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@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@JoeBob
Alright, so then explain to me why Pie and not Barney. I don’t see much of a difference right now beyond activity.
As I alr mentioned, Pie pushed Barney for minimal reasons. Also "Let me ask you again: who’s behavior before I posted do you find suspicious and want to pursue. Otherwise, help pressure Barney" is a scummy af response to me pointing out that that.
And we need a claim why?
We're going to get a claim from someone. I want to get one from Pie first.
You didn’t read what I said. Before I started pressuring Barney, who were you suspicious of and why did you not pressure them?
I didn't sus anyone because up to that point was mostly fluffposting.
I’m on the move so I’m missing some things. Trying to push for a claim from a largely inactive participant seems pretty normal for Pie, so that’s not enough by itself. What has he avoided addressing?
[I think trying to force an early claim from Barney seems scummy from you tbh. Something doesn't feel quite right about it.] - AUSTIN
[Let me ask you again: who’s behavior before I posted do you find suspicious and want to pursue. Otherwise, help pressure Barney] - PIE, IN DIRECT RESPONSE TO
Tell me that you don't find this interaction extremely suspicious.
Also, Pie pushing on inactives is out of his meta. He hasn't done that before.
Why? What is special about Barney? Why are you protecting him?
I want you to claim first. I also think claimtrains based on behavior are more valid than claimtrains based on activity.
Avoidance of what? If anything, you are the one avoiding questions. I already explained why I want a claim from Barney.
Yes, and I don't buy it.
I’m curious to hear this history
In Indie Games, we let you get to LYLO without a claim, and you fakeclaimed tracker. Also you fakeclaimed late in Conspiracy Theory and Ozark.
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@whiteflame
For trying to push a claim on Barney and general avoidance. Also to get a claim from him, I'm not looking to get him lynched (for now).
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@whiteflame
You're online. I want to hear your thoughts.
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@JoeBob
BTW Pie has a known history of audacious fakeclaiming, so it's even more important we get a claim now.
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@JoeBob
We need to get a claim out of Pie before Barney, if at all.
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@whiteflame
Missed that while skimming, thx and got it.
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I'm going to do a deep dive into Pie's meta now - hopefully I get as much as I can done before my teacher finds out what I'm doing rn.
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Let me ask you again: who’s behavior before I posted do you find suspicious and want to pursue. Otherwise, help pressure Barney
I find your behavior suspicious. Wouldn't be opposed to pursuing a claim from you.
Is there a reason why Barney is not on that list?
I don't think he mentioned anything about not being sure about the themesplit.
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I townread Savant and whiteflame slightly based on the fact they forgot to read the OP.
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@ILikePie5
I think trying to force an early claim from Barney seems scummy from you tbh. Something doesn't feel quite right about it.
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Not a big fan of the whole forcing Barney to claim thing. I think we should focus more on behavior first
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@Greyparrot
Does a visited player specifically get a message saying they were probed, or do they only know they were visited by you?
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@Greyparrot
That game still annoys me to this day lol.
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And about the whole out-of-game angleshooting, I hope this long-ago mafia game should be enough of a cautionary tale...
Mikal calls out Speed for allegedly typing in a group chat, DP1 chaos ensues. Both of them were town.
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I just checked the wiki article for my character, it looks to be around 10,000 to 15,000 words at first glance. Hope I don't have to actually read all that...
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@Savant
I guess? It still doesn't seem like a genuinely plausible plan, but then again, we're all fluffposting rn anyway.
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@Greyparrot
I definitely buy that lol, wouldn't be the first time GPT doesn't know context.
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I largely nullread Savant for that suggestion of his. I don't really buy that he took the time to come up with an elaborate solution while also failing to do simple research on whether Discord statuses can be manipulated (yes, they can).
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@Greyparrot
Alr, just making sure you weren't a TP.
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I feel like there should be some breaking strategy with such a complicated role, but I don't really see one. A little bit overly complex, but it could be Lunatic rebalancing the game in a hurry.
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@Greyparrot
If all five Kates are lost I will immediately die and lose the game so I must use my probes wisely.
Can you still win with town if you lose all your Kates?
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@RationalMadman
Thanks - I just checked out Mafiascum and Mafiauniverse. I might give them a try later.
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@Best.Korea
@JoeBob
There's a pretty wide range of openings that are playable, but only a few openings that are good. All the openings I'm going to be naming in my brief monograph are generally considered good enough that you can find resources on it with a quick Google search.
Regarding the "defensive opening", it shares some similarities with a well-respected opening, the Hippopotamus Defense. However, putting the knight on f3 is a poor choice, since it gets in the fianchettoed bishop's way, leading to bad coordination.
Other good defensive openings: King's Indian Attack (poorly named), Vienna Game, London System, Torre Attack (also poorly named).
The "offensive opening" is basically a modified Bishop's Opening. It's usually more effective when the king's knight is on e2, so that White can play f4. Nevertheless, it's sound enough, but I would hardly call it offensive - if Black knows what he is doing, f7 shouldn't ever be a problem.
Other good offensive openings: there are a lot, since generally White goes on the offense. Evan's Gambit, Fried Liver Attack, King's Gambit, Scotch, Danish Gambit, Center Game, to name a few.
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I think it's part of Wylted's "alternate reality game" or something.
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@whiteflame
I thought you played fairly well up to DP2, but for DP3, it was really a moment to take a look at the big picture and consider some alternatives. I probably would've tunneled Vader in your shoes as well, but not pressing Barney's slip was unfortunate and somewhat avoidable.
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Just some personal notes about theme and setup:
-The themesplit is way too difficult imo. With such a huge amount of thematic information (it's five books of lore, for god's sake), a themesplit shouldn't be that obscure. I actually considered the "survived Tartarus" themesplit, but dismissed it because Nico di Angelo also survives Tartarus. Making it "of the Seven" is kinda arbitrary.
-Setup was slightly scumsided, but I don't really think the night actions ended up affecting the final result much. Great job on Pie for designing a role madness setup without an incredible amount of swing - I know from experience that it's not easy.
-Most of the justifications made sense. The only one I still don't get is Rachel - how does that have to do with her determining alignment?
-Random thought: Switching around Reyna and Rachel for the roles might have worked better.
-I'm going to defend my ascetic claim. The idea of claiming ascetic thematically is to emphasize that I can't be protected, I can't be given items, etc. IMO, this fits well with Annabeth's decision to go to the quest alone.
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@ILikePie5
Wylted did ask me and he relayed it to town as well
I nearly had a heart attack when I saw that, very fortunate that people rushed to end the DP instead of considering a Barney lynch
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Scumreading a x1 cop solely for the claim is atrocious, but honestly Vader kept digging himself into a deeper hole without my or Barney's assistance.
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Yeah idk what to say rly. I felt I played solidly, but town kinda ate itself.
We were very lucky that town tunneled on Vader, I messed up with the Ascetic claim. I didn't realize non-investigative roles would still get a failed result, I modded differently in my game so that's why.
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@WyIted
I was thinking that you and BK could be the scumteam, but that just feels too unlikely, especially in light of Vaders behavior. Hopefully I didn't just mess up
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VTL Vader
Af this point, I'm 90% certain he and Barney are the last scum, just based on behavior and poe. I rly hope I'm not wrong
Af this point, I'm 90% certain he and Barney are the last scum, just based on behavior and poe. I rly hope I'm not wrong
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I feel he's given up on defending himself entirely. It seems more like a frustrated scum than town
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Sorry for going awol, had a family thing. Just read through the dp and Vader is acting really scummy.
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@WyIted
Agreed. I also agree that the scum team is either you and Austin or Austin and Ragnar so I think an Austin lynch next dp I'd the best option
Care to explain why a Vader and Barney team isn't possible..?
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Also based on my experience of how Barney played in the Battlebots Mafia I hosted, he seems like he generally doesn't take things too seriously as town - e.g. he came in hot, VTLed BK after managing to mangle reading a basic message, and then immediately pretended it never happened when RM pointed it out. He also didn't give many reads (or any substance for that matter).
With that being said, his play this game does seem a little bit different - more passive, but with some strategic moments of activity. So I'm not exactly sure of how his play this game can be compared to his meta.
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@Vader
Thanks for the analysis. By POE, I'm also sussing Barney, although there's a chance that it's Wylted too if the investigation somehow got tampered with. I feel like Barney is trying to give the appearance of activity while also avoiding angering anyone - in other words, fluffposting. For example, he pushed Earth in DP2, knowing that Earth isn't really the kind of active player who's going to come back for revenge in later DPs. He also went with some easy lynches with Joebob and GP.
That being said, I think you still have a lot of scummy behavior to answer for. In particular, it seems like you're trying to clear yourself with thematic/mechanical analysis and ignoring many of the behavioral reads on you. Barney is lurky, but you've been actively scummy. Assuming we VTNL today, what should make me, and the other townies, more compelled to vote Barney tmrw than you?
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@whiteflame
I'd like to dig into this a bit because there is (or was) already a known protective role in the game: Earth, who was the Lightning Rod. To my knowledge, it functions the same as Bodyguard, just with the caveat of also being able to take other night actions beyond the NK in place of the target.
That's my bad, I misread Earth's role - I thought he redirected actions performed by a player, not actions performed on a player. In that case, I do agree it functions rather similarly to Bodyguard. That being said, I do want to note that overlapping roles are possible - for example, Emissary and Dreamer both are alignment-determining investigatives.
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I buy Barney's roleclaim. Based on my role and justification, it seemed obvious there was at least one protective role in the game. Also, in the climax of The Mark of Athena, Percy is forced to leave Annabeth behind so that she can complete her quest, despite his strong desire to protect her - so it fits thematically.
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