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@YouFound_Lxam
Stephen wrote: You have tied yourself in knots, and not for the first time.Phys·i·cal/ˈfizək(ə)l/adjective
- 1.relating to the body as opposed to the mind:
YouFound_Lxam wrote: You can keep repeating that.....
Indeed. And it shows not only your bible ignorance but your contradictory comments too.#38
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@Elliott
So you would abolish Islamic Madrasa's - Faith Schools?I would like to see all faith schools abolished.
So would I. But how would you go about it?
Have you ever heard this BBC pinup boy, Medhi Hasan? Has was the "go _ to" Muslim when ever the issue of Islam /Muslims hit the head lines. he is always referred to as a ' moderate Muslim'. I think it was Dr David Starkey that put him back in his box and exposed him for what he really is on BBC's Question Time. I believe Hasan works for Al-Jazeera now?
On non Muslims living like animals
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@Elliott
So how would you go about implementing "total" secularist education on Muslims that refuse to accept it ?By the fact that it is secular there is nothing to impose.
" we will reap the whirlwind"
So you would abolish Islamic Madrasa's - Faith Schools?
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@b9_ntt
The references to the Sumerian epics fits into the section about "Imitation of Ancient Literature."
Well as I have shown above at #7, once the many hundreds of thousands of ancient text and tablets started to be unearthed over 150 years ago in those lands it soon became obvious that what these tablets were revealing were in fact the models for the stories written down by the biblical scribes. With some of these ancient stories becoming immediately familiar.
One would have thought that the Pastors and Priests would have been delighted and wearing an air of "I told you so" at these newly discovered "evidences" for the existence of some of the most famous characters in their holy book. But it was never going to be the case.
Anyway. Moses.
We cannot be sure as to who the biblical Moses really was unless - I believe- we look back before his time. And to Joseph, he "of many colours" and son of Jacob. The biblical story of Joseph and how he became "father to Pharaoh", starts, the bible says, with him being sold into slavery, Genesis 37:12-36. where he somehow rises from "slave" to being grand Vizier to Pharaoh in charge over all the land of Egypt! Genesis 41:39-45. The last verse of Genesis simply ends with, Joseph, died, was embalmed/ mummified and was placed in a coffin in Egypt. It was said that Joseph's dying request was that his bones be taken to Canaan. And it was years later Moses that fulfilled his request.
But it is to Genesis 41: 45 in particular that is most interesting - to myself at least - where the biblical Moses is concerned.
45 "And Pharaoh called Joseph’s name Zaphnath-Paaneah. And he gave him as a wife Asenath, the daughter of Poti-Pherah priest of On. So Joseph went out over all the land of Egypt". i.e. - foot well and truly in the door in todays speak.
But:
there is a (later) historical Egyptian Vizier named Yusuf that had precisely this type of burial. His sarcophagus was placed in a no lesser place that the Valley of Kings in Thebes.
Yusuf was the principle minister for the 18th dynasty Pharaoh Tuthmosis IV and for his son Amenhotep III, his wife's name was Tjuyu.
Yusuf is the Arabic equivalent of the Hebrew name Yosef and the English name Joseph.
Were there two Josephs that became vizier to Pharaoh? Was the first Vizier Joseph somehow related to the (later) Vizier named Joseph? And for the hell of it I will throw in the Egyptian name Yuya that also happened to be a powerful ancient Egyptian courtier during the reign of the 18th dynasty.
I will continue this when I have more time. Could be later today?
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@Elliott
So how would you go about implementing "total" secularist education on Muslims that refuse to accept it ?By the fact that it is secular there is nothing to impose.
So you would abolish Islamic Madrasa's - Faith Schools?
I remember in around 2015 there were around 2,000 Madrassa's - Faith Schools in the UK with between 350-500 children being instructed in Islamic Shariah .
And I think I remember that after a damming under cover documentary (it may have been Dispatches called Lessons in Hatred and Violence?) exposing that children as young as 5 being taught to hate the west ,the unbeliever, Indians and Jews, that government plans to "regulate" these schools didn't go down too well, although the documentary did lead to one or two of the 2,000 being closed.
This may have been it.
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@b9_ntt
GEN 5:2, Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
Indeed ,indicative of a species and not a name.
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@YouFound_Lxam
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Stephen wrote :God SPEAKS TO Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve speak to god. Adam and Eve HEAR god. And gods HEARS Adam and Eve.This, if the BIBLE is to be beloved is a PHYSICAL face to face conversation with god. Genesis 2:4-8_138 And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God amongst the trees of the garden.9 And the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.11 And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.Are you saying that this conversation didn't happen?YouFound_Lxam wrote:Nope.Not saying that at all.We can have physical experiences with God,
Then you are nothing less than a contradictory cretin. The bible clear states multiple times that humans have had PHYSICAL interactions with god.
While you state:
"We cannot physically hear, see, feel, or touch him. #17 and on the other state "We can have physical experiences with God".#37
You have tied yourself in knots, and not for the first time.
Phys·i·cal
/ˈfizək(ə)l/
adjective
- 1.relating to the body as opposed to the mind:
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@Elliott
Elliott wrote: one thing we need here in the UK is totally secular education.What about what the Muslims want?They probably wouldn’t like it,
I am sure they wouldn't like it.
So how would you go about implementing "total" secularist education on Muslims that refuse to accept it ?
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@YouFound_Lxam
I see what you are saying.
And I see perfectly what it is that you are saying, you contradictory clown.
On the one hand you say that god cannot be, physically seen , heard or touched, and on the other you agree that Jacob, Moses, Adam, Eve and John the Baptist PHYSICALY did all those things .
HERE>>>>>
Stephen wrote:So did Moses Physically speak with god face to face? Yes or No?Did Jacob Physically wrestle with god. Yes or No?Did Adam and Eve Physically speak with God? Yes or NoWho's voice did John hear after he had baptised Jesus?YouFound_Lxam, wrote:Yes.Yes.Yes.Gods. #32
God SPEAKS TO Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve speak to god. Adam and Eve HEAR god. And gods HEARS Adam and Eve.
This, if the BIBLE is to be beloved is a PHYSICAL face to face conversation with god. Genesis 2:4-8_13
8 And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God amongst the trees of the garden.
9 And the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?
10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.
11 And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?
12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.
9 And the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?
10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.
11 And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?
12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.
Are you saying that this conversation didn't happen?
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@YouFound_Lxam
Stephen wrote:So did Moses Physically speak with god face to face? Yes or No?Did Jacob Physically wrestle with god. Yes or No?Did Adam and Eve Physically speak with God?Who's voice did John hear after he had baptised Jesus?YouFound_Lxam, wrote:Yes.Yes.Yes.Gods.
Then how then does this square with your previous repeated claim that:
We can't see him, hear him, or physically see him, but that doesn't mean you can't have an encounter with God. #20God is not physical and we can't physically interact with him but we can experience him, through physical attributes. He is not a physical being but can interact with us physically.#30
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@Elliott
Elliott wrote: I totally agree that Muslims should be encouraged to integrate but the hostility towards Muslims, the anti-Muslim rhetoric and attacking their holy book is not really conducive to this and as I said previously it creates a vicious circle .#24
Encouraged by whom?<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Government policies, local communities, the media and from within the Muslim community itself. The first step would to stop vilifying all Muslims and attacking their faith, integration works two ways.
What would be the goals? And I do hope you are not accuse me of vilifying "all Muslims".
I don’t know if you have Islamic schools in the US but ....
I am English. I live in England.
one thing we need here in the UK is totally secular education.
What about what the Muslims want?
As to the Didsbury Mosque, here is a comment from the chair of trustees at that mosque. So perhaps they are not all radicals.
Interesting headline in that link of yours.
"Mosque would have done anything' to prevent Manchester Arena attack".
"anything" Really!?
Well that certainly doesn't square with the former Imam of the same mosque that told the Manchester Arena Bombing inquiry that "support for terror groups was preached in that Mosque".
>. A former Didsbury Mosque imam has told the Manchester Arena Inquiry support for terror groups was preached there. Not to mention "turned a blind eye to extremism"
And I can tell you, suicide bomber Salman Abedi wasn't the only muslim/islamist terrorist to attend that same mosque.
And after that bombing that same mosque held an "open day". take 2 minutes to listen to what this non Muslim attendee had to say about it.
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God is not physical and we can't physically interact with him but we can experience him, through physical attributes.He is not a physical being but can interact with us physically.
Ok, so will you answer these simple questions that I have posed you
So did Moses Physically speak with god face to face? Yes or No?
Did Jacob Physically wrestle with god. Yes or No?
Did Adam and Eve Physically speak with God?
Who's voice did John hear after he had baptised Jesus?
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@b9_ntt
I had this one wrong;
And as there is in Genesis seemingly two creation stories of man, there appears a second "creation" of sorts in the Sumerian epics where it can read of two "foundlings" raised by the Lord Enlil and his wife Ninki.
It wasn't Lord Enlil and his wife Ninki. It was Lord Enki/Ea and his wife Ninki.
Can you @ me when you reply to me. I almost missed your replies.
Thank's.
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@Elliott
Elliot, stop being a total idiotPlease don’t waste your time trying to insult me; your opinion of me is irrelevant.
I agree. Then grow a thicker skin.
As to not facing the facts, the fact that I face and my main contention and it isn’t that I have a fondness for Islam, it is as I have said previously that all this anti-Islam rhetoric can only help promote a vicious circle of hate that can only encourage further radicalisation.
You have missed this twice now:
Elliott wrote: I totally agree that Muslims should be encouraged to integrate but the hostility towards Muslims, the anti-Muslim rhetoric and attacking their holy book is not really conducive to this and as I said previously it creates a vicious circle .#24
Encouraged by whom? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Does this report released just days ago show any intention of encouragement to integrate, Elliot?
Didsbury Mosque 'turned a blind eye' to Islamist extremism before the Manchester Arena terror attack
A former Didsbury Mosque imam has told the Manchester Arena Inquiry support for terror groups was preached there.
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@YouFound_Lxam
So did Moses Physically speak with god face to face? Yes or No?
Did Jacob Physically wrestle with god. Yes or No?
Did Adam and Eve Physically speak with God?
Who's voice did John hear after he had baptised Jesus?
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@YouFound_Lxam
And I couldn't have made myself more clear.According to THE BIBLE, people have seen god, heard god, touched god and spoken to god. Physically .No, people have had encounters with God, that felt physical. They weren't physical in the sense that we know physical to be.
You are a MASSIVE hypocrite. One minute you insist that "the BIBLE should be taken literally at all times". And now deny what THE BIBLE actually says completely.
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@Elliott
From the BBC "A suspect was identified, who was also a child, and they were given words of advice by an officer." So not hordes of radical Islamists out to get him. Then we have the “Daily Mail.” A comic for right-wing morons, so I will disregard that one.And next we have the National Secular Society, and one local councillor, Usman Ali who is having a bit of a rant to try and exploit the situation.There are plenty of examples of radical Islam, there are authoritarian theocracies, the Taliban and the Islamic State etc, without people, mainly the media making mountains out of molehills
Elliot, stop being a total idiot. Are you disputing the facts because of the source/s or because like in your own religious topics, you simply cannot face the facts?
Most outlets are clearly stating "death threats" plural! and threats of violence " if he returns to school" They aren't coming from "right wing" sources or the mother/s of the children, are they!? No. they are coming from the "Muslim Community".
without people, mainly the media making mountains out of molehills
Yes. That will be the cowardly headmaster, the interfering police and the shit-stirring Muslim councillor. Because it certainly wasn't the mother of the ten year old autistic child , WAS IT, ffs!
.
Maybe that councillor should be suspended though.
I agree. Along with the headteacher that believed "it was a sad day" that a fkn book got scuffed.
And you ignored this too; Answer the question!
I totally agree that Muslims should be encouraged to integrate but the hostility towards Muslims, the anti-Muslim rhetoric and attacking their holy book is not really conducive to this and as I said previously it creates a vicious circle .#24
Encouraged by whom?
Does this report released just days ago show any intention of encouragement to integrate, Elliot?
Didsbury Mosque 'turned a blind eye' to Islamist extremism before the Manchester Arena terror attack
A former Didsbury Mosque imam has told the Manchester Arena Inquiry support for terror groups was preached there.
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@YouFound_Lxam
God is a being, not a person.We cannot physically hear, see, feel, or touch him.God is a being that exists outside of Time, Space, and Matter.Well that isn't quite true is it? Lets break it down.We cannot physically hear him.Genesis 32. Numbers 12:8We cannot physically see, himGenesis 32. Numbers 12:8Genesis 32We cannot physically feel, or touch him.Genesis 32. Numbers 12:8Then there is Adam and Eve that god did some sewing for. Genesis 3:21What about Isaiah? What about Moses?And do not the 12 apostles and all of the other followers of Jesus count as having seen god? Or is Jesus not really god at all?Who's voice did John hear after he had baptised Jesus?You see , these are the kind of dilemma's that Christian bible dunces such as yourself create for yourself, when you don't have a clue what your talking about. And you have the audacity; just like that other cretinous No1 bible dunce, to tell everyone else to read and study the bible.😒We can't see him, hear him, or physically see him, but that doesn't mean you can't have an encounter with God.The point I am trying to make, is that God is not a physical object that can be defined with our senses that were designed to sense physical things. We can still have encounters with God, but not the same as physical things. I still stand by my point.I'm sorry, I should have been more clear.
And I couldn't have made myself more clear.
According to THE BIBLE, people have seen god, heard god, touched god and spoken to god. Physically .
I still stand by my point.
Well this then is you - like all Christians having been shown to be bible ignorant - are denial of THE BIBLICAL facts.
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@Elliott
It appears to be as I had suggested.
Those School boys were suspended (probably for their own protection) because they had somehow offended Islam by scuffing a book all about total submission to Allah.#13
Police speak to child about death threats after Quran damaged at Wakefield school.
Minister for Schools Nick Gibb said his department was working with the school.
He said: "My first priority is always the wellbeing of children and young people.
"The death threats reportedly issued against the pupils are totally unacceptable.
"There is no blasphemy law in this country and schools should be promoting the fundamental British values of the respect for rule of law, individual liberty and tolerance of those with different faiths and beliefs."
She continued: 'He is beside himself. He's very, very sorry.
'He has received death threats, he has received threats that he will be beaten up if he goes back to school. He's absolutely petrified.'
'He has received death threats, he has received threats that he will be beaten up if he goes back to school. He's absolutely petrified.'
"One local councillor, Usman Ali, took to social media to describe the so-called desecration as "serious provocative action which needs to be dealt with urgently by all the authorities, namely, the police, the school and the local authority."
Meetings were hastily arranged, and local Muslims were summoned to the mosque, where the boy's mother was paraded, pleading for forgiveness. West Yorkshire Police were also in attendance. Chief Superintendent Andy Thornton explained that a hate incident had been recorded, but to his credit, added that to call what happened criminal was wrong and that it should be an educational opportunit".
Meetings were hastily arranged, and local Muslims were summoned to the mosque, where the boy's mother was paraded, pleading for forgiveness. West Yorkshire Police were also in attendance. Chief Superintendent Andy Thornton explained that a hate incident had been recorded, but to his credit, added that to call what happened criminal was wrong and that it should be an educational opportunit".
Shariah by the backdoor I call it. They had this petrified autistic 10 year old boy's mother sitting in a mosque - head covered of course- pleading her son's case. Just who the fk do these tosser's think they are.
And it turns out that it was the local Muslim councillor for the "Muslim community" that was stirring all the shite.
The weak kneed apologetic headmaster of that school who bowed to these "allegations of "desecration" cried ' it is a very sad day', should have been fired. It was a fkn book ffs!
It should have all ended when the same apologetic headmaster admitted 'there was no malicious intent'.
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I knew that the flood story in Gilgamesh preceded the biblical one, but I was totally unaware of the "Moses" story in Mesopotamia.
There are others. The creation of Adam and Eve you may find interesting.
(1) Sumerian epics:
The decision by the lords to create a “primitive worker” because the Gods were not ‘miners’ is reminiscent of;
“There was not a man to till the ground”. So “God formed man of the dust of the ground” Genesis 2:5-7. KJV.
(2)Sumerian epics:
The taking of the “two strands essence” is reminiscent of the taking the “rib” of Adam. Genesis2:20-23. NKJV.
(3)Sumerian epics:
The new name given to the Sumerian Goddess Ninki is Lady of Life,
is reminiscent of the name given to Eve by Adam. “And Adam called his wife’s name Eve, because she was the mother of all living”. Genesis 3:20.
(4)Sumerian epics: The creation of the Adama was a first “Unapproved” by the Sumerian lord Enlil.
that caused the two hybrids to be“expelled” by the lord Enlil,
is reminiscent of the expulsion from the Eden. Genesis 3:22-24
And as there is in Genesis seemingly two creation stories of man, there appears a second "creation" of sorts in the Sumerian epics where it can read of two "foundlings" raised by the Lord Enlil and his wife Ninki.
Interesting thing here is that because at that time it was totally taboo for "son's of god" to have sexual relations with the offspring of the human women, this taboo was broken by the Lord Enki.
Both these women were offspring of those that had been “expelled” hundreds of years before. The text tells us;
“And into her [their] womb she [they] took the holy semen by the semen of the lord Enki she [they] was impregnated”.
And this part may be of interest to some readers:
The Lord Enki and his servant Isimud come up with a pr-arranged cover story for if or when these (now pregnant) girls produce offspring, which they did. Isimud the servant tells Enki’s wife Ninki and his brother Enlil; He “found them”!
“amongthe bulrushes, in reed baskets have I them found. Ninki to the foundlings a likening took, as her own children she raised them. Adapa she called the foundling boy, the girl she called Titi”.
The broken taboo is also reminiscent of : The sons of God saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose.
Genesis 6:2
The book of Enoch tells us that these fallen son's had sex with the Daughters of men there by had defiled themselves and were forced to marry them and remain on earth "never to return to their heavenly stations".
Which gnostic gospel
I think I remember it was from the Apocrypha?
But you need not look that up if you can answer this question for yourself;
Who is "The Amen" in this verse from Revelations referring to?
“Write this letter to the angel of the church in Laodicea. This is the message from the one who is the Amen—the faithful and true witness, the beginning of God’s new creation": Revelation 3:14 .NIV My emphasis
variant:
And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of Revelation 3:14.KJV. My emphasis
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@YouFound_Lxam
God is a being, not a person.We cannot physically hear, see, feel, or touch him.God is a being that exists outside of Time, Space, and Matter.
Well that isn't quite true is it? Lets break it down.
We cannot physically hear him.
Genesis 32. Numbers 12:8
We cannot physically see, him
Genesis 32. Numbers 12:8
Genesis 32We cannot physically feel, or touch him.
Genesis 32. Numbers 12:8
Then there is Adam and Eve that god did some sewing for. Genesis 3:21
What about Isaiah? What about Moses?
And do not the 12 apostles and all of the other followers of Jesus count as having seen god? Or is Jesus not really god at all?
Who's voice did John hear after he had baptised Jesus?
You see , these are the kind of dilemma's that Christian bible dunces such as yourself create for yourself, when you don't have a clue what your talking about. And you have the audacity; just like that other cretinous No1 bible dunce, to tell everyone else to read and study the bible.😒
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@FLRW
the Egyptian historian Manetho, Moses is a brutal and violent monster
Indeed. He is discussed in The Aegyptiaca by Manetho with Ptolemy I and recorded that Moses had been an Egyptian priest at Heliopolis. And Flavius Josephus wrote that he commanded the Egyptian army against the Ethiopians and had married an Ethiopian Princess called Tharbis.
I shall be adding more on this point when I have more time.
– and he isn’t even Jewish.
Exodus 2-19
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"My changeling mother conceived me, in secret she bore me. She set me in a basket of rushes, with bitumen she sealed my lid.
She cast me into the river which rose not over me. The river bore me up and carried me to Akki, the drawer of water".
For anyone that has only ever had the story of Moses told or read to them, they could be forgiven for assuming that the above is all about the biblical Moses aka " the lawgiver", but they would be wrong. The above is in fact a much older Mesopotamian original- by thousands of years. In fact what you would be reading in this instance is from the Legend of Sharru-kin, he who was to become Sargon the Great of Akkad. And it wouldn't be for the first time that biblical stories have been taken from much older Mesopotamian legends , either.
The Birth of Moses begins in Exodus 2:
"And a man of the house of Levi went and took as wife a daughter of Levi. So the woman conceived and bore a son. And when she saw that he was a beautiful child, she hid him three months. But when she could no longer hide him, she took an ark of bulrushes for him, daubed it with asphalt and pitch, put the child in it, and laid it in the reeds by the river’s bank. And his sister stood afar off, to know what would be done to him".
We are then informed that Pharaoh's daughter went to bathe in the crocodile infested river Nile where she happened upon the baby Law Giver.
The "Drawer of Water" is noteworthy because according to Exodus 2:10, Moses was given his name by the Pharaoh's daughter who ' drew him from the water'.
When the child grew older, she took him to Pharaoh’s daughter and he became her son. She named him Moses, saying, “I drew him out of the water.” Exodus 2:10
In Hebrew the name Moses is rendered as Mosheh derived maybe from the Hebrew word moshe which means 'the drawer out'. With that said, I find it hard to believe that this Princess of royal Egyptian stock would have been educated in the Hebrew language and etymology? And why not an Egyptian name? Either way, I have no doubt in my mind that the whole story is a restructuring of the Mesopotamian Legend of Sharru-kin.
I have written on this site somewhere before, the name Moses has been studied by Archaeologist, Assyriologist, Egyptologist and historians and all appear to have come to the same conclusion that the Egyptian name Moses is actually a title and derives from the the Egyptian word mose (Greek: mosis). Which simply relates to offspring or heir. Examples would be - Tuthmose (Tuthmoses): born of Thoth. Amenmose (Amenmosis): born of Amen.
Amen, interesting that the gnostic gospels have Jesus demanding he be called "The Amen".
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@RationalMadman
trans rights
Always baffles me, this one. What are they?
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@BrotherD.Thomas
Stephen,It is truly sad that we always have to help the #1 Bible ignorant and stupid fool, in learning about the Bible. Case in point, this ungodly person has the audacity to state the following:"Where does it say in the Bible, that being a Christian is about having a relationship with God?" [ #9 ]HUH? They don't know, but yet want to be called a Christian, NOT!
Breath-taking Brother D.
But we should all know by now that the Reverend is an absolute diamond for asking the dumbest questions where the Bible is concerned. It's stunning really. Especially in his capacity as a "Pastor and a Chaplain to his countries armed forces (Australia) with a congregation of over 300" and with his mental capacity to have " been taught memorised the bible from a very early age". It will be interesting to read what bible dunce No2 YouFound_Lxam, has to offer in reply. He hasn't done too well up to this point in my opinion.
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@zedvictor4
"A woman must not wear men’s clothing, nor a man wear women’s clothing, for the LORD your God detests anyone who does this" .Deuteronomy 22:5zedvictor4 wrote:Thing is.There's not a whole lot of difference between two fig leaves.
😂
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@Deb-8-a-bull
Its all beiging to sound like . God had a bad experience with a chick once at a fancy dress party.And he was like THATS IT. Men can only wear mens clothes , women can only wear womens .
I can't speak about the "bad experience" bit but you'd be very near the mark if the bible is to be believed ,Deb
"A woman must not wear men’s clothing, nor a man wear women’s clothing, for the LORD your God detests anyone who does this" .Deuteronomy 22:5
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@YouFound_Lxam
YouFound_Lxam wrote: The goal for Christians isn't to go to heaven. It is to grow a relationship with God.Stephen wrote: You certainly are behind in your bible studies, aren't you? "The goal" is, everlasting life. John 3:16John 3:16:"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."To want everlasting life isn't bad or a sin. To want only that is.
So the goal IS everlasting life then isn't it. As I have said.
YouFound_Lxam wrote: The end goal is not safety for self, but relationship with the creator.Stephen wrote: Stop it! It is all about self preservation and securing your place in the here after in the presence of "the lord". Mathew 18:3. John 14:2.No, it's to try to show others that works don't get you into heaven, only through faith, and the love of God can you do that.
So again, it is as I have said. , It is all about self preservation and securing your place in the here after in the presence of "the lord".
YouFound_Lxam wrote: Hell is separation from the creator,[A] not a punishment.#1Stephen wrote: Jesus! The relationship that you want with god is on a very poor foundation."They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might" Matthew25: 46. " 2Thessalonians 1; 9Yes, and where does that punishment come from?
But you clearly say at [A] above that "hell is NOT a PUNISHMENT"!#1 Where I have shown you that the BIBLE clearly says it is?
Look at the last part of that scripture."...away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might"
It still doesn't alter the BIBLICAL fact that the BIBLE clearly says that Hell is a punishment.
"They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might" . 2Thessalonians 1; 9
"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. Matthew" 25: 46 There are more verses speaking of the PUNISHMENT in hell should you care to read the bible for yourself.
YouFound_Lxam wrote: This is why when going to church you must not believe everything you hear blindly. You must line it up with what the Bible has to say first.#10
Well I suggest that you learn your scriptures yourself before preaching "the gospel" to others.<<<<This should line up with what THE BIBLE has to say:
Especially for you:
Matthew 22:29 But Jesus answered them, “You are wrong, because you know neither the Scriptures ".
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@YouFound_Lxam
Some Christians are blinded by new teachings in the modern church, that strive to exploit God for financial gain.
That will be Pastors, Priests and any other holy roller that can speak with a loud commanding voice and loves to inform his congregation that he has spoken with god and received gods wisdom first hand.
Some think:If I believe in God, go to church, and ask him to forgive me every time I do something bad, then I will go to heaven.
You forgot to add ; And hand over their last mite. The widows Mite. Luke 21:1-4
The goal for Christians isn't to go to heaven. It is to grow a relationship with God.
You certainly are behind in your bible studies, aren't you? "The goal" is, everlasting life. John 3:16
The end goal is not safety for self, but relationship with the creator.
Stop it! It is all about self preservation and securing your place in the here after in the presence of "the lord". Mathew 18:3. John 14:2.
Hell is separation from the creator, not a punishment.
Jesus! The relationship that you want with god is on a very poor foundation.
"They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might" Matthew25: 46. " 2Thessalonians 1; 9
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@YouFound_Lxam
Some Christians are blinded by new teachings in the modern church, that strive to exploit God for financial gain.
That will be Pastors, Priests and any other holy roller that can speak with a loud commanding voice and loves to inform his congregation that he has spoken with god and received gods wisdom first hand.
Some think:If I believe in God, go to church, and ask him to forgive me every time I do something bad, then I will go to heaven.
You forgot to add ; And hand over their last mite. The widows Mite. Luke 21:1-4
The goal for Christians isn't to go to heaven. It is to grow a relationship with God.
You certainly are behind in your bible studies, aren't you? "The goal" is, everlasting life. John 3:16
The end goal is not safety for self, but relationship with the creator.
Stop it! It is all about self preservation and securing your place in the here after in the presence of "the lord". Mathew 18:3. John 14:2.
Hell is separation from the creator, not a punishment.
Jesus! The relationship that you want with god is on a very poor foundation.
"They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might" Matthew25: 46. " 2Thessalonians 1; 9
And I believe that I am correct in pointing out to you that you have posted your thread in the wrong sub forum. It should have been posted here>>>
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@Elliott
I asked you:They believed he (Rushdie) has disrespected and insulted Islam i.e had committed blasphemy.What do you believe had caused them to believe this?#27I don’t know, I give up, you tell me.
Well as much as you appear to be playing ignorant, what caused them to believe this comes from Islamic teaching. The link I have shown you specifically state shariah is derived from two primary sources;
Sharia, or sharia law, is the Islamic legal system derived from the religious precepts of Islam, particularly the Quran and the Hadith.
The term sharia comes from the Arabic language term sharīʿah, Arabic: شريعة which means a body of moral and religious law derived from religious prophecy, as opposed to human legislation. Sharia deals with many topics, including crime, politics, and economics, as well as personal matters such as sexual intercourse, hygiene, diet, prayer, everyday etiquette and fasting. Adherence to sharia has served as one of the distinguishing characteristics of the Muslim faith historically. In its strictest and most historically coherent definition, sharia is considered in Islam as the infallible law of God. There are two primary sources of sharia: the Quran, and the Hadiths (opinions and life example of Muhammad).
I totally agree that Muslims should be encouraged to integrate but the hostility towards Muslims, the anti-Muslim rhetoric and attacking their holy book is not really conducive to this and as I said previously it creates a vicious circle of distrust and hate.#24
Encouraged by whom?
Does this report released today show any intention of encouragement to integrate, Elliot?
Didsbury Mosque 'turned a blind eye' to Islamist extremism before the Manchester Arena terror attack
A former Didsbury Mosque imam has told the Manchester Arena Inquiry support for terror groups was preached there.
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@Elliott
I had assumed that the law against blasphemy was in the Hadith as it is the basis for much of Sharia Law
Sharia, or sharia law, is the Islamic legal system derived from the religious precepts of Islam, particularly the Quran and the Hadith. The term sharia comes from the Arabic language term sharīʿah, Arabic: شريعة which means a body of moral and religious law derived from religious prophecy, as opposed to human legislation. Sharia deals with many topics, including crime, politics, and economics, as well as personal matters such as sexual intercourse, hygiene, diet, prayer, everyday etiquette and fasting. Adherence to sharia has served as one of the distinguishing characteristics of the Muslim faith historically. In its strictest and most historically coherent definition, sharia is considered in Islam as the infallible law of God. There are two primary sources of sharia: the Quran, and the Hadiths (opinions and life example of Muhammad).
"Those found guilty of blasphemy or apostasy or converted to another religion can be executed. The punishmnets for adultery including public flogging and stoning to death".
I asked you:
They believed he (Rushdie) has disrespected and insulted Islam i.e had committed blasphemy.
What do you believe had caused them to believe this?#27
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@Elliott
Indeed, obvious to us in the West and are non Muslim.But now taking into consideration what I have said about "conflict and houses" and the Quranic verse Quran8:39 above#16, I pose you the same question.Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle" when in 1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"? Yes or No?No.
Then you would be wrong from the Islamic stand point. They believed he has disrespected and insulted Islam i.e had committed blasphemy.
What do you believe had caused them to believe this?
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@Lemming
I like the truth, as I see it,
😒
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@Deb-8-a-bull
Two midgets could easly be a female Muslium.
And midgets are soon to lobby Parliament be recognised as giants so they can join the Kings Guard.
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@Elliott
And you missed my question;Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle" when in 1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"? Yes or No?Okay to answer your question and the answer is obviously “No,”
Indeed, obvious to us in the West and are non Muslim.
But now taking into consideration what I have said about "conflict and houses" and the Quranic verse Quran8:39 above#16, I pose you the same question.
Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle" when in 1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"? Yes or No?
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@Elliott
Would you like to show me the words"battle" or war in this verse below? Quran 4:89 - They wish you would disbelieve as they disbelieved so you would be alike. So do not take from among them allies until they emigrate for the cause of Allah. But if they turn away, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take not from among them any ally or helper.Here is the full quote. Again it clearly refers to actual conflict and the meaning of the bit you posted is not to take allies useless they support the cause of Allah and if they turn away, basically becoming traitors, kill them."4.89] They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.
I quoted it in full just have you have now repeated it.
And nothing there about "battle" is there? As you repeatedly insist here> #9
And it hasn't gone un-noticed that you replaced the word "battle " with 'conflict'.
But there again the "conflict" that you now refer to is as, is all about the "conflict" between the two houses; the house Islam and the house of war; Dar al-Islam and the Dar al-harb. <<<<<<<<<<<< right there, is your religious intolerance of anyone that isn't Muslim and intolerance of any country that isn't Islamic. Or didn't you know this?
Maybe that is why you ignored this clear command from the Quran and Allah himself.
Quran8:39
And fight them until there is no fitnah and the religion, all of it, is for Allah. And if they cease - then indeed, Allah is Seeing of what they do.
"Fitnah" means until there is no opposition to Allah or Islam. But you probably didn't know that either. The Quran teaches that all Muslims must fight "Jihad" holy war "until all the religion is for Allah". I suppose we in the West can thankful that not all Muslims adhere strictly to his command.
And you missed my question;
Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war or "battle" when in 1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"? Yes or No?
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@Elliott
Quotes from the Qur’an are often taken out of context to malign Muslims. The two relating to the beheading of infidels actually relate to rules of engagement in battle.(Qur'an 8:12) relates to a very specific time of the battle of Badr.And (Qur’an 47:4) to give the full quote: “When you meet the unbelievers (in battle), smite their necks until you have crushed them, then bind your captives firmly; thereafter (you are entitled to) set them free, either by an act of grace, or against ransom, until the war ends. That is for you to do.”
Your doctored apologetic quotes are simply not true, Elliot. And if I have to concede anything, I will admit that the Quran means what it says and says what it means.
You suggest these vile verses apply ONLY on "the battle field" or in "battle". Well you actually need to read this vile book for yourself. It shouldn't take you too long before you realise that Islam is a perpetual "battle" against anyone that doesn't accept, believe or submit to Allah and Islam.
Was Salman Rushdie engaged in war when he had when in 1989 he had a bounty put on his head for he simply writing a novel that Khomeini declared "blasphemous"?
That was over thirty-four years ago. In August last year he was brutally attacked in a failed attempt to murder him; being stabbed over a dozen times leaving him blind in one eye and with other life changing injuries.
Would you like to show me the words "battle" or war in this verse below?
Quran 4:89 - They wish you would disbelieve as they disbelieved so you would be alike. So do not take from among them allies until they emigrate for the cause of Allah. But if they turn away, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them and take not from among them any ally or helper.
And please, do not attempt to drop the " only a tiny minority" on us. Those School boys were suspended (probably for their own protection) because they had somehow offended Islam by scuffing a book all about total submission to Allah.
Islam is constant jihad = battle against the unbeliever.
Quran8:39
And fight them until there is no fitnah and the religion, all of it, is for Allah. And if they cease - then indeed, Allah is Seeing of what they do.
I believe the biggest sufferers of this barbaric ideology ISLAM are Muslims themselves.
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@BrotherD.Thomas
Lest you forget, the #1 Bible ignorant and stupid fool pseudo-christian, has to biblically accept that when Jesus is considered to be the Jewish Yahweh god incarnate, as many Trinitarians believe, then Jesus “Celestially Impregnated” his own mother Mary in an “incestuous way,” not only to be her son, but His own father as well! This is barring the Hebrew Tradition that since Joseph was not the paternal father, then Jesus would be considered to be a "bastard child!" This embarrassed poor ol’ Joseph so much, that he wanted to divorce Mary to save face. “Because Joseph her husband was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly” (Matthew 1:19)What an embarrassing beginning to start the religion of Christianity! I have learned as the ONLY TRUE Christian upon this Religion Forum , that I have to accept the above Bible FACTS, and just move on in the best way that I can. :(
An embarrassing beginning indeed Brother D. It must be the most unstable foundation and corner stone ever laid.
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Where will this end? Someone will die over this nonsense.
TEENAGERS SUSPENDED FROM SCHOOL IN UK FOR ‘MISHANDLING’ A COPY OF THE KORAN
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Seems I spoke too soon
The man accused of murdering Glasgow shopkeeper Asad Shah has issued a statement saying he carried out the killing because he believed Mr Shah had "disrespected" Islam.
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@BrotherD.Thomas
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@Deb-8-a-bull
Melcharaz wrote
@Deb-8-a-bull. if you wish to challenge the scriptures, do so directly.#116
And then get blocked for stating the scripture directly and pointing out the multiple flaws and contradictions.
@Deb-8-a-bull . am not afraid of truthful inquiry without disregard.#116
Of course you are. You hate the fact that members highlight your own double standards, hypocrisy and bible duncery.
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@FLRW
FLRW wrote: Top 10 Countries with the Highest Percentage of Atheists - WIN-Gallup 2017:9. Australia - 69% #104The Reverend wrote: Australia did not have 69% of its countries as atheists. Even now religious people make up well over 50% of the population. https://www.abs.gov.au/articles/religious-affiliation-australiaSo your study is incorrect. #105
Who will be first to point out the glaring difference to between both polls to the Reverend? Here's a clue. One of these polls posted above is concerned with atheists the other isn't. The other poll in fact clearly points out that although Christianity is still Australia’s most common religion Christianity has decreased by more than 1 million people. Thereby showing Christianity Australia's highest decline of all its religions.
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The Reverend that also claims to be a lawyer wrote:#43
The first rule of law, the lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client.
Fk me. For someone that also claims to be a lawyer himself, one would have thought he would get that famous adage correct.
And it is not "the 1st rule of law" either. It is simply an adage. A simple truthful observation attributed to Abe Lincoln.
The 1st rule of law is that ; No freemen shall be taken or imprisoned or disseised or exiled or in any way destroyed, nor will we go upon him nor send upon him, except by the lawful judgment of his peers or by the law of the land.
Those poor clients.
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@BrotherD.Thomas
As usual, the #1 Bible ignorant and stupid fool does not give any peered reviewed citations to support the propositions in the initial post regarding Atheists, and again uses hearsay, hypotheticals, and wanting opinions, just like when discussing the Bible.
10/10 👍 spot on.
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@Sidewalker
"blashemer" makes it sound like you smote them in the name of drunk Jesus.
Well he and his crew loved their wine. So much so, that he made wine from water, And by the vat full.
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@zedvictor4
You too, Vic lad. All the best to Mrs Vic.
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@zedvictor4
They probably went through the religious forum and decided.Atheist, Block.Atheist, Block.Atheist, Block.Which as I see it, means that we defeated them on Day one.
Fair point, Vic. As in:
Atheist had to correct me multiple times on the bible. Block
Atheist knows scriptures more than I ever will. Block.
Atheist shows me to be a complete bible dunce. Block.
Atheist has exposed me for the a complete and utter liar that I am. Block
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@BrotherD.Thomas
devil. I rebuke you in the name of Jesus Christ. you are a liar and a blashemer. there is no truth in you.you will leave this place in the name of Jesus Christ. i plead the blood, i take authority over you in the name of Jesus Christ and i cast you out!
The Power of Christ Compels You, Brother
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