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Yeah, I’m not on board for any of these policy lynches. If Sir.Lancelot and/or crystalynx don’t participate, I’d prefer their replacement over any attempt to lynch them, even with the former having been online during the game. I don’t automatically read lurking as scummy.
I’ve already said I’m not policy lynching Pie, either. Like he said, we should only take that step if there are no viable lynch options, and even then, I’d be hesitant. The more I’ve thought about his claim, the more I’ve townread it, which means he’s currently my strongest TR. Like I said earlier, I don’t believe that it’s a fake claim he came up with on the spot, but it might be a fake claim given to him by Vader.
I’m going to hold off on a full list of reads for now in the hopes that at least Sir.Lancelot will contribute. I’ve got a shortlist of likely characters that I expect to be in this game based on what I know of Vader’s anime preferences, though I’ll keep that under wraps until we’ve got another claim or two.
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@Earth
@Sir.Lancelot
Cool. Be interested to see more activity from you later, but glad you’re here.
Sir.Lancelot, your fellow knight arrived on time. Where art thou?
Unvote
VTL Sir.Lancelot
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@That2User
I guess that's fine, seems like a pretty pointless use of a VTL when you could be pressuring people who haven't posted yet, but your choice.
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@That2User
ILikeThisTheory6VTL ILikePie5
It’s a little early to say there’s no suitable lynch. I think it’s pretty pointless to start a wagon on Pie right now.
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@AustinL0926
Welcome! And yeah, let’s avoid just full claiming characters without good reason, please. If you’re going to soft-claim, lighter touch is key.
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@ILikePie5
Character: Koro-sensei from Assassination Classroom (idk anything about this)Justification is that as a teacher I told my students that I was going to destroy the world but I taught good things to students and the government experimented on me to make me the way I am when in reality all I wanted to do was just teach.
This does make some sense. Koro-sensei is set up as the big bad from the start of the series, but he’s actually heroic in his own way. The fact that it’s coming out this early makes me lean toward believing it, assuming that it isn’t a fake claim. Even if Pie has a partner well versed in anime, it’d be ballsy to claim a big character like this early as a claim they generated.
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@That2User
Yeah, you should get on that. Then, I want to see your best ostentatious anime pose. Might as well get into this thing right.
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@Earth
The potential of this game is infinite!
This is one game where I’m going to have some fun figuring out the theme. For the time being, though, I’d like to get some more activity than just Wylted VTLing BK and BK posting a Girls und Panzer AMV.
VTL Earth
How’ve you been, dude?
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@RationalMadman
I’ll honestly be sorry to see you go, but best of luck to you.
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@That2User
From what Tej said:
I hope to initiate the rounds by the end of the week, as well as release the three topics for Round 1.
So you should probably assume Friday or over the weekend.
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@blamonkey
Yo, blamonkey. Long time no see. Glad you're participating in the tournament.
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@AustinL0926
Yeah, I think it was a mistake to claim your character that early. With that set of information, it was obvious who you were and that you were the Cop. Admittedly, if we hadn't known, I probably would have used the lawyer on myself in NP1 and you would have gotten false info from your investigation, so don't feel too badly about not being able to investigate me that night.
I actually did do some investigation into the theme myself, though I didn't notice the number of terms spent in the role. Missed that detail.
In any case, it was a good game and I enjoyed it. Don't mind that we lost - honestly, figuring out the theme was secondary to a lot of the analysis that had already gone on up to that point. Well figured.
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@PREZ-HILTON
Clearly, their problem was relying too much on theme analysis.
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@SirAnonymous
Read the OP - “SupaDudz - You are the ZOMBIE Ron DeSantis”. Even Pie recognized our amazing play before we ever made it. Glory to the undead!
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@RationalMadman
I appreciate that you actually detailed your reasons for sussing me. It gives me something to address rather than just revisiting what I’ve already said.
That being said… yeah, much of this still doesn’t make sense. SirAnon said that he knew who Austin’s governor was well after the DP should have ended. At that point, I’d been offline. That’s why I addressed it at the start of DP3. As for noticing that Austin was also an investigator… seriously? I pointed it out in DP3 when it had already been mentioned by other people and had been blatantly on display at the top of 2 DPs. Not sure why you’d sus me for reading more carefully than you do.
I don’t understand the logic regarding my somehow being “forced to lead onto Wylted DP1”, since you seem to be exclusively focused on Wylted’s game. It seems like you are placing the blame on him for your inability to get a lynch on me, when you clearly had the opportunity and simply refused to get an early lynch on a known scum. I don’t know what makes you think that I had to be early on him if I was scum, either, since you were pretty ineffectively recruiting to my wagon. I don’t have a history of bussing like this, but somehow this makes me scummy?
I also don’t know how an “even if” statement somehow gives me away. I’ve been the target of multiple lunches as town and framed it similarly. You can say this is all part of some unwillingness to post lies (which is true), but what you’re actually giving evidence of is that I don’t lash out or ridicule you, or being cocky, which has never been the case. I tend not to attack people in any game.
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@RationalMadman
I hopped offline apparently just before you VTL'd me (again, I said I have work, and I'm honestly baffled that you think I have time to post every time something like this happens). Considering that you have actively stated that that vote is a given at this stage, and considering that GP will likely follow your lead, I'll treat it as though I am at L-1. I'm not sure why your response to that is to once again try this heads up showdown that you've never gotten out of me and won't be getting this time, especially when I've made it clear who my two scumreads are and that they do not include you.
All that being said, there's really nothing more I can say to either of you. I've already explained my actions and RM's response to them is to almost entirely ignore my reasoning and just say I'm behaving scummily. He already viewed me as scum back in DP1, and no matter what I do and for what reason at this stage, it all feeds into that view.
As for GP, I haven't seen much in the way of reasoning from him at all. My reasons for sussing him have gone ignored, and it looks like he's largely just sheeping RM at this point. He just doesn't give me much to discuss. If GP chooses to explain his read in any way, I'd be happy to respond, but I'm not just going to sit here and post over and over again when it's going nowhere.
At this point, the game will hinge on what Barney and SirAnon choose to do. I wouldn't be surprised if either of them end up voting against me, but both of them seem to be at least considering my behavior and reasoning. At minimum, I think hearing from SirAnon, who hasn't contributed for a while, should come before anyone gets hammered. I've made my case and I'm willing to defend it, assuming that we actually talk about it.
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@RationalMadman
What part of "sooner" did you not understand? I think you're town. I said as much. I think SirAnon is town. I said as much. I've already stated who I think the scum team is and, yes, this is playing out how I expected if GP and Barney are the remaining members.
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@RationalMadman
If siranon comes and is scum with barney, you realise the situation?
I've already said he's my strongest townread. That's not likely to change in this DP. It's possible, but I'd sooner think you're a scum team with Barney than believe that pairing.
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@Barney
Wow, GP doesn't explain his burst of speed to get on a wagon when he's otherwise been lurking all game, and now he's buddying to RM that hard... Wow, just wow!
He's always been a bit knee-jerk when it comes to hopping on wagons, guess he saw an opportunity with RM and then just left. I think it's strange that he's still on me without RM, but as I said to RM, I expected him to be on me.
Back in DP1 when you were chatting with Wylted, you were trying to verify if he was safe to visit... But now you're claiming you had no danger from visiting anyone?...DP1 he and Wylted talked as if that was the case. I believe that why we've let this third party discussion keep coming back, since if he wasn't misdirecting us, then there had to be a third party or else he would die if he visited scum. We can verify with his own words that hasn't happened.So I guarantee GP is lying about his role.
Really have to re-read that exchange...
Speaking of which, did you RB SirAnon?
I could not and did not.
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@RationalMadman
Yeah dp1 he begins asking wylted if he is TP and there is a troll interaction between them that seemed like wink wink nudge nudge but GP would react that way as Town.
That seemed more like Wylted was actively trying to goad him into saying something weird, but I'll read back through it and see if I missed something.
Why are you not worried GP is voting you rn?
Because I assume he's scum and, therefore, that he'd need at least one member of town to join him on the lynch? I expect him to VTL me. I think it's a bad choice, and I've said as much already, but he's stayed on me just the same.
I genuibely meant keep trying to grill me. Why would you be offended by that invitation?You SHOULD try to grill as Town, of course not only as Scum.
Because I'm doing things like "working" and "eating my lunch," the latter of which I don't have a lot of time to do. I also just generally don't think grilling you, specifically, does a whole lot for us. Let's face it, you've dominated the vast majority of the discussion this DP. I'd love to see SirAnon get in on this and I think that back-and-forth would be more fruitful.
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@RationalMadman
Why not? It can prevent it or protect someone from it. I haven't seen any other role that balances it aside from Barney's claimed BP.
Also, I've read back through it several times and it still doesn't make sense. How exactly does the Purifier role have anything to do with the Miller role? It says it removes "lingering effects," and last I checked, the Miller is not itself a lingering effect. The only lingering effect I see is Badger's White Mage, which protects over 2 NPs. So it looks like a negative town utility role.
For that matter, I may have just missed it, but where did GP state that his visiting a TP role could get him killed? Did he breadcrumb that somewhere?
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Why should we encourage discussion? That i creases chance of scum to talk town out of a lynch.
You were the one who said that we shouldn't rush this DP at all, but you still decided it was a good idea to push a lynch.
Tbe more we talk, the more deception can occur but yes, so can more tells. So keep trying to grill me
This is grilling you? I'm asking you to address the reasoning I gave for what I did rather than just assert that there was no plausible reason for me to act as I did. The dismissive attitude and absolute certainty you're presenting here aren't any more convincing this DP than they were in the previous 3.
Supa was gov and believed I CCd him, he is well kmown to fuck up in a panic and in particular has this thing to mishammer me.I happened to be there last minute when actually I was suoer busy until and thought the day had just ended so I took a look I tried toake sense of things in literally 2 mins of reading the game bacmwards, thought wykted had gladiatored BK and second gussed my scumread on him but UNTIL then had scumread him and saw it as scum vs scum you vs hi.
That's just a baffling set of reads. You had the opportunity to successfully lynch Wylted DP1. You actively chose not to do so because a) you bought Wylted's BS about being the gladiator despite the fact that absolutely nothing corroborated his brand new claim and b) you were so focused on getting a lynch off on me that you refused to take advantage of the opportunity to lynch the obvious scum. It was a bad choice that ended up pushing what should have been an obvious lynch out to DP3. Even if you're right and I end up flipping scum, it was still a bad choice to split the vote.
If Town has a jailkeeper even 1x then... what does that balance??Jailkeeper on top of a double saver??Jailkeeper on top of a mafia roleblocker if SA is town????
I feel like that's obvious: it balances the 1X Vig that Austin had. Not sure what a mafia RB has to do with it - scum and mafia both having RBs is not new.
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@RationalMadman
I vote Wylted with best korea. I did it as a reaction test.Wylted kept trying to push me onto best korea or siranonymous, consistently. Then when he realised I was nit budging, that I was doing you or him, he then suicide-outs, perhaps as you are a stronger scum role and better player too.
So, you got a reaction, and by your own admission, you scumread him hard. Then, rather than continuing to push on him hard, which I was helping to facilitate after he claimed that ridiculous role, you decided to keep pushing on me and split the vote because... you wanted people to dumbread you? Sorry, I can't follow the logic that allows an obvious scum to survive DP1.
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In any case, I'm at work and I can't spend my entire morning focused on this. I'll come back over lunch.
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In general, this decision by both RM and GP to start forming lynches is rubbing me the wrong way. Rushing into any lynch at this stage should be off the table. We should be encouraging discussion as much as possible.
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@RationalMadman
I'm not interested in engaging with this convert/deconvert analysis. It's all BS, whether you know it or not, and it's a distraction from this DP.
I'm not going to jump on any lynch this DP. We need to coalesce around a choice, not make random decisions. The fact that you are choosing to vote at this point isn't surprising to me, but I am still confused as to why you think I'd reciprocate.
I said if GP is Town, SA is. Not the other way around.
I also responded to that, though no one seemed to care enough to address it. It's pretty pointless at this point, anyway. Everyone's townreading SirAnon, so I don't know why you're making this about how we see him.
Whiteflame, you are a man of caution, you would not randomly use your power np1 and if used not out to say hey mafia, I am vanilla now.
I didn't use it randomly. I sussed That2 in DP1. I was also very clear as to why I outed my role, and I'll note that you haven't addressed those reasons. You just keep repeating the same point.
Then you vote 7th out of 5 and 5th out of 4, posing and showmanship is not your town metaAfter wylted claimed Hitler, whiteflame was forced to stick to the bus that I myself made happen by refusing to shift away from whifeflame while havi g shown willingness to vote wylted.
Love how these two posts come one after the other. You don't note that I was the second on the lynch on Wylted in DP1, who is the only known scum at this point. He would have been lynched if you hadn't been splitting the vote, but somehow it's obvious that I was bussing because the alternative was literally to vote for myself to get a lynch? WTF is with that logic? Also, let's face it, you didn't make that wagon happen, you actively subverted it. Don't be so full of yourself.
I was very clear about why I didn't immediately hop on either the That2 or Wylted lynches and, frankly, I have a long history of being slow to decide who to push. You of all people should know that, not to mention I've justified the choices I made in both of these cases. I don't see you addressing any of the logic I used.
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Last thought: I don’t know why anyone keeps saying that the presence of a Tracker somehow confirms a Compulsive Visitor. That doesn’t make sense. There are all manner of roles that visit other people. I don’t know why a virtually useless role like Compulsive Visitor, which seems built solely to explain why someone would visit other people every night, does anything but confuse a Tracker.
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I’m fine with a lynch on either Barney or GP at this stage.
As for why I outed, again, it was to give us as much information as possible before lynching That2. Scum is obviously not going to NK me regardless of my claim - I’ve been on RM’s shit list since DP1 and I’m an easy mislynch. It’s also weird that RM is calling me out for claiming my role when he was scumreading me for not claiming earlier.
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@RationalMadman
A PURIFIER DEMANDS A CONVERTING TYPE ROLE GENERALLYI AM NOT CONSPIRATORIAL, LIAR! a cultist was very likely
Except that you already knew how the purifier role worked because by the time we found out what it was, it was already posted verbatim. Not sure why you held onto the view that it’s a converting-type role when it was clearly shown to not be converting. As for a likely cultist… when? I can’t find anything that indicates a cultist in anyone’s behaviors or anything from the flips.
Is Lancelot allowed to post in live games if he is not in them?
1. It was my mistake for tagging him.
2. Moderators do not enforce forum mafia rules
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@SirAnonymous
My bad - I've been bouncing back and forth from this to a vote removal I was looking at for one of his debates. The right knight this time.
I can't recall a time that I've bussed that early in any of my games as scum, but yes, I guess that's possible. Seems odd to sus me for not immediately hopping on his lynch in DP2 when I was on board throughout DP1.
Calling it a night myself.
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@Sir.Lancelot
Wow, guess I should've refreshed before I posted that.
Looks like you visited Barney. Good that you were able to actually do it this time, at least gives us something to work with. We should be careful with those results, since, as you suggested, they could be tampered with.
As for your points against me, you realize that I was first and longest on the lynch against Wylted, right? In DP1, I got on his lynch wagon and never left. I also stated early in DP2 that I was absolutely fine lynching him, but that I wanted to consider all of our options. I'll also note that, at the time, Badger had claimed that he would die the next day at noon by his Vig. I had been interested in seeing that out.
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Alright, so a lot to unpack from the last DP and NP.
So Badger was the White Mage, eh? Seems like a much more powerful Doc. Either he didn't use it well or scum have a work-around (probably strongarm). The High Noon claim didn't match what I could find online and I have no clue what he would have done if we'd gotten to noon and Wylted didn't die. Seems like he would have been sussed pretty hard for it.
Wylted should have been lynched back in DP1. He's been scummy as hell since he claimed "Hitler," which... I mean come on, if it didn't indicate that he had just straight up made it up (looks like he did), then it was clearly either a scum or TP role.
The fact that it took this long to lynch him is partially due to That2's choice to claim vanilla rather than miller in DP2, which was just a bad choice that ended up looking extremely scummy (the miller claim would have been suspect that late, but at least that would have made some sense). That being said, Wylted should've been lynched DP1. Especially when Best.Korea was modkilled, there was no reason to split the vote there at all. That's especially true now that we know, as RM conveniently pointed out for us in post #31, that he actively knew Wylted was scum and was just wanting us "to dumbread me as they assumed i was second-guessing the Wylted read which I really wasn't." So, you know, instead of pursuing an obvious lynch of an obvious scum, RM split the vote DP1 to play his version of 4D chess. Great.
Well, at least we finally got him. I do agree with one thing he's said so far this DP - that we shouldn't rush this DP at all. GP, this isn't MYLO, it's LYLO. We have no choice but to lynch someone - a no lynch is not an option.
So, we need to start parsing through everyone that's left in this game. Not too many at this stage.
My only strong townread right now is SirAnon. He's made a couple of moves that have stood out to me as odd over the course of this game, but all of his responses to my sussing him over them have been very townie. He's owned each choice, and they're all strange choices for scum to make. For example, I don't think scum would out that they knew Austin's character claim after he was already dead. It's a weird flex that only draws attention to him.
My townread of RM has weakened, but I still think he's likely town. This choice to try to outsmart scum by getting them to "dumbread" him seems like something RM would do, though I can't say if it comes off as more townie or just an excuse to delay getting Wylted lynched as long as possible. The continuous attempt to flummox everyone by talking about third party roles is also just confounding, but I expected RM to be conspiratorial, so I guess it fits.
So, by process of elimination, it's Barney and GP. I don't think either has really done enough to stand out as either scum or town, but I'm leaning more towards GP as likely scum. I don't buy this argument that GP's claimed compulsive visitor somehow dovetails with the tracker role - it almost seems built to frustrate a tracker, and for all we know, scum have their own roles that the compulsive visitor is meant to frustrate. This is the first time I've even seen a compulsive visitor in a game, and it honestly just looks like someone did a quick search down a list of mafia roles to find something innocuous that they could use to explain why they visited someone during the previous DP. Barney's claim of BP makes some sense given that Austin was convertible to a 1X Vig - a self-protective role makes some sense, especially if his character claim is accurate. The mistakes in his posts actually make me think he's more likely to be town, since I don't think his scum team would let him post half-finished versions, though that's a bit of WIFOM thinking.
Anyway, posting this late to get out all my thoughts. Would really like SirAnon's results from the last NP.
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@RationalMadman
You explicitly asked me to provide you with examples of reports so that you could explain why you reported them, and then chose not to explain what rules they violated at all. If you want to be able to report again, "silently... laugh[ing]" at our "intellectual deficit" won't get you there.
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@RationalMadman
Your role being the only investigator saved your ass.
Except he's not the only investigator, dude. Austin was the Sheriff. He was effectively the Cop with a bit extra.
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@SirAnonymous
The choice not to Track NP1 is an odd one as well. Not sure why you'd actively give away the fact that you knew Austin's character as scum, but I'm going to think on it for the next DP. Looks like Wylted already hammered himself, but just in case, VTL Wylted
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At this point, we're at LYLO and we need to get this right.
I think the VTL on WyIted still looks good and that's a vote I'm still willing to make.
In terms of other likely scum, SirAnon said something at the end of the last DP that looks like a potential scum slip to me:
You can update Austin to Joe Lombardo.Useless flex: I figured out his character in 90 seconds after I saw his post.
He just told us he knew who Austin's actual character was shortly after Austin claimed. Considering that he is also a sheriff, a fact that is very obvious from reading anything about Joe Lombardo, that means he recognized that Austin was likely the Cop, and he just admitted that he knew all this before Austin was NK'd. Beyond that, I can't find anywhere that he has even hinted at his character or role. We should get everyone's full claims at this point, and he should be first.
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Honestly, I think I'm overthinking this. There could be other things going on, but we have someone who clearly scum slipped and we can figure out the rest later. Hope that High Noon actually activates DP3 because it doesn't look like we're waiting.
VTL That2
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@SirAnonymous
I'm thinking this through as well. I'm tempted to let this High Noon thing play out, though since it seems like it's a custom role (the only thing I can find is a role that involves engaging someone in a duel), it's difficult to verify. I'm not sure if that means he will literally die at noon tomorrow or if he's going to die during the next DP.
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@SirAnonymous
I thought it was pretty relevant. We should have all info on the table about That2 if we're considering a potential lynch, and I'm a 1X use, anyway.
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@That2User
Life is a play and the world is my stageMy role is vanilla
Hold on...
I just hopped on and I'm still reading through the DP, but how is this is not the biggest scum slip of the game? I still think it's at least Wylted and That2 on the scum team, but a straight up vanilla claim followed by a Miller claim? Seriously? By now, That2 knows that they should have claimed Miller immediately in case the Cop investigated them, and of course, the Cop's dead.
This is also pretty convenient because I'm the Jailkeeper, and I targeted That2 last night. So if that worked, That2 didn't perform the NK.
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Also, I'd be happy to help with topic selection. It's not always easy finding topics that are relatively balanced.
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@Tejretics
Ooh, I love the idea. Glad to see some movement on tournament planning happening. Much as I'm somewhat interested in participating directly, I think I'd be better suited to be a judge, so I'd be happy to sign on to judge as many of these as I am able.
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Every time I come back, there's something crazy going on.
I don't know why anyone is suddenly considering an RM lynch. His role is basically confirmed, assuming he's not some other weird variant that can manipulate or otherwise affect votes. Based on Supa's claim, we have more reason to buy RM's claim because we have someone who is, effectively, the ultimate vote manipulator. It seems pretty unlikely that RM has a similar role. I agree that Supa's
We still haven't heard from Pie about BK, though at this point, I think it's inevitable that he will be subject to a modkill. Assuming that's the case, I think it's risky to end the DP with a lynch, but if anyone's going to get it, it's going to be WyIted. It looks like he may already have been hammered (I haven't gone back yet to check the numbers), though it seems that like with BK, we're waiting on mod confirmation.
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Yeah, I don’t like that BK just posted would almost certainly be word for word his PM. If that’s not a modkill, we can be pretty sure that’s a convincing facsimile of an actual claim (not sure how much detail Pie would put in a fake claim) and a reason to lynch BK in and of itself. Will wait to get a ruling.
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