zedvictor4

We're examining the human condition yet again.

Relative to the self, and the conflict/balance between the nature of the instinctive and the nature of intellect and conceptuality.

And as ever, we could always expand the discussion to include the universal role of the intellectual species.

Can we truly act selflessly.

Perhaps in extreme circumstances, we are programmed to put the survival of the species before the survival of the self.

Though one can only be an altruist, if one can afford to be an altruist.

I've just been referencing overthink in another forum.

Get up, defecate and urinate as necessary, ablute, eat, go to work perhaps, eat, defecate and urinate as necessary, work perhaps, return home, eat, defecate and urinate as necessary, do a bit of religion and/or some other hobby, watch T.V, defecate and urinate as necessary, go to bed, have sex or masturbate perhaps.

Or do you mean a monastic existence.

Similar to above, just add more praying and chanting to the mix and call it work.

Such is the religious person

Not so remarkably different to the person.

Variable overthink of course...Religion, football, other sports, gardening,  etc etc etc.

Got to pad out the day with something now that the supermarket has replaced hunter gathering.

The drawbacks of overthink.

Which isn't to say that overthink doesn't have it's benefits.

Catch 22

Yin and Yang.

"Independent of personal perspective or bias."

Is this possible?

How can we achieve a state of independence from ourselves and our independent functional processes.

Ask Tarik.

Isn't I.Q a measure of critical thinking?

Or a measure of one's ability to critically think?

True.

But it's the knowledge that is vital, and  not the product per se.

Though I was really questioning whether the expensive product is necessary in all cases. 

The expensive product being the degree sold by the for profit educational business.

Is the fruit an orange or a lemon...It might take me less than a second to process the incoming data, decide and produce a verifiable answer.

But process it I must.

I must process it, but.

Such is cognitive dissonance.

Cognitive dissonance is such.

Everything is actually subjective.

Objectivity is always an assumption.

Like nihilism.

And  like morality.

We exist in an internally simulated World and can only assume that what we conclude from sensory input is a true representation of an external reality.

Though I bet for most U.S. citizens Sunday morning is still the same, just a day different to yesterday.

My daughter went to university acquired a degree in geography and then got a job in pharmacology and retrained in the work place.

I would suggest that a degree is just C.V. B.S.

And that in the main higher education is just another  business, selling a very expensive must have product to a gullible public.

A bit like sending worker Bees to Bee university to get a degree in Queen Bee.

Q. So you got a First Class honours in Queen Bee. What do you do now?

A. I'm a worker Bee.

Similar ideas I think.

Though to a greater degree yours focuses upon the metaphysical and spiritual aspects of the mind, whereas mine focuses upon the physicality of the universe and it's properties and the role of intellectual structures therein. 

But even though I'm not an anti-pronoun fan, in this instance I would definitely say that GOD does not require pronouns.

"To know him"...Just reinforces the certainty that GOD of the bible was simply a GOD made in the image of men. Which for sure  can be regarded as analogous, but I'm not convinced that the original intention was analogical. More of a best idea, born of a state of ignorance, reinforcing the planetary dominance of men.

Which is not to say that we are not still largely ignorant. Though 2000 years or so, of scientific observation and material progress alludes to something other than magical mystery supermen.

Though I never discount the idea that we could be the descendants of an extra-terrestrial super-hominid.

But where did they go and why do they not visit.

Perhaps we are the super-hominid, and it's up to us to colonise the universe...One day when we've sorted out all our petty Earthbound disagreements...Hmmmmmm.

But of course, we now have A.I. to consider...Alternative intelligence as I prefer to call it.

The decline of the Universe starts when?

At the beginning or in the middle?

And so when do we or our successors invoke the GOD principle?

Hopefully there is a broad window of opportunity.

Scientifically true Tim.

Religiously...Analogically representative of the truth Tim.

So in this instance Bro, not necessarily an appropriate criticism.

Just saying Bro.

Have a nice day.

LGBT etc. Take over of media and entertainment industry. (In the UK).

All a bit too  insipid and obsequious  for me.

As long as we're killed outright, then nothing to worry about.

So don't let media propaganda worry you in the meantime.

Have a nice day.

39th wedding anniversary 4th September, away to the coast for a few days, weather forecast very good.

Hopefully no bombs until next weekend.

Hopefully make it to 40.

Well, it's all in the punctuation.

I'm basically asking, is there is a purpose to humanity greater than itself.

And I don't believe anything.

We can only compare what we know with a hypothesis of a pre-determined purpose.

As a suggestion, I would propose that the ultimate purpose might be the re-initiation and perpetuation of a universal sequence. (The BIG WHOOOOOSH)

Within that context, intellectual structures would play the role of GOD.

Which if you think about it, fits quite nicely with a lot of religious analogous ideology.

GOD existing outside of the universe...In a previous universe as it were.

You cannot build a coherent concept off of a contradiction.

Depends upon how one compartmentalises and/or rearranges data. 

Zebras are black with white stripes and white with black stripes. 

Therefore Zebras can be identified as black and white striped ungulates.

We all discriminate.......It's an internal survival mechanism.

Racism is perhaps best described as a stupid response to discrimination.

And for sure it is difficult to reason with stupidity.

Whereas discrimination can easily be overridden.

Stupidity in this context is perhaps best defined as intransigence relative to established ideas.

Functionally, a theist and an atheist are the same.

Cognitive outcomes and labels might vary, but function and process are the same. 

So deism is true, in so much as we cannot deny outcomes.

So similarly theism is also true.

Though whether or not outcomes are correct representations of real universal events, is another and indeterminate issue.

If one can assume the right to kill a bear.

Then  one can assume the right to do anything.

So the clever bloke in the cave next door who doesn't risk his neck hunting bears, assumed the right to take your bear meat when you are asleep.

And of course, when you were out bear hunting, your neighbour was taking care of your partner, and cleverly spreading his clever genes.

Didn't ever you wonder why Mrs Cavelemming always had a headache.

I would suggest that starting in the past and attempting to work forwards from now, is shown by past experiences to be a flawed idea.

The inevitable pro's and con's of the emotional thinking device I suppose.

Though, as long as we respect and protect material innovators, progress will tick onwards.

How many of the current 8 billion are actually necessary do you think?

Cognitive and physical ability should certainly be tested.

Because they are quite important jobs.

Do you think, that there is a greater pre-determined purpose to the evolution of thinking and manipulative structures.

Evolution as in material development from a point of creation.

Creation as in an indeterminate beginning. rather than an assumptive beginning.

The problem of war machine is stupid clever people.

Stupid clever is a tad ironic don't you think?

Covid vaccines appear to have been efficacious in what they set out to achieve.

And not the intended doomsday drugs as predicted by the conspiracy theorists.

I would suggest that denial and conspiracy theory are coping strategies.

And in terms of probability, denial is a still  small risk especially for reasonably fit people.

But as Mr Lamb et al show, there is certainly still risk.

Though I firmly support personal choice.

I Hope that you continue to enjoy good health Athias.

I have been vaccinated and contracted Covid, and still enjoy good health.

So we're all good for now.

And for sure there are greater risks to health other than Covid.

Like being unreasonably unfit, or having a genetic predisposition to cancer and other serious ailments.

Or being a Russian or Ukrainian soldier.

Covid vaccine simply addressed one public health issue.

Half a Planck's length would be smaller.

Or do you mean a plank of wood?

I would suggest that criminality anywhere will inevitably favour weapons.

Though the majority of ordinary* British citizens  do not carry knifes, whereas in the U.S. a high proportion of the populous own guns.

And I would also suggest that it is something of an Inherent American fallacy, that Muslim criminals are somehow worse or more abundant than any other criminal.

*Ordinary...Ordinary is as ordinary is perceived I suppose.

I suppose for the criminal, criminality is ordinary.

And I also suppose that in the U.S. owning firearms is ordinary.

I think that reacting in a certain way to certain situations becomes a standard social expectation.

The currently popular Spanish football issue is a good example of a recently acquired adverse response to what was previously a normal situation.

I'm not sure that any of this type of behaviour actually improves human society.

Just creates new divisions.

Just like 2000 years ago...New religion created new division.

Reading the bible proves that MEN wrote the bible, and a book written by men will never prove GOD

That said...As an archaic hypothesis, some of the myths and tales of the OT and reasonably analogous. Adam and Eve being a prime example.

NT is the writings of gullible men...Hero worshipping charismatic individuals  and elevating them to a mythical status is a common phenomena, and the perpetuation of myths is also common practice.

So much of the modern bible was fabricated way after the event.

I'm not sure that we can learn much from tall tales or extract a great deal historical fact from the extensively translated, transcribed and reinterpreted Christian bible.

The post-dated exaggerations of gullible sycophants should never be taken at face value. That's a simple lesson to learn.

Money and wealth and debt, are one aspect of social control/order.

Seems to work though.

Especially if it's backed up with armies, with plenty of equipment.

And something just made it back to the Moon in a rocket.

That's 54 years of progress then.

45 seconds that could otherwise be spent masturbating or cleaning your teeth.

Because one only finds out that the choice was a bad one, post choice.

So poorly constructed buildings collapse and people are  killed.

Time to write GOD myth theory for sure.

Do you remember when those goats almost drowned in the swollen river.

And a women named Nora rowed out and rescued them.

Ended up with the big boat GOD myth theory.

Good Old Rudy.

But I will only ever remember the desperate guy in the shabby parking lot with hair dye trickling down his face.

Such is one reason why people should grow old gracefully.

Taught faces and turkey necks is another.

People with issues, and modern expectations.

People with issues and old values.

Too much divisive media propaganda/entertainment, keen to air the views of the people with issues.

And then there is everyone else who get's up in the morning and goes to bed in the evening.

Same old shit Eugene.

No photo.

Heaven sure is omniscient.

I'm in though.

Just give me your access codes and bank account details and leave all the paperwork to me.

Do you want a receipt. Deb.

I was seeking philosophical clarification.

Because even philosophically, a human centred hypothesis would have to include all the baggage that comes with humans.

Whereas a GOD centred hypothesis just relies upon hypothetical trust or mistrust in a hypothetical GOD.

Yep that's exactly it.

How do occupied and unoccupied occur simultaneously.

In two separate spaces, or in one overall space.

As I see it, there is only one space with loosely defined regions of occupation and unoccupation.

Thereby, occupied is finite but expanding, and unoccupied remains infinite.

Hmmmmm.

Sorry to be difficult.

But who or what is offering this hypothetical opportunity?

If it is simply a human ballot with no accompanying guarantee to act upon the result, then I would typically abstain.

Because as FLRW implies, Mr Putin et al would simply ignore the result.

If it were a GOD making the offer with guarantees,  then I would vote in favour of removal.

From the point of view of a cohesive society...I'm not sure that private indoctrination has benefits over public indoctrination.

Notwithstanding that for the first few crucial years of a child's life  in terms of learning, in most cases indoctrination is solely the responsibility of the immediate family.

In the main people with unverifiable and unscrutinised credentials as educators.

Yep...Overtly subjective.

But nonetheless...Hypothetically Og had an evolved intellect with the ability to differentiate between experiences that would latterly become to be classifiable as good and evil.

When this realisation actually occurred for the first time, is impossible to say. (How long is the thinking hominids timeline)

Would certainly pre-date written records though.

Yep I get that.

But do the two primary kinds of space occur together in the same overall space or in two separate spaces?

I occasionally experience the disconcerting sensation/dream of not being awake but thinking that I am.

I then desperately try and wake myself.

Perhaps quite a common dream/sleep experience.

Warmer by a few degrees, which makes a lot of difference.

Hotter, when the wildfires ignite.

Therefore you are proposing that there is more than one space.

Otherwise unoccupied space would be essentially be in the same space as occupied space.

I'm addicted to oxygen.

If I don't get my fix regularly, I hyper-ventilate.

Probably when Ug rescued Og  when Nog hit Og over the head with his club.

Hence the prehistoric expressions Ug-ood and Nog-ood.

So how many different words do you have stored in your database?

Not sure what the Hebrew for good and evil is, as my computer doesn't handle Hebrew text.

Though the words good and evil are stated in the dictionary as being English of German/Dutch origin.

Often old English is derived from French and primarily Latin origins, but in this case bonum and malum are not the root words..

Subjective tenets Mr S.

Subjective tenets attributed to a subjective hypotheses.

And the words good and evil are very much western derivatives from previous concepts.

And are applicable within appropriate contexts, but are often loosely applied in inappropriate contexts.

And are latterly used to insinuate the opposite of their primary intent.

Such is the fluidity of words and language.

See how I used the word fluidity there.

And appropriation is very much as appropriation does, when it comes to the organisation of data and the output of corresponding sounds.

Here here.

So the Kim loving, god fearer comes out of the closet and becomes the new me.

Someone has been paying attention.

Or they lead us a merry dance.

Anyone can create a name for a tactic.

Nonetheless in my response to BK, I was simply agreeing that the infinite questioning or circular reasoning of an unattainable conclusion to a hypothesis, will therefore achieve nothing more  than the acquired mental stimulation that it generates. Which in of itself is a reasonable outcome.

And most certainly, I have acquired new ideas and ways of thinking from such discussions.

Though when the circumference of the circle is so short, it becomes a circular rant.

Red hatters love an Indian.

Make America Great Again.

Eat curry.

Play the banjo.

Chew grass.