Total posts: 8,050
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
The existence of a pizza does not require the existence of an ultimate pizza.
The existence of reality does require the existence of ultimate reality.
If there is no ultimate reality, there is no reality.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ludofl3x
I don't know, what do I look like a lawyer?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
Yeah, and what you need in writing is basically a group of people willing to sign a document that petitions the state to recognize you as a religion.
No scripture required.
And there are so many Christian heresies out there I am sure you can find one that rejects scripture all together.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
I used to volunteer at a Christian mission that did charity work. Not affiliated with any specific church. Still a religious organization.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ludofl3x
If rights are something granted by a secular government, there are no rights, only privileges.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
They are different.
But if there is no ultimate reality, there can be no reality because nothing is ultimately real.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ludofl3x
disciriminating is using someone's identity in some way to deny them goods or services or rights that are otherwise available, generally.
The legislation in question is about protecting religious organizations.
It has nothing to do with say, an employee at walmart refusing to give a gay couple a cake.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
Ok, I'll take your word for it. You are knowingly denying The Truth and reality itself. That explains why you are so irrational.
Created:
Posted in:
And so you know, the [EASTERN ORTHODOX] church is very tolerant.Thank you very much.
Know that even if we don't agree with what you do during your private time, we still love you and will not persecute you. We will be honest with you though, and sometimes that can seem hurtful, but we are honest because we love you. If we didn't love, we would tell people what they want to hear or say nothing at all. It is a lot easier to do that sometimes.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
A religion doesn't need any writings whatsoever.
Just because you are in denial of your secular dogma does not mean it doesn't exist.
Denial of all dogma in itself could be a dogma!
Or if you want to be discordian about it, you can have your catma.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Deb-8-a-bull
LolBakers pump cream into tarts.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Deb-8-a-bull
Simple solution, buy a cake and don't say what it is used for.
But of course, this is not possible for someone who is trying to make a statement, and maybe a hefty settlement while destroying the livelihood of people who very likely struggled a great deal to get what they have.
Created:
Posted in:
People aren't equal. We shouldn't treat everyone the same. State enforced anarchy is a stupid idea, and is wholly destructive and anti-human.
And really, you don't believe what you are saying anyway, because your so called egalitarianism is selective in that it allows people to believe and act on faith so long as it doesn't conflict with your own perverse ideas of what that should look like.
If you are intolerant of those who think are intolerant, you yourself is intolerant.
And so you know, the church is very tolerant. We don't go around persecuting people. In fact, there has not been a period in history where we ourselves were not persecuted. We don't fight back. If we fight at the all, it is because we are pressed into doing so by secular authorities. The church does not believe in warring or rebellion. We are at the mercy of evil men.
Evil men who would love to slaughter us if they could get away with it, and that is exactly what happens every time.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Snoopy
The bigotry and religious fanaticism of the one saying that, duh.
That is the same type of mentality these secullar religionists project on to all religions other than their own. Being ignorant, they are in denial of the religion they themselves practice, so don't expect any of them to confirm what I am saying about it.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
I am asking you what you think.
By all means, keep whining and being unproductive though. Blame me for it.
The Ultimate Reality clearly exists. That is even what Ultimate Reality means. It is ultimately real. Real in the realest sense. If it doesn't exist, it doesn't fulfill the essence of what it means.
Not that difficult to understand unless you don't want to understand.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ludofl3x
If the invincible ignorance of those I spoke with here deterred me, I would have been gone long ago.
Not sorry to break up the circle jerk.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
The scriptures very clearly condemn homosexuality as an aberration, don't kid yourself.
We do see it as a symptom of idolatry.
But lest I mislead you into thinking we derive our religion from scripture, I did not feel it beneficial to use scriptural justification. Scripture is part of our tradition, it is not the source of it.
Also, you don't really know what scripture is to us. What we use it for. That being the case, I don't believe it would be useful to discuss scripture with you.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
It appears to me that you are emotionally invested in this subject matter, because I expect a higher level of discourse from you.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
The Ultimate Reality.
What do you think that means?
What do you mean by an entity, because as I showed you an entity is...
"being, existence; especially : independent, separate, or self-contained existence"
Which I certainly wouldn't disagree with, but I have a feeling your understanding is superstitious, as you seem to be in denial of the existence of ultimate reality.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
You would say that if it did come from the bible. You are being disingenuous.So it's indistinguishable from make-believe.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
I know you don't know what you are debating. It looks to me like you are confused by your own defensiveness. If I were to respond to everything you throw out there haphazardly, I would be just as confused as you.
So lets rewind...
If you don't believe there is ultimate reality, I can only conclude a few things...
1. You have no idea what you are denying.
2. You are lying.
3. You are a fool.
I am giving you the benefit of the doubt, and going with 1. You have to understand, from my perspective, you aren't standing on anything, so I am not impressed with your pretense of rationality.
This is the only thing we need to talk about now.
The Ultimate Reality.
What do you think that means?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@disgusted
It is the second largest congregation of people who go by the name Christian in the world.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@WyseGui
It really doesn't matter what you think something means. If you are arguing against a different meaning than the meaning the church uses, you are debating a straw man.
You should probably be more open minded to learning, because you don't understand what you are debating.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Snoopy
The context isn't a business open to the public, it is about Christian adoption agencies being forced to do immoral things like allow homosexual couples adopt children.
3RU7AL is trying to obscure what this legislation is really about because he clearly isn't capable of discussing this subject honestly.
This legislation is about protecting religious organizations.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
As I said, I don't respect your appeal to scripture as you are neither Orthodox or a Christian at all. You are being disingenuous.
Also, I told you before that Orthodoxy is not a religion that comes from the bible. That sort of thing is a protestant phenomena, because they often have nothing else to work with.
We didn't just sit around for 300 some years post resurrection waiting for the New Testament canon to be compiled. The church was there the whole time.
Same sex marriage is not recognized as a reality. Homosexual behavior is certainly considered sexual immorality.
Polygamy is not allowed, though certain grace is granted in the case that say, a Muslim with multiple wives becomes Christian.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Deb-8-a-bull
American religious anarchy/freedom is conducive to creation of new heretical religious sects.
Something about the devil being the author of confusion or something.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
The ones I probably eat the most are kale, broccoli, and onions. I eat a lot of garlic too, and olives. Really, there isn't a vegetable In don't like. I like peppers a lot too, actually. Thai chilis are my favorite, but pablanos, serranos, and jalepenos are good too.
We don't eat soy beans because they allegedly mess with hormones or something. Very rarely!
Haven't seen wheat belly, not sure if I want to. I make pizza! In fact, the first date my spouse and I went on I made a pizza. It happens to by my spouse's favorite dish I make.
I do eat the potatoes. In fact, if I didn't eat potatoes, I'm not sure I would know what to do if I went with some friends to a burger place or non vegetarian friendly restaurant.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
I like my bread complicated, as my cereal.
I stay away from soy, corn maybe less so(though no corn syrup), but I like whole grains. Wheat pasta.
Besides veggies, which I eat a lot of, I like mushrooms a whole lot.
Favorite veggies?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
If your wife is short on vitamin D, she should get the milk I use on my cereal. It has protein and calcium in it too. The silk protein milk made with cashews and almonds.
On that, cereal tends to have a lot of vitamins in it.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
My religion certainly teaches that...
(a) Marriage is or should be recognized as the union of one man and one woman;
(b) Sexual relations are properly reserved to such a marriage; and
(c) Male (man) or female (woman) refer to an individual's immutable biological sex as objectively determined by anatomy and genetics at time of birth.
Created:
-->
@Harikrish
You claim to be a biblical scholar and spiritual leader, but as you are not with the church, I can't respect your credentials.
The curse went on Canaan, not Ham or Canaan's brothers. In fact, Ham himself was blessed in verse 1 of this chapter.
So no, the curse of Ham's son Canaan does not justify your racism.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
I get all my vitamins. Doctor says I am healthy.
Maybe these other vegans are doing it wrong. I dunno. Maybe it'll catch up to me.
They have b12 supplements that are vegan fyi.
Protein is easy. Beans and rice. Quinoa.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
Monastics have been vegan for thousands of years. They manage just fine.
As do I.
And to belief that eating meat is a sin happens to be condemned by the church. There is nothing wrong with eating meat.
I don't think my diet is extreme.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
So basically, I have the right to believe these things.
And you don't believe I do.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Deb-8-a-bull
If I don't, I certainly desire to be.Do you agree with " The Church " on everything?
I trust the experience of the church, and I respect the holy orders.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
I don't eat the way I do for health reasons, but I feel very healthy.
I do try to eat nuteient dense foods though. I also pay attention to things like protein. Beans and rice. Quinoa. Sprouted bread almond and cashew protein milk. Fiber rich cereals.
I like to make my own pizza. I put on lots of veggies. I also use whole wheat pastas
I should eat more fruit, but I go pomegranate crazy when they are in season.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ludofl3x
If your religion is secularism, sure.
But my religion is not secularism, so I disagree.
Created:
-->
@Stronn
Going by your standard of what constitutes a good argument... people are persuaded by bad arguments all the time, I don't dispute that.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ludofl3x
Even illusions exist as illusions.
I don't care if people play pretend marriage. Just don't expect the church to recognize its legitimacy.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
"Religious organization" means:
(a) A house of worship, including, but not limited to, churches, synagogues, shrines, mosques and temples;
(b) A religious group, corporation, association, school or educational institution, ministry, order, society or similar entity, regardless of whether it is integrated or affiliated with a church or other house of worship; and
(c) An officer, owner, employee, manager, religious leader, clergy or minister of an entity or organization described in this subsection
(a) A house of worship, including, but not limited to, churches, synagogues, shrines, mosques and temples;
(b) A religious group, corporation, association, school or educational institution, ministry, order, society or similar entity, regardless of whether it is integrated or affiliated with a church or other house of worship; and
(c) An officer, owner, employee, manager, religious leader, clergy or minister of an entity or organization described in this subsection
Created:
Posted in:
The legislation you cite has to do with religious organizations.How do you interpret "serve the public if you are open to the public" as "coercion"?
Created:
Posted in:
Yeah, that is your spun interpretation of what this legislation does not say.HB 1523 allows anyone citing a religiously motivated reason to deny goods and services to the LGBTQ community, as well as those who have sex outside of marriage, or anything else that might rub their dogmatic sensibilities the
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@TheDredPriateRoberts
There are a lot of computer programmers at my church, and many who have doctorates. The idea that our religion is anti-intellectual or somehow at odds with science is ridiculous.
I blame the King James only, sola scriptura bible thumping protestant crowd for this impression.
This is not Orthodox Christianity by the way.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Paul
I'm sure if you asked most Orthodox Christians that question, they would say that is stupid.
I am sure you will get mixed opinions about whether or not evolution as it is taught or abiogenesis is in fact science, but the church itself is by no means anti-science. In fact, practicing our religion would make you as better science, because most of our discipline involves ridding oneself of passions and influences that keep us from being truly rational.
Created:
Posted in:
I don't know how many of you have hung around cows for any length of time, but they practically are asking to be eaten.
Says the vegan. Lol
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
So you ignore "The Bible" and reality? It sounds like, "let's play pretend".
You give me no reason to believe you are anything but willfully ignorant concerning my faith, and every reason to believe that you are.
As this is the case, I dismiss your question outright. You don't really respect what scripture is used for or what it says anyway.
This is really a matter of you demanding coercion from the government to enforce your own religion while accusing us of what you yourself are doing.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
The legislation you referenced in the OP is targeted at RELIGIOUS ORGANIZATIONS.
If I am mistaken, show me otherwise. If not, talking about wedding cakes is off topic unless said bakery is a religious organization, and it very well could be because marriage is a sacred mystery of the church.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Paul
Whether it is fact or fiction it has no bearing on my faith.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
Our religion does not come from the bible, the bible comes from our religion.Based on what "Bible" verse?
So your question is misguided from the get go.
We certainly do not accept same sex marriage as being a reality.
Created: