ILikePie5

So because you lost a game, you don’t wanna play with them anymore.

why can’t bk or gp play?

Trying to lynch Poe instead of Vader, felt like a gambit. And gambits are most often scum.

While pretty sure the remaining scum was Pie, I nearly tracked whiteflame.

The reasoning was that if I were to be role blocked, that result would be identical to an actual commuter.

Whereas just confirming whiteflame did not move, would by elimination condemn Pie.

Ultimately I decided that the odds of good information favored Pie. For one thing, if a RB was available it’d probably target the Doctor, so that I could then be a NK target; which made the fears less meaningful.

Eh, I can see your point there. Anyway, some people play mafia to have fun. Personally I'm fine with that as long as they make a reasonable effort to play to their wincon.

Yes, I wonder who led that train out of totally legitimate behavioral reasons. But in all seriousness, Greyparrot claimed first, and his role was wacky enough that it was obvious the roles in this game weren't going to be particularly normal.

Also, I just want to take a moment to say that none of this is personal in any way. I genuinely enjoy playing with you and hope you will reconsider your decision to not play with GP and BK, as annoying as they can sometimes be.

Sure. Like I said... I wouldn't have claimed Mark. But anyway... (disclaimer, this is based off a brief read of Mark's wiki article, so justifications won't make much sense)

Idea 1: Modified Deathproof

-If lynched, then survive, but having two or more people visit you the next NP will kill you.

-If NKed, then survive, but your hammer threshold will be at L - 2 the next DP.

Idea 2: Modified Joat

-Invulnerability: x1 activated bulletproof + lynchproof for next DP

-Flight: Cannot be roleblocked, watch 2 players

-Strength: Target a player, their actions cannot be roleblocked or redirected and will roleblock scum if they are targeted by that player

Idea 3: Conditionally strong role (since mark protects his friends and all that)

-Once per game, target a player to protect. They cannot be killed for as long as you are alive. However, if you are killed, then they will die too. 

--- 

Like, it's not that hard to make up a creative role in a rolemad game for the literal protag of the show.

Again, I wouldn't have claimed Mark. But if I did, I would have made up some overpowered but somewhat plausible role like Greyparrot's, not the second-most generic self-protective role there is.

I'm guessing you don't want that pm, lol. It's all good, just a a game.

Probably you don't claim Mark, first of all. And if you claim the protag, then surely there's a better role than x1 Commuter. Literally every single role in this game was either flavored (Doc), custom (Probe), or exotic (Bleeder, Mason Recruiter). x1 Commuter is arguably negative utility and doesn't fit with the char.

Mark and Commuter was objectively an extremely suspicious claim, both in terms of the character and the role/justification. I know it seems like I had little reason to push that, but I legitimately would have sussed Pie nearly as much if he claimed some other character.

First of all, just for funsies (I have a really good memory, knew I'd seen it somewhere):

I was upvoting some of your posts where you were on track and hoping you would push it harder lol. It was frustrating to watch at times. But you did well over all and had pretty good reads after dp1. - Lunatic, 2020

I was wondering where all those upvotes were coming from lmaooo - Pie, 2020

https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/5354-anime-waifus-endgame

Alright then. You honestly did give a good defense, but even if we'd done the back-and-forth for several pages, I doubt you could have dissuaded me by that point, especially given that we had another DP if needed.

why did you vote him if you knew he was town😭

I made my decision dude, for better or worse. If it's BK, then he's dead in the next DP. Simple.

The problem isn't solely that you presented these two roles. It's that it was also the only explanation you appeared willing to consider to explain the deaths of the four Kates in the face of a much more obvious option based on the given claims. As for it being "the exact same thing" as BK, I disagree. Not having an RB on the scum team would be more surprising than having one, and while the Janitor was more of a shot in the dark, it wasn't presented as a narrow explanation for a series of events that had already happened.

That's not true. Both of his statements about the Janitor came late in the DP, so he knew most of the roles (especially if he picked up on the softclaims). I also don't think this would help your case if it was true.

I did.

I can acknowledge that you had these roles in mind and recognize as well that your decision to harp on their existence in this game was sus.

The two are not mutually exclusive. Also, as another point in BK's favor, think about how the balance would work in this game if Pie is town and BK is scum: we would have the pseudo-protective Bleeder and a one-time use Commuter that only protects the user.

So, at best, town could stop one NK and delay another. If BK's town, at least there's some broader protection in play. So if I'm considering balance, it's very odd for Luna to only provide two self-protective (one pseudo-protective) roles.

I mean WF is an odd one out as well. Only vanilla.

So wanna lynch Whiteflame?

I came up with both roleblocker and janitor.

So he's early to breadcrumbing the existence of a Bus Driver to address a point about the number of scum visiting roles made by Austin. When suspicion fell to him by PoE, his response now included both of the uncommon-to-rare roles Vader's flip has revealed:

Note that all of this takes place after sussing BK in two posts about how the NK revealed the existence of a Janitor after BK suggested it back in DP1. That means he actively sussed BK for the very same thing he's doing, and worse, it was for two highly specific roles.

I might view the two as relatively equal if it hadn't become the fundamental assumption to support his position that BK is a better target than him... before Vader shit the bed, of course. Pie was stretching hard to make this seem not just plausible, but actual. Yes, the flip shows that it could have happened, emphasis on the "could." You have to believe that Vader opted to reveal that he targeted me and just me (likely to ensure that if a Tracker followed him, his visit would be validated, whereas a Tracker would have seen him go to both targets otherwise), that he specifically chose to target me and JoeBob, and that I'm scum.

All of that has to be true for his claims to be accurate, and the only way he could believe it so strongly is if he already knew what the flip would be and that it would support his argument.

I know I'm not scum, but I'll put this to JoeBob: do you see anything in here that's believable on Pie's side, or anything that stands out from BK as scummy? At this point, I see no reason not to hammer, but I want your opinion.

well it would be funny, but I also wanna win

You can, as soon as you provide evidence that the person committed a crime within a jurisdiction where the alleged defendant would be subject to the findings of a right wing jury pool. Good luck.

So let’s lynch me!

If I am scum, why did I redirect lynch from Pie to Vader?

Am I really that bad scum partner?

Thats actually a very good solution. Now we just must wonder why would vader do that if both whiteflame and joe are town.

OwO

wf is clearly town as vader or pie visited him with one of the abilities.

Hey, I know, lets do a no lynch!

We know that Barney visited me, but we also know that Barney wasnt redirected since Gp's ability said Barney wasnt visited.

So who visited Joe and who visited Whiteflame? Who was it?

Do you know and can you tell us?

Its not really an important discussion, as town would have to be braindead to vote me, so it’s either you or Pie. But sure, I like small talk before victory.

chill I never said I was voting cuz of that

I thought you said you were busy, yet my phone keeps lighting up with notifications from you. If it helps, I promise I won’t vote until I’ve had a chance to discuss what I’m seeing in DP2, so if you’ve got something to write, get to it.

Just lynch Pie and get this over with, as its getting silly lmao

Sorry Pie, from DP1 I could tell the difference in how you worded your sentences, I just have played way too many games with you. Really sorry, it is kinda unfair I have a lot of memories of your mafia play. :(

We know that Janitor was used, and not other role beside it.

I KNOW WHAT YOU DID!

Thats actually very smart and possible.

So lynch Pie, then Whiteflame, as at this point one of them is certain scum, but I would say its Pie, since we know that Barney wasnt visited, hence wasnt redirected. Lol