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TheUnderdog

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Why are people so against consent forms?
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@WyIted
How?  Do you have sex with monkeys?  If so, then monkeys don't deserve the same rights as humans.  I don't think it should be a felony to kill and rape a monkey.
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Why are people so against consent forms?
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I would say that anybody you fear enough to want a form out of shouldn't be someone you engage in intimate relations with
If that's the case, then you are talking about trusting someone with my life, where they can turn me in to the cops claiming I raped them (with DNA "evidence").  I can claim it was consensual, but then I don't think I would get off easy.  I am not trusting someone with so much power.

but I've also said marriage contracts should be explicit and legally binding
Marital rape shouldn't be legal and it should be punishable with death.

It would have to be a little more complicated than you describe to be actually useful.
How so?

I don't want to give anybody any power over me if they decide to put me in jail over a rape charge that was consensual sex.
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Imagine a test
It's a test with as many questions as you want, all the questions are in theory very easy, they are all true/false, but if you get even one answer wrong, you are a felon.  You aren't allowed to ask for help because that "ruins the mood" and you are expected to read her mind.

Are you going to want to take that test and even answer a single question?  I wouldn't want too.

That's what sex is to me.  Every answer has to be correct (consensual) or else you are a felon.

If that's reality, then I want 0 questions on my test.  I can't get any wrong if I don't answer any questions.

"Safe words".  If she uses a safe word, then you have already done something sexual to her without her consent.  So if she uses a safe word on you, then you are a rapist until the definition of rape changes to someone that has sex immediately after the safe word is uttered by either party.

I want no questions on my test.
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Why are people so against consent forms?
I think it solves as good evidence that the sex you had was consensual.

I've heard people want privacy.  Then why can't you print out 2 forms in the privacy of your home?
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Boycott the NFL, NHL, MLB, and NBA
All of these leagues have divisions (races) and they try to get a diverse group of teams from all the divisions to compete in the playoffs and if you are a really good team, but enough other teams are a lot better, then you don't get in because a higher ceded team from a worse division took your spot.

It's Affirmative Action.

It should be a strict meritocracy.

Don't judge by the content of their record, not by whether that division has privilege or not by other teams tending to do better.

Affirmative action is bad.

I genuinely believe this, so I don't watch sports to protest.  But anybody that watches professional sports is supporting Affirmative Action.

This is fine; you have free speech, but just understand that.
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@Dr.Franklin
Why not?

Is it, "my body, my choice"?  If so, it seems pretty hypocritical because you wouldn't give a woman the same liberty.

If not, then what's the reason?
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@Dr.Franklin
So would you get a vasectomy before you have sex?

It prevents virtually all abortions and pre vasectomy sperm can be stored in a hospital freezer if you ever want kids with a consenting woman.
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@Dr.Franklin
What's wrong with what?  Abortion?

Aren't you pro life?
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@ludofl3x
but the whole "I'm above all this" and this weird "look at how smart I am compared to anyone who I think is in a political party" is exceptionally off putting. 
Andrew Tate acts similarly.  Trump acts similarly.  A lot of people like strong leaders.

 And this board is full of absolutely awful personalities, don't feel alone.
You are getting upset at me for thinking I'm better than everyone else around me when you are implying that you are better than everyone else on DART?  It sounds kindof hypocritical.

Get you a blow job and tell me you think "Well, I don't need that again."
This would be like saying, "Snort some crack and then tell me that you don't need it again".

If I snorted crack, then I would feel like I need it again.

Same with a blowjob.

Sex is addicting; it's why you should get a vasectomy before you do it again.  I will get a vasectomy before I lose my virginity because I try to not be a hypocrite.
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@DavidAZZ
If enduring pain is the qualities of a man, how about you let that sperm live and produce a baby or two and stick around to raise that child to become a productive person of society.  Now you are talking about pain and therefore, a man.  No unwanted pregnancies and no abortions!  Problem solved!
What if I don't want kids?

What if the girl doesn't want kids?

If the guy and woman want kids, this is why you store pre vasectomy sperm in a hospital freezer for if/when you want to have kids.

People should not be forced to wait until they want kids to have sex.  But a vasectomy is a good way to do all of the following with pretty much 100% certainty:

  1. Unprotected sex without the desire to reproduce
  2. No unplanned pregnancies
  3. No abortions


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@DavidAZZ
He'll get his clock cleaned by women soon enough.
Really?  The dude telling men to get a vasectomy so unplanned pregnencies aren't produced and so that women don't have to pick between unplanned pregnancy and abortion?  That dude.

Someone is weaker than the girl they fuck (it's not me) and is too scared of 1 day of ball pain.
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@ludofl3x
Man, it's really hard to go around just not getting any attention from women at all, huh? 
I don't really ask women out that much.  I'm abstinent and I welcome permanent abstinence if that is what happens.

Maybe it's your terrible personality
I obsess about politics (so do most of the people here) but how is my personality that terrible?


"if he had worn a rubber, I'm not sure I'd have felt much of anything at all, oh shit, he's calling again"
I don't have a small dick, but if you are that insecure about dick size, it might be projection.  It takes really small dick energy to send a message at me and not tag me because you are worried about my response.  It's one thing if you forgot to tag; it's another thing if you just don't.

You're not really like this, right?
My internet persona pretty much matches my real life persona.  If that means I don't get laid ever, I'm fine with that.

I'm more scared about being permanently unemployed than I am about having a girlfriend.

I don't need sex.  I'm happy without it.
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@Intelligence_06
Unless you are a biomed or bioeng major who can develop a way for humans to reproduce asexually, ideals like this are dangerous. I mean, how are humanity supposed to progress as humanity if they are told the smartest thing to do is to end one's bloodline?
Store pre vasectomy sperm in a hospital freezer so you have kids with a consenting woman when/if she agrees too.

No more unplanned pregnencies and virtually no more abortions.
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@Dr.Franklin
What's the point?? 1 sentence por favor

To virtually end abortion while letting dudes have condom free sex with females who aren't on painful birth control for months.
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Something I noticed with Christians
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@Tradesecret
If people know they are going to die in a plane crash, there are going to be lots of different responses. That's what happened on the Titanic. And it has happened in lots of other examples of impending tragedy as well.  It is not incredibly unlikely for many people. And celebration is going to look differently in each situation. I doubt that many will pick up a glass of champagne. But some will be incredibly calm. And this is true. Others who have no clue will obviously be freaking out. 

I think common sense indicates the opposite.

 If however you are in a relationship with Christ, you won't want to commit suicide. 
Why not?

A person who is in a relationship with Christ has already had their sins forgiven, past, present, and future. Yet if you have rejected Christ, you actually stop yourself from the possibility of forgiveness if you kill yourself before you repent. 
So then repent, accept Jesus for insurance's sake, and then commit suicide to go to heaven.

I don't know if murdering someone is worse that suicide. 
Is rape worse than mastrabation?  Obviously.

Murder and rape you do to others without their consent.  Suicide and masturbation you do to yourself with your consent.

How can something be in God's plan and not his will?
I explained that above. 
I didn't understand the message.

It would also be a gamble to not put my trust in Hades that he will spare me from the underworld and so I can join Zeus at Olympia, or take a gamble and sacrifice myself (or commit suicide) so I don't end up in Xibalba.
It would actually be a gamble to put your trust in Hades. No one has ever historically tried to find Hades, or Zeus for that matter. No one thinks that they historically lived.
The ancient Greeks believed that Zeus was a real God that lived on the earth.
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Something I noticed with Christians
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@Tradesecret
People in that situation don't generally celebrate that they are going to heaven. And yet some might.
It is incredibly unlikely that a random person, no matter how religious they think they are, would celebrate if they knew their plane was going to crash and they were going to die.

But suicide is not the unforgiveable sin.
So it's forgivable then, meaning I can kill myself and if Jesus paid for my sin, I get to go to heaven?

I don't think God wants people to commit suicide. I am pretty sure the Bible is opposed to unlawful killing.
The bible is against murder.  But murdering someone is worse than suicide.  If God would forgive a repentant murderer, then he easily should forgive someone that committed suicide.

 It may well end up being that you commit suicide. If so, then that was God's plan for your life. But it certainly is not his will.
How can something be in God's plan and not his will?

 It would be a gamble not to try and make sure you are part of his family. It would be a gamble to trust in yourself. It would be a gamble to think it doesn't matter. Yet it would be reasonable to trust in Jesus for he is the king of kings and he is God.  It would be a gamble not to trust in God. 
It would also be a gamble to not put my trust in Hades that he will spare me from the underworld and so I can join Zeus at Olympia, or take a gamble and sacrifice myself (or commit suicide) so I don't end up in Xibalba.
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@FLRW
OMG, I'm a pussy man !     OMG, I'm a Trump !
I meant you are a man who acts like a whiny bitch.  "Oh; I don't want to be in pain for a day to prevent months of pain endured by my girl.  I need women to carry the bigger cross.  I'm so helpless".'

Just:

1. Shut up
2. Be a man
3. Endure for his family.


Unless you believe you are less capable of pain endurance than the woman that you have sex with.
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@DavidAZZ
I like sounding like Andrew Tate.

Sometimes I don't like what he says, but I'll give credit where it's due.
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@Intelligence_06
Your father will hear about this. And your grandfather. 
They had no idea they could do this, so they are exempt.

Current young men have no excuse.

Half of my grandfathers are dead, the other half got a vasectomy.

My Dad is pro choice and also had no idea he could do this.  Now that he has kids and doesn't have sex anymore, there is no point.

What is even more laughable, and not even just tangentially so, is that "2", "2" and "4" require links to understand what they even represent and, believe me when I say this, has BARELY ANY relations to the idea of 2 or 4. This ain't integral spin or beta decay, nor is this an alpha particle consisting or two neutrons and two protons. This "equation" if you can even call it so merely demonstrates the concept of addition and nothing more than that, and the fact that the length and density you have put into your "proof" in order to illustrate the additive property of these two "2"'s (which I may or may not understand based on just what that is) makes it infinitely worse...
I could have done, "a+b=c" and it would convey the same message.

basically how Ebuc rolls on this hellscape of a land, and instead I got whatever this is.
This is classic ebuc:

Ok that said, now onto my 2D pattern of the 3D torus. So next are the three nucleated hexagons.

0...1...5p.....3p.....6.....4...2p and this is representative of Fullers concept of off-center { the nucleus see Fullers concepts } >


3p...5p..7p....6......9.....8....4..... > more specifically, the nuclei represent tainted { see Fullers concepts } reality >


6..7p..11p......9....12...10....8.....> i.e. our occupied space reality is complementary to occupied space Gravity and occupied space Dark Energy and Meta-space mind/intellect/concepts and ego.

Here below is the 2D version of the 3D Quantum Space-time torus and its 14 nodal events = 91 lines-of-relationship i.e. 14^2, minus 14 and divided by 2 = 91. 91 / 7 = 13 and here we have the same numerical resultant as the 12-around-1 sphericals of the nucleated VE

.....1..................5p......7p.....................11p..........13p.....
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0.............................6...................................12................
................3p.............................9...................................
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-
..........2p........4....................8........10..............................

The immediate problem in my scenario, is that in this 14 nodal event minimal quantum pulse, the two lines inside the toroidal tube, are our classically observed, physical reality  ---see the sine-wave association /\/\/\/\/ of 0..3p...6.....9.  in past my geodesic representations only considered all of pertinent entanglement was in the outer Gravity { positive curvature } geodesics and the inner Dark Energy { negative curvature } Geodesics.
I'm just doing 2+2=4.  It's not the same thing.

Is this clickbait?

Or is it a live demonstration that Americans really, really, don't understand math and will keep chucking irrelevant mathematical concepts into whatever they wish before they can be seen as making sense in any way possible?

You decide.
What is clickbait?


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@Dr.Franklin
In the comic sense, yes.  Funny while also making a point.
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Something I noticed with Christians
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@YouFound_Lxam
If you accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior, and have true faith in him, then yes. 
I don't believe I will ever have true faith in anything in the afterlife.  What if you are wrong?  What if there is nothing?  It's a gamble.  The next time you think you have faith in God, if there is a plane on fire that you are on and it's very high up in the sky, celebrate, because according to you, you are about to go to heaven.

Nobody on a burning plane 4 kilometers up in the air is celebrating that they will soon go to heaven.  They may pray as insurance, but doing that isn't having faith.

Now, if we use your mindset, and commit suicide because we know we will get a better life, that is self-serving, and it proves that you aren't really a Christian, because you just took your faith off of God and put it into yourself and your own plan to have a better life. 
But I would be having faith that I get to go to heaven.  God's looking out for me, isn't he?

Suicide is not part of Gods plan.
You don't know what God's plan is.  His plan could have had me commit suicide, maybe caused some people to be sad, have them get tougher skins, and be better people because of it.

The Holocaust was part of God's plan if God is all knowing and all powerful and he exists.  If it wasn't, then the Holocaust wouldn't have happened.

Christians: He only pays for repented sins.
This is false. 
Then what sins does God pay for?
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@ADreamOfLiberty
That's pure projection. You think everyone is blindly loyal to a party and thus you assume they would be emotionally motivated over something that has no practical significance.
The party's name has weight for a lot of people.  If you think someone not in power with the same beleifs AOC would temporarily switch parties to the republican party to vote against Trump, that doesn't make any sense.  Not that many republicans did that with Biden and RFK (or even with Marian Williamson who came out as anti vaccine mandate and I think Marian Williamson is more like RFK than she is like Biden).




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Something I noticed with Christians
Me: So Christians; do you believe Jesus paid for everyone's sins?

Christians: Yes.

Me: So I automatically go to heaven?

Christians: Yes.

Me: So why do I have to be Christain?  I'm going to heaven no matter what.

Christians: You only go to heaven if you believe in God and Jesus.

Me: You believe in God and Jesus and you believe when you die, you will go to heaven?

Christians: Yes.

Me: And you believe living in heaven is unimaginably better than life here?

Christians: Yes.

Me: And Jesus paid for all of your sins, so because you believe in him, you get to go to heaven when you die (even if you commit a crime or sin as bad as murder)?

Christians: Yes.

Me: I (as an atheist) don't want you to do this, but what's stopping you from committing suicide?  You are going to heaven if you commit suicide because you would die.  If you believe suicide is a sin, Jesus paid for that sin, because according to you, he paid for all sins.

Christians: He only pays for repented sins.

Me: Hold on now.  Your god will forgive a murderer or a child rapist that genuinely repents before he dies, but he won't forgive a suicidal person that repents after death?  What about a genuine atheist that doesn't think there is a god and repents (but after death)?

This is the difference between being sheep smart and being lion smart; the person with sheep smarts repeats what they've heard (and their memory is good, but their critical thinking skills suck).  The lion smart person has more critical thinking; if the idea makes sense; then they accept it.  Otherwise, they try and figure out a rationale and moral response to it. 

If you believe a pre death repentant murderer deserves the right to heaven more than a post death repentant atheist, I do not like that morality at all and I fail to see how any critical thinker would disagree with me on at least that.

It's not pro-life, it's not pro law and order, it's not pro victimless liberty, and it's anti free thinking to believe a murderer should get treated better than an atheist simply because they repented.

But it's faith; and you can't challenge faith and expect people to change their minds no matter how good your argument is.
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If you have a girlfriend,

2 + 2 =  4

Vasectomy + Negative STI tests that you and your girlfriend have = Right to raw dog consenting women (who I would assume would want raw dogging if you have a vasectomy and she and you test negative for STIs).

Alpha men get vasectomies before sex so they can raw dog.  Beta males (Bottom G) are scared of a day of ball pain.

Be a man.  Get vasectomized before you have sex.  Earn your right to raw dog.

Short term pain brings long term pleasure.  Discipline + time -> freedom.  Alpha men do the tough thing and bear the cross for their relationships.  Beta males put all the birth control pressure on their women (who endure months of pain vs you enduring one day of pain).

I will get a vasectomy before I have sex.  I'm not a pussy; I don't want people thinking my girlfriend is tougher than I am because she can endure months of birth control pain whereas I can't endure one day of vasectomy pain.

Pre vasectomy sperm samples can be stored in a hospital freezer when you want kids with a consenting woman.

Only pussy men have sex before they get a vasectomy.

Be the man; no pain no gain.  Endure before you release into a woman.

Lets end abortion (and unwanted pregnancy pain).

Be a man; be tough.

If you are a woman; only date men willing to prove their toughness.
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DeSantis denies guy born in the inner city government welfare

I don't like welfare kings that are from the inner city.
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Pro lifers should be more honest with the label they call themselves
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@Best.Korea
The arguments which you are presenting are a bit cruel, but one can understand your point of view and it is difficult to argue against.
Well, it's not wrong, so the tone is irrelevant.

I just dont have a way of weighting the value of human lives, some of which might be contributing more to the benefit of society which we dont know about, some of which might be harming society in unknown ways.
Who deserves the right to live more?  Bill Gates (philanthropist) or Jeffery Epstein (a guy who did things so bad to children that not even NAMBLA supports Epstein)?

Saying both of these people deserve the right to live equally is just incorrect.
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Pro lifers should be more honest with the label they call themselves
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@Benjamin
They generally oppose universal healthcare, social security for single mothers, cheap and accesible education and the living wage. More grotesquely many support the detention and deportation of immigrants, the protection of a corrupt and trigger happy police system, many even support foreign invasions and bombing, not to mention the diplomatic and military support of genocides like the one in Gaza. 
That's (mostly) just a product of fiscal conservatism; trying to cut government spending.

Are you saying it's a contradiction to be pro life and fiscally conservative?

Though I don't think that the rich as a rule are more valuable than the poor. 

For example, it would be less unfortunate if a homeless person died in an accident than a doctor
These 2 statements generally contradict each other.  The doctor became rich by helping others.

Being rich is good and every American should strive to be rich even if they aren't.

Wealth is good; money is good.  If you disagree, give your money to a homeless guy.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
If anecdotes are irrelevant then how could you possibly have information to the effect of "Primary Party switching is very rare."
If it was common, then the % of people claiming to be democrat would fluctuate wildly from like 15% to 50%.

It stays much more level than that; about 1/3 of the country is democrat; about 1/3 republican; about 1/3 independent.

They only need to switch back if they need to affect a primary in the other party. The guy in the video does not need to switch back to vote for Biden.
He would though; it's not like a guy like that would call himself a republican.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Thats an anecdote.

What % of people party switch solely for a primary and then switch back?
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Pro lifers should be more honest with the label they call themselves
If a white person who really liked BLM (and BLM is their main issue) didn’t want black people getting killed by the police because they viewed a black person as their genuine equal, I should have no problem (and they should have no problem) with me calling them a Black Rights Activist.

So pro lifers; as people that are born, should have no problem accepting the, “Zygote Rights Activist” label because you believe a zygote is your equal. And that’s fine.
Just be honest and don’t be afraid of looking foolish; there are many people that agree with you on this.

You will turn many (maybe most) people off from your movement, but at least you are being honest.

And you should not be offended or try and weasel your way out of the label, “Zygote Rights Activist” because you believe a Zygote is your equal.  You believe neither one of you should get homicided, and currently zygotes are legally homicided in most states, and you want to end that.

So just accept the label, "Zygote Rights activist".

Me; I don't view a zygote as my equal; I don't even view a 3 year old kid as my equal.  If I had to pick between burning myself alive to the death or burning a 3 year old alive to the death; I'm picking the 3 year old (because of personal bias). If the typical person is unwilling to spend $1/day to save the life of a starving 3 year old from dying of starvation (burning to death takes a few hours; starving to death takes weeks so it's more painful), then why should I be willing to give my life to save somebody else?

If I had to pick betweena 5 year old kid dying or a 25 year old dying; I'm picking the one that doesn't have a job yet (the 5 year old kid).

People prefer the 5 year old because they are younger; by believing this, they would then believe that they lose value as they age.

If you think young people are more valuable than adults, next time you are trying to hire someone for a job, hire Timmy the 2 year old from daycare.  

People love babies because they are cute.  I don't like babies because they are useless and loud and often can't even speak English.

I like rich; smart; independent, fast.

I like Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, and Bill Gates.  They are rich; their companies produce.

Socialism is bad; I prefer capitalism.

Now I wouldn't have the 5 year old kid die if the alternative is nothing; I respect a 5 year old's right to not get murdered.

But I'm just saying I would rather khave this person stay alive:


then this person alive:


Cute to me is a euphemism for the intersection of small, good looking, and stupid.

I don't like stupid; I like smart.  I don't like poor; I like rich.  I don't like dependence.  I like independence.

I don't like Chuch Music; I like Rock and Roll.

I don't like CA and AL; I like NV and FL.

If I had to pick between Person A or Person B dying:


The ugly one has got to go.  I wouldn't want the ugly one dying for no reason; but if I had to pick one dying, the strong deserve to live more than the weak.

I like winners; not losers!

In fact, I would go a step further.  If Group 1 or Group 2 had to die:

Group 1: Elon Musk and Bill Gates

Group 2: 10 homeless people

I would rather have Group 2 die.  1 Person that significently positively changes the world deserves the right to live more than 500 homeless people.  With 500 homeless people not existing; the world becomes virtually unchanged.  Bill Gates doesn't exist; no more Microsoft.

It's possible for someone's extrinsic worth to be more than their worth for being a human being.

Everyone's intrinsic value to me is A+B+C.  A is their worth just for being human (Bill Gates has the same A value as a homeless guy).  B is what they have currently done for society - what they took from society and what we can reasonably expect them to take from society (B for Bill Gates is thousands of times the value of A for Bill Gates).  A 12 year old kid's B value is higher than a 3 year old kid; they will be in public school for less.  C is an unknown quantity; it's what they might do in the future.

A+B+C=Intrinsic Value.  Extrinsic Value=B.

Not all born innocent people deserve the right to live equally, but the A value for every person is equal and positive.  If you do a crime as bad as murder, rape, or similar, for you; B=-A, and C=0.  You can't be freed, and it costs too much money to keep someone alive who has 0 intrinsic worth, so you should get killed by beheading, with your blood and organs being used to save the lives of Patriots!  If you are a left winger, I can replace the bolded words with low income people in the hospital who are disproportionally people of color.


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@ADreamOfLiberty
It doesn't matter if they like her. They will vote for her if voting for her reduces the chance of what to them is an unacceptable outcome.
Then they can't vote for Biden.  You only get one vote during any one primary.  Primary Party switching is very rare.

No, the northern vote would have been suppressed. There were tons of people who did not feel the duty to die to free slaves. 
Then why did they die for slaves in our timeline? 

Lincoln claimed he wanted to "preserve the union", but if this was the case, he would let slave states expand at the same rate as free states.

Lincoln wanted to in the long run ban slavery nationwide and if he was upfront with that, the northern vote would be energized (kind of hoe Beto unapologetically wanting to ban AR 15s made him very popular among democrats and Beto did better than a normal democrat in Texas [a state known for loose gun laws and gun culture; probably more than any other state]).
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What is a woman?
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@Double_R
As a generalization, yes of course.

I would say pretty much exclusively.  If they were a pro choice Trump supporter, they would be pro choice, but they wouldn't put a pro choice bumper sticker on their car.  Same thing with a "transwomen are women" believer that likes Trump.

People are afraid to challenge their team.

If I have a car that has many left and right bumper stickers (something like Reparations now, Transwomen are women, Pro life, End the Mandates), you don't know how I would lean.  I respect that combination (even though I don't agree 100%).

But when you are having conversation with an individual, and especially when the point that individual has been making to you is that you do not have as good of an understanding of alternative viewpoints as you think, anyone who actually cares about a productive dialog would refrain from telling the individual you are talking to how they think or what they would think under certain circumstances.
That I get.  But people on the internet are different.  Normies that I meet on the street aren't as likely to be partisan hacks as internet people (I'd say about 50% are partisan hacks for one party or the other).
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@ADreamOfLiberty
In this book there are aliens whose evolutionary history rendered them exclusively capable of direct telepathy without deception. 
Oh man; if they read my mind, maybe those fuckers could help me out with my crazy thoughts.

Those alien motherfuckers need to be therapists.  They actually would know how my mind works.

So to be clear about what you should be very aware of as a human being: People do not always do what they say they will do. People's behavior can't be predicted by a simplistic list of "good" and "bad".
What does this have to dow with Nikki Haley?  She may have been lying, but we assume a politician is telling the truth.  Otherwise, Biden might be pro life, but since he says he's pro choice, he might actually be pro life, but we as normal people assume Biden is pro choice if he says he's pro choice.

"The left does not like Nikki Haley" as if that somehow proves a left-triber wouldn't cast a vote for her? 
Most left wingers would vote for Biden over her.  They would support her over Trump, I get that.  But in a general election; Biden vs Haley; most left wingers would vote for Biden.

Speaking of the civil war, that was full of subversion by both sides. The southern aristocracy knew they were fighting for slavery, said as much publicly (to the right crowds); but they told the average southerner it was about state's rights and they meant it even if it was secondary to preserving slavery for them.

Lincoln denied it was about slavery more than once, to preserve political power; given the full historical context it's as obvious as the Himalayan mountains that the abolitionists including Lincoln were always going to leap at any chance to abolish slavery and that without that motivation there would have been no civil war (as the south easily saw through Lincoln's obfuscations about his  beliefs).
This is true.  Although if Lincoln said in his election, "I want to abolish slavery nationwide", the south wouldn't have voted for him (they didn't in our own timeline), but then the norhtern vote would have been even more energized (same with the southern vote).

It would be kindof like Beto O Rouke; who said, "Hell yes; we're taking your AR 15" and (although I don't like Beto), the left wing Texans loved him.  He did better than other democrats in Texas.

People like bluntness.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Very much like how left-tribers are currently voting for Niki Haley.
I don't think that's accurate.  Nikki Haley refused to say at a Town Hall that the civil war was about slavery.

The left does not like Nikki Haley.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I never said it was.
You said it's the reason you became a democrat.


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@IwantRooseveltagain
I'm not saying act on the 26%, I'm saying don't act on the 74% when it comes to values we impose on kids.  If it's 95%, fine.  If it's 74%, not fine.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
But we make policies based on the percentages of Americans that support certain policies.

Some Americans want right wing religious law (but not left wing religious law).  It's not ideologically consistent, but there are a lot of them.  Just like if there was an idea that was right wing and majoritarian (like anti trans beliefs), you wouldn't want Matt Walsh videos being shown in public schools.  You wouldn't want the, "What is a woman?" movie being played in public schools.  There are even many atheists that don't agree with trans ideology.

You wouldn't want right wing stuff being played in public schools, so don't play Planned Parenthood indoctrination either.
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@Double_R
I don't think it's useless; it's how low IQ people are
Agreed, only a Lowe IQ person would think telling others what they believe it's a great way to have a productive conversation
It's easy to pick up on patterns.  If someone has this bumper sticker:


It's safe to say they also believe in this:

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@ADreamOfLiberty
If you were wondering what county politics caused me to register as a democrat, it was fighting unequal application of county codes.
How is that a left wing idea?  It's like saying what caused someone to be a republican was they liked working out.  Working out and county codes aren't political.


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@Double_R
We've been teaching kids that slavery was wrong for over a century.
We started indoctrinating kids that slavery was wrong way after the first point pretty much everyone in the US was anti slavery.  We weren't teaching that in 1850.  We may have been teaching it in 1920 maybe.

That is objectivity a progressive point of view
This is correct.  Credit where it's due.  Something the left and right often don't do to me.  And slavery should be illegal nationwide.

It's only indoctrination when one disagrees with it.
I use the term, "indoctrination" for both views that I agree and disagree with.  For me, education is teaching something that is true (something like 2+2=4).  Saying, "Slavery should be illegal" is an opinion I and pretty much everybody strongly agree with, but it's an opinion and therefore indoctrination.  Something like, "The answer to a hard math problem is A when many people believe it's B,C,D, or E" is controversial, but it's education.

 It's notable that it tends to come from the most religious segment of the population, their entire worldview is the product of indoctrination. 
I don't support religious indoctrination in public schools; although private school is different.  Just like if there is a private school that advertises that it's a pro LGBT school, if they teach pro LGBT talking points at that school, I would be fine with it.  Religious schools are private schools.

How many children do we see at Trump rallies with MAGA hats being interviewed by right wing reporters praising the children for being so smart? Ron Desantis ran in Florida an ad for governor showcasing him teaching his child to follows MAGA while he was still in the crib. None of these anti-indoctrination people cared.
That's parents stating their values to their kids.  That I think is ok.  Just like Cori Bush (a politician I don't like) homeschools her kid because the kid thought (whether due to Cori Bush or otherwise) that she experienced systemic racism at the public school she went too.  Cori Bush homeschools her kid; and she probably programmed very left wing values in her kid; values I'm not the biggest fan of.  I see no problem with Cori Bush doing that; because it's not the government teaching values; it's the parents.

Because to me, that's what you want because it helps retain power for the democratic party.
Has it ever occurred to you that a person might hold a core set of values?
Roosevelt definitely has a core set of values (anti-unwanted pain).  I'm not denying that.  If I want to convince Roosevelt of any opinion, I have to do so through the anti unwanted pain lens.  But his values are easier to implement the more common they are in society.  Imagine it's 1840; lets say the Northern states represent the modern day republicans and the southern states represent the modern day democrats (if you / the left wants to be affiliated with the North; fine, reverse the analogy).  Lets say the undeveloped west represents the youth; completely malleable and could fall for either side.

If you are the north, you want the entire west to be free states so you have more power to enact your agenda against the south.  If you are the south, vice versa is true.  The stronger the North's anti slavery values are, the more they are going to want the west to be in their favor and vice versa for the south.

If you are on the left, you would want the entire youth to become left wingers so you have more power to enact your agenda against the republicans.  If you are the republicans, vice versa is true.  The stronger the left's values are, the more they are going to want the youth to be in their favor and vice versa for the conservatives.  This is even if the values aren't consistent.  With being pro or anti slavery, there is only one issue, so people will come to their own conclusions on it.  The same can be true for multiple issues if there is a common thread that links them together other than party affiliation.  The democrats can use anti-unwanted pain as their ethos.  The republicans don't have an ethos.  Lets say the republicans became modified libertarians; they believe you should be allowed to do whatever you want as long as you aren't harming others to a significant degree.  Some issues (increased military budget, corporate welfare, immigration policies, some drug policies) are going to have to be dropped, but then the GOP would have a consistent ethos; victimless liberty for adults.

At that point, the stronger your values are, the more you would want them programmed onto America's kids, so you have a higher chance of having your values become the reality of the US.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Correct, but what's the relevance?  Gay sex is a choice and about 26% of the US population wants to ban it. 
Wait, are you suggesting that while being gay is not a choice, having sex as a gay person is a choice, a choice that other people should be able to ban? That’s absurd.
I don't want to ban gay sex and I don't think gay sex should be banned anywhere in the US, but 26% of the country wants it banned because of the bible and they are Christian theocrats on that issue.  They want to ban gay sex to try and prevent gay people from going to hell and suffering there forever because of a god they can't control.  They would like it if God didn't threaten eternal hell; but they can't control God and God controls who burns in hell vs who goes to heaven.

They aren't consistent with this pro theocracy position though.

give me a specific example of these “leftist talking points” that “program” kids.
  1. The left telling kids that transwomen are real women, claiming a woman is anyone who identifies as a woman, and punishing kids who do what you would logically do if they think transgenderism is inaccurate; misgender deliberatly on ideological grounds.  Just like the city Barrow changed it's name to Utgitvick (kindof like transitioning from white to Native).  If you disagree with the name change, you are logically going to continue to call the city Barrow because you prefer the White Anglo American name to the Native one.
  2. When left wing teachers try and claim Reagan was racist for wanting to cut taxes.  The right likes Reagan, so it would be saying the right like a racist guy.  Totally fine to say that at a political rally.  But don't indoctrinate the kids.

Both of these things happened to me when I was in school.


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Please spread this.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Why is it controversial? Because the morons think it’s immoral.
Those, "morons" were in the majority just 15 years ago.  The more people an insult applies to, the less strong the insult is.  Now, it's like 26% of the population the insult would apply too.  When homophobia rates in the US dip below 10%, then you can start teaching about it in schools like interracial marriage.

Adults wouldn’t discuss abortion with a 6 year old anymore than they would discuss a hysterectomy or a vasectomy.
Nobody is running on banning hysterectomies or a vasectomies.  But if the youth becomes pro choice due to teacher indoctrination, the left would win the abortion issue as time goes on.

Being gay is not a choice anymore than being black is a choice.
Correct, but what's the relevance?  Gay sex is a choice and about 26% of the US population wants to ban it.  When there's that much opposition, have the law legalize gay sex, but don't be programming kids with leftist talking points.  89% of young adults are already on board (U.S. Same-Sex Marriage Support Holds at 71% High (gallup.com)).

Maybe in 30 years or so, you can integrate gay marraige in now when the homophobes mostly died of old age, but not now.
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@Double_R
if all of that happened, I believe your mind would change on the issue.
Do you have any other useless predictions on what I would believe that you'd rather share as opposed to just asking me what I think?
I don't think it's useless; it's how low IQ people are (low IQ as anyone that is in the bottom 90% of the country or so by intelligence).  So average; basically.  Not gifted; mediocre.



Is it, "Can't think of very many.", or is it, "Nothing.  The left is always correct."?  Part of me thinks it's the ladder.
Spoke too soon.
What do you mean?
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Even if Trump and PETA opposed eating bugs, that does not mean PETA supports Trump (or should support Trump).
PETA supports Trump, per the link I sent.  Although if they want people to be vegan, it's not a good idea to claim Trump is vegan in a place like Manhattan.  Manhattan hates Trump.

There is no connection here, and if you genuinely thought there was your mental processes are currently subnormal.
I just thought it was funny that a left wing group backed a right wing POTUS candidate.
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@Best.Korea
But what I also noticed is that my depression didnt appear even once since then. Of course, it was collerated with lack of masturbation, so maybe that had some effect too.
Well, lets see, you won't masturbate to adults; masturbating to kids (which you would want to do) is illegal and it's better for your sake if you don't do it, because the law is not on your side.

Maybe buy a jerk off machine and just use that to get your nut out.

Or do pushups.  Pushups help me be tougher and more disciplined.
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@Double_R
 I am generally fine with government technology that allows them to "spy" on us to a reasonable extent provided it makes us safer.
The patriot act is backed by the majority in both parties(Americans Generally Comfortable With Patriot Act (gallup.com)).  Although if Trump said we need to spy on American households and keep the Patriot Act, right wing media called it fighting terrorism, left wing media called it racist for singling out people of color; if all of that happened, I believe your mind would change on the issue.

What conservative belief(s) do you have?
Can't think of very many.
Is it, "Can't think of very many.", or is it, "Nothing.  The left is always correct."?  Part of me thinks it's the ladder.

Some traditions conservatives do not want to support:
  1. Roe V Wade
  2. The progressive income tax
  3. Trump is not a traditional president

The GOP isn't consistent either with being pro status quo.
You're confusing ideology and political party.
Political parties should have an ideology, otherwise it's an arbitrary combination of ideas (which is fine for a genuine independent to have, but automatically following the GOP 100% of the time is being a sheep).
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@ADreamOfLiberty
but you appear to be growing increasingly incoherent.
How?

I don't cheer for a party.  If I found an article showing PETA praising Biden for being as kind to animals as Trump did, I would share that article too.

It doesn't matter who says a claim.  What matters is the substance of the claim.  Policies before politicians.

If Biden does a Jan 6 in 2025 with Trump winning in a 2024 election, and if Biden says, "Terminate the constitution" like Trump did, I would call out Biden equally on that as I would Trump.

Lets pick 4 issues; abortion for consensual sex (Issue A), AR 15 legalization (Issue B), vaccine mandates (Issue C), and transgenderism (Issue D).  X^C is the conjugate of X (if X is a white person, X^C is a non white person).

Party 1 believes in A, B, C, and D.

Party 2 believes in A^C, B^C, C^C, and D^C.

You would vote for Party 1; fair enough.

But what if (and this has happened historically and currently), the parties switch on one issue.

So 
Party 1 believes in A^C, B, C, and D.
Party 2 believes in A, B^C, C^C, and D^C.

If you had to vote, who would you vote for?  Due to people's urge to fit into a party, most people would pick the party that still agrees with them 3/4 of the time.  But then the issue that switched tends to switch with the person as well.

Lets define E=A^C.  This means E^C=A.

Party 1 believes in E, B, C, and D.
Party 2 believes in E^C, B^C, C^C, and D^C.

But due to people's desire to fit into a party, the people who ended up agreeing with A now agree with E and vice versa.

This is how you end up with Hispanic Americans being way more pro choice than Hispanics in Latin America; the democrats welcomed them in (and they were pro welfare and pro helping the poor), but they also sprinkle in legalized abortion, and then not all (but certainly a huge number) of Hispanics would have ended up pro choice when if the democrats were preaching banning abortion and the GOP legalizing it, the Hispanics would have gone in the opposite direction. 

Maybe at some point you will straddle the sane and insane worlds and you can translate for ebuc.
Ebuc is crazy.  He is a lot like Roosevelt.
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They all care about animals, and their leaders all back TRUMP!


PETA is strongly against bug consumption btw (What about insects and other “pests”? | PETA).  In other words, if the globalists want us to eat bugs, then PETA is against the globalists.

Trump got endorsed by Modi, the PM of India during that time (India has a lot of vegetarians). Most politicians hate Trump, not vegetarian India’s PM.

The #1 most vegan country in the world is Israel. Not Denmark, Sweden, and certainly not Palestine.
Israel!

Israel, India, and Trump made the right move here.

I don't like Trump and I'm not voting for him, but credit where it's due.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
That’s ridiculous. The person saying that being gay is immoral is gay. Get it? It’s called hypocrisy 
The argument isn't that being gay is immoral; it's that homosexuality is still; kind of a controversial issue, and when so many people still want homosexuality to be banned, don't teach about gay people in schools just yet.

Something similar would be a woman who gets an abortion (when roughly half the country views abortion as a fundamental right and roughly the other half views it as the murder of an innocent child) advocating for telling 6 year olds that there is nothing wrong with an abortion.

In our society, views like slavery is good vs slavery is bad are not equal views; the bolded view is the better view significantly.

In our society, pro life and pro choice are roughly equally weighted views, so 3 million public school teachers (2/3 of which are female about; about 1/6 of whom got abortions, so that's about 300K teachers that have gotten abortions), if that 300K teachers ended up telling malleable kids that they got an abortion and there is nothing wrong with it; assuming 20 kids per class and assuming without the teachers, the kids would have been split 60/40 Pro choice (the national pro choice rate) this means 2.4 million pro life kids are going to become pro choice (because they got indoctrinated with pro choice values).

Now, since you are pro choice, you may like this.  It's more power for your team.  However, what happens when the public school system (like the Florida public school system) indoctrinates kids with values you disagree with?  Unless you advocate legally punishing people for commonly stated political views, then you have to treat the Overton window views you agree with the same as Overton window opinions you disagree with.

The conservative argument is that women who get abortions that work in public school should not be indoctrinating kids that aren't theirs with pro choice values and that LGBT teachers should not indoctrinate America's kids with opinions where there are a lot of people that disagree with it.

You wouldn't like it if your 5 year old was being indoctrinated by a MAGA Cultist.

Taught? You mean how to have gay sex? No, they are teaching kids to be respectful of all people. They are teaching kids to not be bigots. There’s nothing wrong or inappropriate with teaching children to be respectful of others.
The issue is not everyone agrees with gay people's right to get married (about 26% of the population).

Should the US government consistently indoctrinate kids with leftist values no matter what the leftist value is?  Because to me, that's what you want because it helps retain power for the democratic party.  I think a lot of independent voters aren't going to like the massive power grab you are trying to implement.
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