Total posts: 14,582
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
I am opposed to the idea of banning any discussion of any topic for the simple reason that we should not be afraid that the discussion may incite someone else to action,
100% THIS.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Discipulus_Didicit
100% of the population is a homeowner in that scenario then. You say you wish to keep the economy a free market so the question becomes who is constructing these houses and who is paying them to do so? I understand you say you aren't proposing any specifics but I would need somebody to do so before I agree or disagree with the idea.
The theory is that rental property would be converted to rent-to-own property, including apartments (each rent payment would purchase some small equity in the property that could later be sold to someone else at a later date).
The theory is that without rental property artificially reducing supply, the actual market value of shelter would be much lower than it is now (making shelter more affordable).
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
This is NOT a SOUND argument (because the premises are not TRUE).It’s true under those circumstances.
It's a hypothetical statement.
It's only "true" in the context of the hypothetical.
It is NOT true outside the context of the hypothetical.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@secularmerlin
Just imagine if you lived in a world where you thought every valid argument was true.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
all sound arguments are valid AND all valid arguments are sound.
All sound arguments MUST be valid.
But not all valid arguments are sound.
A valid argument that is not sound,
(IFF) all dogs are blue (AND) you have a dog (THEN) your dog is blue
This is a VALID argument.
This is NOT a SOUND argument (because the premises are not TRUE).
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Double_R
You already answered your own question when you suggested that each human life must be measured by the totality of their accumulated actions taken in their lifetime.
This makes any measure impossible until that human has completed their lifetime of actions.
The point being that justice simply determines CRIMES.
Justice does not detect "bad people".
Are you perhaps familiar with the Legendary "Robin Hood"?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Bringerofrain
The first extremist was Cain
And how do you think they learned their "evil" ideas?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@RationalMadman
3 and 5 I'd support outright banning.
Of course you would.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Bringerofrain
sed on level of disgustingness but the impact of that ideal gaining a foothold in the mind of large numbers of youth. The argument may even be correct in some of those instances but should be banned anyway. For example some races of people do have higher IQs than others, but if it is argued that race a has a lower IQ than race b in the debate than the deba
HILARIOUS.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Bringerofrain
If people never hear extremist arguments, they will never be able to be persuaded to be extremists.
Who was the first "extremist"?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Dr.Franklin
BECAUSE A PERFECT GOD CAN ONLY CREATE PERFECT THINGS.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Double_R
HUMANS are not "good" or "bad" in-and-of-themselves.
Created:
-->
@fauxlaw
relative to each other
There it is.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
Part of the assumption that is completely false is, first, the belief that the money supply is finite.
The value of money is finite.
You can print as much as you like.
Now you don't even have to actually print it, you just type numbers into a federal reserve ledger.
However, the more you INFLATE the money supply, the LESS each $$$ is worth.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Theweakeredge
My point is that you do need to keep the hierarchy - its bullshit. The entire concept of keeping people beneath you is incorrect, caste systems are still caste, no matter how you dress it up
WE MUST DEMAND HOLACRACY + RCV.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@secularmerlin
Great point.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Theweakeredge
"It doesn't matter how rich you might be, if there is nobody willing to patrol the streets and remove the garbage and work for minimum wage at your local grocery store, then you will certainly starve to death."
In game.
The hypothetical is in the context of a game.
Yes, (IFF) you want people to perform unpleasant and or uninteresting and or physically difficult tasks (THEN) you will need to increase the wages associated with those tasks.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
Just cut all corporate subsidies and instead give those exact same subsidies directly to humans.
Created:
-->
@fauxlaw
Here's a better example.
Is Andromeda moving towards the Milkyway galaxy, (OR) is the Milkyway galaxy moving towards Andromeda?
Or are they both moving towards each other at half the speed?
Is the Milkyway galaxy static (OR) is the Milkyway galaxy moving away from Andromeda (but just not as quickly as Andromeda is overtaking it?)
Created:
-->
@fauxlaw
That's why I said, "is your personally preferred center-point".
Created:
-->
@fauxlaw
So, functionally, the supermassiveblackholeatthecenterofthemilywaygalaxy is your personally preferred center-point?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Theweakeredge
Then what needs to be done is equity of opportunity, actual equity, not what we have now.
Think of it like a game.
When you start the game, you are randomly assigned a time (ancient or modern) and place, physical characteristics, and parental social status (or orphan).
Some of these randomly assigned characteristics give you an advantage over other players and some of these give you a distinct disadvantage.
If you were playing this game (as a computer game) and you rolled a disadvantaged character, you'd probably just quit the game and roll a new character.
However, if this game had no NPCs, then it would be impossible for every single player to live in the lap of luxury.
It doesn't matter how rich you might be, if there is nobody willing to patrol the streets and remove the garbage and work for minimum wage at your local grocery store, then you will certainly starve to death.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@secularmerlin
What constitutes hard work is going to depend I think on a number of factors and is in any case different from adding much value which is also depends on a number of subjective factors.
In my personal experience, the easier the job is, the MORE it pays.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
There’s nothing to improve on, you conceded case closed
Tarik is the winner!!!
Created:
-->
@fauxlaw
2. Tied to #1. Eternity has no center. The cosmos is eternal. Why would you assume that I believe there is a center?
And without a specific center-point you cannot say (authoritatively) what revolves around what.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Double_R
I didn’t say anything about quantifying it. I asked you if there is a difference, and if so, what is it? It’s a very simple and straightforward question.
HUMANS are not "good" or "bad" in-and-of-themselves.
HUMANS certainly have OPINIONS that categorize some HUMANS as "good" and some HUMANS as "bad".
But these are simply OPINIONS.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Theweakeredge
IF everyone had access to these things and free healthcare, THEN the disparity of education would be met, therefore increasing how much the average American could contribute to the economy.
Well stated.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
Instead of accepting my premise and conclusion at face value you run with your own and claim it’s based on mine (which it isn’t) that’s what’s wrong.
Please just re-state your current argument in your own words.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Double_R
Let me ask you... do you believe there is a difference between a bad person and a person who did a bad thing? If so, what is that difference?
It is impossible to QUANTIFIABLY DETECT a "good" or "bad" person.
The closest we get is a social credit score like THIS.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
Great well in that case I guess I can return the question you’ve been asking me back to you, how do I become objectively moral?
You are also objectively moral.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@FLRW
Objective morality says that morality exists in nature—it's how we were programmed.
I agree.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
What is your adjusted cost per inmate per year magic number?
Created:
-->
@fauxlaw
What is your personally preferred static reference point?
What is your personally preferred "center of the cosmos"?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
Your questioning is circular being an objectively moral person is what you should be doing, and don’t ask me how you do that because that was never my argument in this discussion.
Ok.
Be objectively moral.
I am already and have always been objectively moral.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
Objective Morality is a real true fact.
How does this Objective Morality help me determine what I should be doing today?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
Even more people questioned in 2018 said they had experienced homelessness at some time in their lives. Of those interviewed last year, 66 percent said they had experienced homelessness, while 60 percent said the same in 2014. [**]
Jails are actually significantly MORE EXPENSIVE than prisons.
The annual cost, per incarcerated individual, averaged $47,057 in the 35 jurisdictions that responded to Vera’s survey. [**]
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
Therefore, no cost of inmate expense, so, no need to offer UBI in a similar amount.
Homeless people visit the emergency department an average of 5 times annually, and the most frequent users visit them weekly. Each visit costs $3700, amounting to $18,500 spent annually for the average user and up to $44,400 for the most frequent users. [**]
THE "TAXPAYER" IS ALREADY PAYING THE HOMELESS $18,500.00 TO $44,400.00 PER YEAR.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
Your assumed legislation is not a solution and would not pass Congress.
What are you talking about?
It's already illegal to sleep in your car and or otherwise in public in most jurisdictions.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ethang5
A master had one year to persuade a Canaanite servant to undergo circumcision and ritual immersion in a mikvah in order to accept this role. If the servant didn’t consent, he must be sold. If he did consent, he became a permanent member of the master’s household. Unlike a Hebrew servant, a Canaanite servant doesn’t go free after six years or at the Jubilee; he potentially serves for the rest of his life.Similarly, since Canaanite servants were only obligated in the mitzvos in which women are obligated, if a Canaanite servant’s master caused him to perform a mitzvah that is only performed by men, such as putting on tefillin or calling him for an aliyah, then that servant is considered freed. (“A tallis! Master has given Dobby a tallis! Dobby is free!”) [**]
I guess freeing a female foreign slave is somewhat more complicated.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@rosends
A master had one year to persuade a Canaanite servant to undergo circumcision and ritual immersion in a mikvah in order to accept this role. If the servant didn’t consent, he must be sold. If he did consent, he became a permanent member of the master’s household. Unlike a Hebrew servant, a Canaanite servant doesn’t go free after six years or at the Jubilee; he potentially serves for the rest of his life.Similarly, since Canaanite servants were only obligated in the mitzvos in which women are obligated, if a Canaanite servant’s master caused him to perform a mitzvah that is only performed by men, such as putting on tefillin or calling him for an aliyah, then that servant is considered freed. (“A tallis! Master has given Dobby a tallis! Dobby is free!”) [**]
I guess freeing a female foreign slave is somewhat more complicated.
Created:
-->
@Sum1hugme
a quantitative measure of inertia/the resistance that a body of matter offers to a change in its speed or position upon the application of a force.
Sure, the higgs field condensate resists the movement of certain types of (otherwise massless) "particles" based on their chiral symmetry breaking, but WHY (and or HOW) does the higgs field condensate resist the movement of certain types of (otherwise massless) "particles" based on their chiral symmetry breaking?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Athias
The problem with attempting to make discrimination illegal as far as it concerns "ugly" people, is how does one identify, much less quantify "ugly"?
PUBLIC SURVEY.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@secularmerlin
IF we disagree about the existence of objective morality (say you think it does exist and I say it doesn't) AND IF we both have (differing) opinions (which we have expressed during the conversation) THEN without a way to determine or demonstrate any objective moral standard we cannot say with any degree of certainty that opinions are contingent upon objective morality.Furthermore, (IFF) it is only possible to have opinions about "objectively extant real true facts" (THEN) our opinions themselves are proof-positive that morality is an "objectively extant real true fact"this is sort of an ontological argument for platonic morality.
Oh, right, I forgot to mention this exact same type of ontological argument also proves that bigfootlochnessspacealiens are "objectively extant real true fact".
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
express opinions about santa clausLike what?
Like anything.
Like simply having this conversation.
Like saying, "I think santa claus is a fun story to tell kids because it helps you figure out if they've developed critical thinking skills or not".
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Tarik
IF we agree that no objective morality existsDo we agree that no subjective morality exists?
"objective morality" is NOT demonstrable (there is no "universal holy code of conduct").
"subjective morality" is simply a description of the absence of a demonstrable "universal holy code of conduct".
"subjective morality" is NOT a claim.
"subjective morality" is simply a description.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Greyparrot
The ancient Spartans actually encouraged romantic relationships between soldiers who fought together.There's a big difference between a guy with a spear going bananas and a guy with a bomb.
DO YOU REALIZE THAT PTSD DOESN'T ONLY HAPPEN TO PEOPLE WHO SEE THEIR HETEROSEXUAL PARTNER DIE BEFORE THEIR VERY EYES?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@fauxlaw
, yourself, must bring to the table to deserve those commodities. You are NOT free to be a freeloader on society, and that you should expect such, at my expense, or anyone else's, is the abject flaw in socialism. That goes for health care, as well. Look, you may claim that, now that I am retired [although I still work for myself and earn a living by my own sweat
Of course.
Just kick everybody onto the street and then make it illegal to sleep in public.
YOU END UP PAYING OVER $20,000.00/YR PER INMATE.
WHY NOT JUST GIVE THAT EXACT SAME MONEY TO THE PERSON INSTEAD?
Created: