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@Pierrelechien1
Hello Lucy, you are the only femme at DebateArt, no?
I am something close to trans.
The debate, it is strategie, statistique and research
Yes, but generally, it is only research about specific topics, and only at surface.
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@Savant
I thought posts become permanent something like 30 minutes after you make them
He didnt edit it. The mods deleted it. The version I posted is the same version Skipper said he saw before RM posted anything.
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@whiteflame
I will post this again in case it gets missed.
I am not asking to remove ban, because I doubt that will happen anyway. I think 3 day ban isnt that serious now, compared to the much bigger issue at hand.
All I am asking here is to change moderation log description to something like "banned over making very inappropriate and very offensive jokes about disturbing topics".
Thats all I am asking.
Remove the "pedophile" label, cuz the guy is not a pedophile. The moderation log description is very unclear and makes him sound like pedophile who posted child porn or something. And that log is permanent, anyone new who is unfamilliar with what happened will think horrible things about him.
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@FLRW
Three days is just a slap on the wrist
I am not asking to remove ban.
All I am asking here is to change moderation log description to something like "banned over making very inappropriate and very offensive jokes about disturbing topics".
Thats all I am asking.
Remove the "pedophile" label, cuz the guy is not.
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@Pierrelechien1
It is important to exercise the brain, I think
Debating is decent for brain, but there are better options, like chess, math, research, studying behavior, memorization...ect. Debating constantly can even cause depression because you keep improving at something which makes no any difference in your life or other people's lives. At least in chess, people admit defeat.
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Did your intuition forget to @ the 2 mods that actually decided it?
The mods arent going to respond to this. And its probably their best gameplay, to not respond, or to respond through Lancelot maybe. I could talk to Whiteflame in private, but I already bothered him too much with site's issues probably.
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@Pierrelechien1
Debating, it achieves the debate, no?
Well, yes, its like some unhealthy addiction. You enter it thinking you will change minds, but all you end up with is improving your mind but in an area which serves virtually no purpose. Machiavelli's first rule is not to argue, because even best debaters end up convincing no one. Trump is a comedian, not a debater. People voted for him because he is funny and generally has dominant behavior, nothing to do with debating or logic.
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@Umbrellacorp
I am sure the author is a tough debater
I quit debating long time ago, this is just writing notes. Generally, you are more likely to change someone's mind with presence than argument. I have been on this site for 2 years and I didnt see maybe 1 person change his mind from debating during whole 2 years. The main problem in debating is that even if stupid person loses an argument, they dont know it. They walk away thinking they won. This is why debating actually achieves nothing. Literally, nothing. People already made up their mind before debate starts. You can only change people's minds by bypassing their defense mechanisms, and debating cant really bypass it. Even very stupid people and very smart people rarely ever change their minds. Even when they are proved blatantly wrong. But they do change their minds through presence, authority and rewards.
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Good tips. I realised this very early on in life but not all are blessed like me at self-arguing and realising how logic works.
Most people dont know how to debate, its actually only small percentage of population which is capable of debating. The rest are just yelling, rambling and interrupting and thinking they are winning arguments.
The counterangle to rape always being wrong is saying sometimes it is not wrong, which is still very dangerous to believe.
Many people believe that rape is sometimes okay, for example, when pedophile gets raped in prison. Forced marriages were also historically common, and that was also rape because woman had to be with person she didnt want to be with.
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@Sir.Lancelot
This rule backfires if the debate is on-balance.
If on-balance, you can go by negating opposites mostly. Same principle, basically. If all opposite premises are proved false, then your premise must be true.
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Another note is definitions. Definitions will usually determine a win in debate, and debating without definitions is like playing chess without knowing the rules. Failing to define at least key terms is usually auto loss against anyone who does define their key terms good enough.
Another note is to make claim traps. Stupid person will make a claim and offer proof for it immediatelly. Smart person makes claim, then waits for other person to deny it, then offers clear proof, making the other person look stupid. Generally, you want to save best for last.
Also, learn Socrates argument, where you avoid stating your position and just attack opponent's. This makes you less vunerable.
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Google search is your friend. Literally.
Before you make a claim, google it to check if its true. Its not difficult, and it saves you the embarrasment of being corrected.
Also, take least extreme opposite position. For example, if someone says that all abortions are okay, a stupid person would take position that all abortions are wrong, but smart person would take position that some abortions are wrong. Generally, less extreme positions are easiest to defend. If opponent says "they all are", you say "some are not". If your opponent says "its always good", you say "sometimes its not good".
Argument is usually made from 2 claims and conclusion, claims supporting those two claims, and hidden premises and hidden assumptions.
The two claims are: base claim, and claim which links base claim to conclusion.
In order for argument to be true, both base claim and link claim must be true.
Example:
1. Abortion kills a human being (base claim)
2. Killing a human being is wrong (link claim)
C. Abortion is wrong
If either 1 or 2 is incorrect or unproved, argument is defeated.
However, all these claims depend on hidden premises/hidden assumptions.
What are hidden premises?
Hidden premises are unmentioned opposite premises which must be false for argument to be true, or unmentioned claims which must be true if argument is to be proved true.
What is opposite of "abortion kills a human being"?
It is a premise that sometimes, abortion actually doesnt kill a human being, example in cases where fetus would die anyway, and where mother would die without abortion. In that case, lack of abortion would kill a human being, not abortion.
"Killing a human being is wrong" claim also has it's opposite. By many people, it is considered justified to kill a human being if it saves more lives than it kills. For example, if you ask AI on if it would sacrifice 1 human to save 5, AI would answer yes. If you ask people about collateral damage in war, people would say that it is justified. So abortion, likewise, by some people can be justified in cases where it saves more lives than it kills and increases life expectancy in general.
Further, this premise depends on countless hidden assumptions: that one true morality exists, that free will exists, that people have enough knowledge to make such conclusion, that reality we know of is true reality, that human being is morally justified to exist, that killing human beings doesnt send them to a world better than this one...ect. I dont hold these positions, these are just examples.
Hidden assumptions are basically either unprovable claims which must be proved for premise to be true, or undisprovable claims which must be disproved for premise to be true.
Hidden assumptions are in theory perfect counter-arguments, because they cannot be disproved and they always make argument unproved.
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@Debunker
This site is full of liars
A simple google search could beat like 50% of debaters on this site.
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@WyIted
The main weapon is silence, eye contact, mirroring body position, and then calm slow command.
But the main hack which works on its own is eye contact and slow blinking. Slow blinking is in nature a common characteristic of alpha male lions.
Basically just doing body movements alpha lion does makes human brain think you are alpha.
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@WyIted
This video explains psychological experiments which military banned from public because the method showed that people will almost always blindly obey anyone who by behavior and movements looks like alpha male from nature. When asked why they obeyed, they couldnt explain.
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@WyIted
1. They delete all the evidence
2. Then they ban a person and label him pedophile forever because of "evidence they had"
3. When asked for evidence, they give none
So we are just supposed to trust them that they had evidence? Is this how trials usually work? Mods have stayed silent on this, and this isnt the first time they do this.
I understand that most people always believe authority over evidence, which is why we have this situation in the first place.
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@Sir.Lancelot
Adaptable is telling the truth about what zedvictor wrote
He didnt even say what zedvictor wrote.
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"zedvictor4 has been banned for 3 days for posting explicit content that strongly implied pedophilia content"
This makes it sound like he posted links to child porn, not some joke poem.
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@IlDiavolo
I thought he put a link to an image of something horrible related to pedophilia
And anyone else who reads that log in future without knowing whole story will think that.
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@WyIted
What was his intent with the poem. What's the theory. Intent is really what matters here
A joke poem about man seducing girls by letting them eat fruit from his garden, at worst. To label a guy as pedophile forever over that is insane.
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I do not lie about things like this ever
Listen buddy, you obviously have some intent to ban 70% of user base on this site until there is nothing left here but pussies who are afraid to say anything to risk offending you. I would never trust your judgment.
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Without the other parts it is less blatant what he said
Well, either post full or shut up. No one will just trust your word.
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Let them defend themselves
There is no defense for this. Not this time. Maybe bans on Shila, Fishchaser, Remy, Nazi guy, black woman and few others could have been somehow justified, but this one goes beyond mere ban. Its a label.
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How do you know he is not?
Are you serious? If you want to label someone as pedophile, you need to have the evidence. Thats a serious label which you put on a person.
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@WyIted
@Adaptable
You are saying BK should be dead btw
What WyIted thinks of me or pedophiles is irrelevant. This is about Zedvictor, who is NOT a pedophile yet permanently labeled as one in moderation log on this site.
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He has blasphemed or severely disrespected a faith violating Mary and Joseph many times
So thats the real reason for why you did this to him?
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@WyIted
Being labeled as a pedophile isnt exactly fun, especially when person isnt one.
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@Adaptable
And now you made innocent man be labeled as pedophile forever in moderation log. Hope you are proud.
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They make me look like a serial harasser among other things
Your reports banned over 7 users in short time. I dont know why mods decided to just do what you tell them. They used to just ignore you.
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Now anyone in future who is unaware of what happened, and reads moderation log, will think zedvictor is pedophile. Moderation log is permanent. This is unfair to victor.
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I am probably going to get banned for posting that, but anyway, I think truth here matters. The guy was banned over an obvious joke story. Sure, its only for 3 days, but I dont see what was the point of a ban which makes Zedvictor look like a pedophile over some joke story. Moderation log is permanent, and now everyone who is unaware of what happened and reads moderation log will think Zedvictor is pedophile.
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@Castin
Now, my memory of the first part of post is rather weak, but from what I could tell, it was irrelevant. The one that got saved by my comment and the yum yum part is probably reason for ban.
Why didnt I take screen shot 😭
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@Castin
It was basically something like this:
"Little girl and her grandmother were picking fruit, and girl asked grandmother if woodman will be upset.
Of course not said her grandmother, the woodman has always been well blessed with tasty treats, and loves to have the little girls and boys and their mummies cum to feast on them
Yum yum, said little girl.
Yum yum, said mother.
Yum yum, said woodman."
This is a recreated version from my memory, but the last part about yum yum is 100% accurate. I just cant remember if it said grandmother or mother.
And the part which got saved by my comment is also 100% accurate.
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@WyIted
Is the above post really what you banned him for?I want to assume you are not this evil or retarded. That's not what you banned him for and Korea is trolling right?
I am not trolling. You can see my reply on that topic. They deleted zedvictors post, but they forgot to delete my reply which saved it.
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@WyIted
I never thought he would get banned, so I didnt save whole post. I really need to start taking screen shots of all posts adaptable reports here, because apparently, mods delete the evidence. Maybe they took screen shot this time, but I doubt it.
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@WyIted
Was he promoting pedophilia at random like David implies?
I mean, if someone were to be banned for promoting pedophilia, you would never think it would be zedvictor.
Its always the last person you suspect.
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@WyIted
Can you give me his post number
They deleted the post, but it got saved in my comment reply.
"Of course not said her grandmother, the woodman has always been well blessed with tasty treats, and loves to have the little girls and boys and their mummies cum to feast on them."
He also said something like:
"Yum yum, said woodman".
This is basically what got him banned.
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The poem was longer, but that was the only part that got saved thanks to my comment.
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@Mharman
Was that all? Could’ve been a typo
That was the part that got him banned.
Now, I read the sentence multiple times, and word "come" fits in perfectly, while "cum" doesnt really make much sense in that sentence. Literally looks like an unfortunate typo.
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I think he made a typo and wrote "cum" instead of "come". Thats a terrible typo indeed.
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@Umbrellacorp
You are kid, so I am legally not allowed to talk to you. Stop sending me messages.
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@Swagnarok
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@Swagnarok
He's like a 60 or 70-something year old man, right? What could he have posted?
He made a poem which was... nasty?
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@Umbrellacorp
Although i would've liked to have Lucyhomeschooled banned together with him...
Why?
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@Umbrellacorp
That ban was fair tho. Brutal poem he made.
Well, this site isnt Germany to allow such things.
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@FLRW
I am going to tease him so much when he comes back. 😁
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