last DP then that is quite frankly insulting.
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@Speedrace
*sigh* alright let's see where this takes us then TUF.
Yo speed, if you were to hypothetically put a role called "commedian" into the game, possibly inspired by whatever game lunatic is referring to or possibly not, then would that hypothetical commedian receive jokes in his own PM or sent to the PM of a player of their choosing, just for the purpose of this particular game of mafia?
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@Lunatic
Do you really want to play the "hey speed here is a hypothetical question for you" game with me on this?
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@Lunatic
Comedian is an investigation role, and he used it on someone he thought was confirmed town np1, and the only clsimed 3rd party dp2. What results could he have gotten to help further the towns interests?
Omfg you asked me to explain the role then didn't even bother to read the post where I explained the role?
I DON'T GET TO CHOSE WHOSE NAME SHOWS UP IN THE JOKE IT IS RANDOM I ONLY CHOOSE WHO THE JOKE IS SENT TO I JUST SAID THAT 5 SECONDS AGO.
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Like, if GP had lived through NP 1 he would say "yep speed sent me a joke alright." Like, unless you scum read GP how would that not role confirm me? Genuinely curious.
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@Lunatic
Dude lied for 2 day phases about having a confirmable role.
Okay for real though which part of my post makes it seem like the "joke" gets sent to me as opposed to the player I target?
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@Barney
Who do you want to kill now?
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@Lunatic
Why did you think this role would confirm you by targeting GP? If GPs role was revealed to you as one of the three jokes, it would co nfirm GP as not scum to you but wouldnt confirm it to amyone else. Plus you claim you already town read GP so confirming him to yourself doesnt do much.
Oh I get it now, reading comprehension fail. Reread the post where I explain how the role works.
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@Lunatic
How would you have been role confirmed
Well sure, anyone who thought GP was scum wouldn't buy it. I figured it was pretty unlikely that anyone would be dumb enough to scum read GP but obviously I was wrong about that so you may have a point hahahaha
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@Lunatic
Yeah, I get to target someone. That person gets a "joke" as a message. The joke is this:
A ____, ____, and a ____ walk into a bar and ____ was one of them!
Where the last blank is a random player and one of the first three blanks is that players role. The other two blanks are filled with random roles that may or may not even be in the game.
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The lover and bodyguard would die as normal.
The lover's lover and BG I mean. As in if singu was targeted by NK and supa by BG then BG and singu would die.
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@Lunatic
<br>DD is gonna claim that the lack of a night kill confirms his role. Just you watch.
I am scum and waived to confirm a fake claim? Way too risky. No.
I will claim though cuz why the hell not? I am tony stark, commedian. Like I said not a common role
Who did I target NP 1? Obviously I targeted GP. He was confirmed town so no chance of scum screwing up the message and there was no way he was going to be NK'ed because scum would never target a suicidal. Perfect target for a commedian. At least that is what I thought. Smh.
I was roleblocked NP 2. Tried to targed lunatic. I did get a message telling me I was roleblocked by the way. At this point I think bullish did get such a message but didn't bother to read it. Can't think of any other explanation. I asked the mod a bunch of questions in the NP trying to figure that flip out. "Would a person be notified of a redirector?" Yes. "What about a bus driver?" Yes again. "What if the kill was a strongman?" The lover and bodyguard would die as normal. Nothing I can think of except he just didn't read his PM. If that is the case that's on him.
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Finally.
I wish I did know who the last scum was so that I could figure out who they are going to kill tonight. If I get shafted the same way I was NP 1 by WP then imma be really sad.
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@Lunatic
You seemed all for the long day phases yesterday, could have tried ending it when I outed GP as scum, but you were encouraging town to milk the rest of the time and we were already about 300+ posts in
As I explained to bullish yesterday after he said something similar my personal philosophical view is that DPs should not be too long or too short. I define too short as not giving all or at least most players a chance to post after a significant event (your fake claim qualified as significant) and too long as anything that drags on after a decently-reasoned lynch wagon has started.
If you want to argue that is a poor philosophy then we should do so in another thread. If you want to argue that I have not been consistent with that philosophy then I advise argue it to others, not to me. I already know my alignment.
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@Lunatic
Btw I think I read DD as town last DP for the wrong reasons.
Okay that is fine you can try to convince town to lynch me tomorrow if mafia is dumb enough to let me live. For now we have confirmed that bullish was lying about his role. If you think I am bussing bullish that's fine idgaf, warren just voted so it is L-1 now. Let's please not have another 1k grind the last one hurt so bad.
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@Lunatic
I think post 160 basically boils down to this:
I just think the idea of role fishing purposely isn't a scum tactic I have ever seen talked about in a mafia PM, and often town are behind role fishing
Which is fine, I really don't feel up for a philosophical debate on the topic and furthermore I already said that I have no idea who the 3rd scum is.
All I want is for our confirmed bullish scum to be lynched before having another retarded 1.2k thread. We can find last scum in DP3 after scum narrows the pool with an NK and we possibly have the help of NP 2 results.
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@Lunatic
To clarify the above, the sequence of events was as follows:
1) Speed confirms BG would hypothetically die in supas place if singu died and BG protected supa
2) bullish says "I did protect speed". Says nothing about being role blocked.
3) Bullish notices the above and says "Oh in that case I guess I was role blocked".
4) Siranon asks if notifications are given to those that are roleblocked. Speed says yes.
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