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@Lemming
A lot of it is my opinions (which is not to say anything needs to stay that way). I have only pulled from old guides a little so far, and those were ones I had a hand in. While the goal is partly to keep information from these sites alive, having been debating on and moderating them for so long I believe it's safe to say much of the information is distilled inside me.
Admittedly I feel a little shame that when I made the Kritiks guide I put in a ton of research, but I did not record citations. I'll attempt to add citations when I make a Kritiks page, but it won't necessarily be the same places I originally gathered that data.
One tragedy is that Imabench wrote a trolling guide, but it was on a fansite for Debate.org someone had made and kept an iron fist control of. When without notice they deleted that site, so that and other good content was lost forever. Which is why this wiki is hosted by Miraheze, because I expect them to survive; further the format allows anyone interested to step up and be an editor.
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@Lunatic
I cannot give this game the full attention expected, but if anyone goes fully MIA consider me a backup candidate.
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The guy is all but claiming Ryan Reynolds used a time machine to mock him… of course he also denies any resemblance to how he’s being mocked, which begs the question of how he knows that’s mocking him?
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@Savant
When that phrase started, I was firmly outside the echo chambers in which it formed and not online much, and thought they were talking about literal Nazis…
I mean; yes they have it coming; but they’re so old their skulls are probably like eggshells.
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Somewhat related to my previous post, I have begun added bracketed description of a single standout point into some debate titles.
I was adding a semantic comedy debate to the previous category, which crossed over with abortion debates (https://debate.miraheze.org/wiki/Category:Abortion_Debates), and it camouflaged with the others in a way that could be misleading if someone mistook it for serious like the rest of them. So "Should Abortion be Illegal in the United States of America" became: Should Abortion Be Illegal in the USA (Rap Exception).
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On that note, I'd say the debates section is far enough along for anyone to join in.
My next goal for that wiki is building some content for the arguments section
I am also considering commonly incorporating a few symbols to do shorthand denotations of effectiveness (➕ and ➖), and logical validity (✔️ and ✖️). Or maybe use the plus/minus for pro/con and leave the strength only testified by the logical validity. Anyone have any thoughts on that?
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@SirAnonymous
Oromagi's series of debates with ramdatt. Since he knew ramdatt wasn't going to reply, he joked around with the resolutions. There were four such debates, two of which had similar topics and therefore the same reply from oromagi. "If you want constructive information about the coronavirus, listen to Andrew Cuomo" became a debate about whether Andrew Cuomo could offer good info about construction during the coronavirus to oromagi. A debate about "WHO," as in the World Health Organization, became a debate about WHO the radio station. A debate about the now former president of Liberty U Jerry Falwell became a debate about Jerry Falwell, septic tank installer.
I've given them their own sub-category!
Plenty of other stuff will eventually end up in there too, but they really do exemplify why basic spell check is important.
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@Savant
This one basically fabricates arguments for Pro.
I just remade that one... Holy crap that was bad!
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@WyIted
Very cool, and best of luck with it!
I honestly considered doing much the same, but settled on something less time intensive for myself.
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@Savant
Unless AI gets a whole lot better, I hope summaries written wholly by it become an outlier. Still, they served well enough to get a barebones operation going... A much as I've had continued fights with it over such issues as identifying that the vote tabs are publicly accessible.
One good thing is that what it writes feels even-handed. But that is a problem if it's even handed with stuff it made up on a topic, instead of what each side covered.
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@Shila
Springfield needs more immigrants to solve their stray cat problem.
Ironically, that is literally what he accidentally argued during the presidential debate (his cat eating commits were to explain why he killed a border security bill).
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@Owen_T
I don't think he's nearly as racist as he pretends to be.
That said, at least he's plagiarizing from an effective speech writer.
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@Lemming
The closest thing is what amounts to a category at wikiversity (https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/Wikidebate), which seems useful, but so laser focused in scope that it doesn't do it for me (they host just the contentions and objections, without study of underlying fundamentals of why those work or not; such as logical fallacies).
There was a time I mistook RationalWiki for the natural place to hold most (not to say all) debate and logic information, but they're opposed to even the amount already hosted there (the Kritik guide I co-authored started as what was to be a page there, but was rejected for being too far removed from their intended scope... not to say I blame them, the mistake was on me).
And there there's of course some good resources specifically for Lincoln-Douglas debates. I like formality, but there's something about LD that feels somehow too formal for my tastes. I suspect it's much the same for most users here, who are here instead of sticking to LD debates.
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@Lemming
I modified that bit to be less downbeat, instead referencing the repeated trend regarding these sites instead of the sport as a whole.
That said, feel free to edit that page into something even better.
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@RemyBrown
Why else would Springfield swing much more for Trump than other places in Ohio?
There's hundreds of reasons for any voter to prefer Trump to Harris. That I ate some unknown percentage of ALL OF THE CATS, need not have any connection.
There's also the problem that Trump is a charismatic cult leader, proclaimed by many of his followers to be the true messiah. Cult members will believe whatever their leaders say, regardless of the evidence literally contradicting it (for which the cognitive dissonance usually only strengthens their resolve).
Do recall that Trump supporters widely shared a video of an American who ate a cat, as proof that Haitians therefore must be doing it (their logic on that still astounds me... she did have dark skin, so make of that what you will).
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Oh and I did not just eat the cats, I did indeed chop up bits of them to make into cologne. But real studies show that 60% of the time, it works EVERY TIME!
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@RemyBrown
Do you admit some quantifiably proportion of Haitians are eating pets in Springfield?
Some percent of users named Barney ate ALL the cats in Ohio last night.
I’m not saying which percent, but it totally actually happened. I’m super serious!
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@RemyBrown
Thank you for demonstrating how to combine straw-man and slippery slope fallacies.
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@Lemming
I hope you’re right. I may have turned into a pessimist regarding this issue.
I can say for certain there’s less formal online debates now than there was about ten years ago (when I got pulled into this hobby), but for all I know the that may have been a fluke; likewise the current low activity could be the outlier.
I have nothing against the intro page being altered to be upbeat.
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As promise (and probably noticed in the announcements), that project is officially unveiled!
Debate and Argument Tactics (DAT for short) is live!
WikiHappy holidays,With the unfortunate pattern of debate sites in mind, I’ve started something of a museum for this site and any others, hosted by Miraherze (it’s a wiki host). It can serve other purposes as well, so long as they’re adjacent.I’ve only briefly run a single wiki before, and that was not an ambitious project like this. So expect suboptimal design and structures. I’m also wholly open to it being massively changed around in ways I cannot predict (the goal of any wiki is really collaboration; heck the goal of debates is often much the same).The site is named Debate and Argument Tactics, and may be found at:
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@RemyBrown
Kill yourself you fucking creep!
Don't tell fellow members to kill themselves. On a lot of sites it's an instant ban (I am applying leeway by assuming the conversation was not serious; but were I a stickler for the rules, I would be forced to issue a long term ban immediately).
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All the debates listed here (save one by request of a participant) are now backed up into the thing I'm working on.
I've set myself the goal of rejecting my perfectionism and share it next week, so stay tuned!
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You can add me as a backup.
Court is ongoing, apparently people can just claim to not remember anything to prevent evidence of their past written statements from being admitted... I thought I had lost all faith in our legal system, but apparently there was more to lose.
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@Best.Korea
Dude! Congratulations!
I honestly thought it was a fixed point that would never change, but you did it!
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Finished the first week of the trial.
Getting cross examined by a lawyer whom I was accusing of perjury was fun but a little nerve-racking.
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@ILikePie5
@Casey_Risk
@pie
I gave my claim for a couple reasons, mainly because I was inactive and would be pushed for it today under threat of death. Plus, this is a busy week for me, and I don't know what my powers actually do; so making myself a bigger target wouldn't hurt town as much as if an active player dies (that said, I've asked the mod if whiteflame or mharman are available to replace me).
My powers are tied to Jr. Troopa's forms he used to fight Mario. Each night I select a player to receive one. I gave magic to Casey last night. I still have shell, wings, spiked helmet.
@Casey
What did magic do for you?
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I am not fully caught up on reading yet, but at least I've slept so can think straight.
I seriously doubt Mharman's claim. I'm Jr. Troopa, a Dreaming God. This makes a Joat unlikely to also be in this game.
VTL Mharman
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<rant>
Courts are stupid, and my friend could not understand what both the judge and I told him... If he uses me as a witness (to which there's not that much I can say), even if he calls me first, I cannot be in the court room until I'm excused as a witness by the other side (and they can reserve that right through the whole damned trial).
Meanwhile, I'm the one who organized all his evidence... There's four goddamned binders full of it. He might as well VTL himself (which I worry is his intent; even if he won't admit that).
</rant>
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I've been up all night prepping, now just waiting for the judge to get here. I'll get a nap after this then get caught up on reading.
But from what I was tagged in, I am dubious of a JOAT, but I haven't actually read the conversation which lead to that outing, so I'll make sense of it when I have two working brain cells to rub together,
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@Mharman
I am helping a friend get ready for court on Tuesday (I'm basically in charge of making his four or five exhibit books). I will not be active this day phase. Once the trial formally starts, I should have a decent amount of time for things like this game (not all the time, but enough).I know he’s not been super active, but cmon man. I feel like what he’s posted is underwhelming, even for what I would expect. Recently all he did was update some list… he can update that but not say anything more about what he’s seeing? Even with his claims about how he’s generally less active DP1 because of how his mind works, I see almost nothing. He has one very weak point on Wylted. That’s it.VTL Barney
Waiting for Monday night, during my final push to prep for trial to pull this...
Knowing it's my most busy time, and once I'm into the evening tomorrow my schedule will open back up...
*slow clap*
That said, I give you credit for tagging me. That's appreciated since I would not have otherwise seen it. So sarcastic slow clap aside, thanks for not being a true bastard.
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No updates unless I've missed something.
Dashboard
Player Role Character
Mhar "A boss"
Lunatic
Pie
Wylted General Guy
WF
Barney Bullshitter "Sonic"
Skipper "A boss"
Cerulean
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Other people, please copy/paste and update as information comes out.
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@Skipper_Sr
Quick reminder... Some noob mistakes can get you automatically mod killed.
Do not PM other players about the game outside of the game
Do not copy/paste anything from PMs (you may paraphrase, but it has to be your own words!)
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Besides that, try to remember that this is just a game, so have fun.
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@Cerulean
Any other thoughts on the game? I saw that you're busy, but you seem to have enough time to collect all of the claims, so I assume you read through thread and might have some opinions at this point.
My reading is surface level. Like I would have missed the General Guy claim had it not been mentioned by others, so I did a word search for it to get the link.
I'm also pretty upfront that I'm little more than dead weight during the first day in any game. Once people are making statements about night actions, then my data analyst brain has some good data points to work with.
Like others have said, Skipper is playing up the being a noob card. I'd say this makes him a touch of a negative asset to town (if scum, his partner would advise he do this; if town, he may he easily buddied and swayed by the scum team into mislynches). That said, unless a new player really really screws up I believe they deserve to make it at least to day two.
You and Mharman was something I'm aware of, but I did not read much of those. Early pushes for reactions are useful to town, but are unlikely to lead to a lynch so aren't much of a tell to me.
Wylted I have an uneasy feeling about. He's a wild card, and hasn't pulled any stunts yet. Also I'm seeing him mention me picking up on Mharman's logic, but I don't know what that is (again, I've skimmed rather than deep read).
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Dashboard
Player Role Character
1. Mhar "A boss"
2. Lunatic
3. Pie
5. Wylted General Guy <- Null (but like, read his short posts null, instead of the longer posts haven't read yet null)
6. WF
7. Barney Bullshitter "Sonic"
8. Skipper "A boss" <- First time player, let's be a little easy on them to make it not a last time player... Also he's Like A Boss
9. Cerulean
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Other people, please copy/paste and update as information comes out.
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@Skipper_Sr
That was a stupid question on my part to ask if townies had their own chat, lol
Nope. Each game we close our eyes during the night phase while they post publicly, and we use the honor system to not peek.
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Yes, they usually have a chat room on discord.
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I am helping a friend get ready for court on Tuesday (I'm basically in charge of making his four or five exhibit books). I will not be active this day phase. Once the trial formally starts, I should have a decent amount of time for things like this game (not all the time, but enough).
I'm Sonic the Hedgehog, the lead villain of the Halo franchise.
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@whiteflame
Going to need to see some signs of life.VTL Barney
...Brains! 🧟
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/in (if you get enough fully active players, set me as a backup)
FYI, do not expect a high activity level from me. Consider me a filler so that the game can happen.
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@WyIted
You are retarded if you think Trump got on stage and simulated giving the microphone a blow job
In fairness, he did mime it.
But I don't see the problem with a little physical humor.
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The syphilis outbreak taught him well, so he's now more careful in which couches to turn into love seats...
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@Greyparrot
Hopefully that first post was an inside joke between you two (just not that inside).
Anyways, the Showbusiness category would be the place for that. Or maybe Science and Nature if you're talking about Corn consumption.
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@RemyBrown
You'd just have to use a platform which doesn't tie to your identity. Even creating a secondary account on one could do it.
Not that it'll happen here, but I do love embedded images into arguments.
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@WyIted
One can criticize a giant douche, without embracing a turd sandwich.
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@WyIted
Sorry for the delay, I've been moving.
he is basically my administrative assistant and I cannot get her to make dental appointments. Should I stop having sex with her until she does her job?
If that's the satisfaction you need from a relationship, one way or another you must communicate it to give her the opportunity to rise to the challenge. If she cannot, and your emotional fulfillment will not be attained with her without that service, then it will be best to move on and find someone who will be a better match for you.
administration has moved away from being so anti white and anti heterosexual and claims are that Iran is trying to murder Trump.What is the likelihood this means we are very close to going to war?
Even if their plot were successful, it would not be the first time we've assassinated each others leaders (granted, this would be more high profile). I think it is against the financial interests of both countries, so there will not be an overt war any time soon. Likely both would step up the wars by proxy which are the modern standard (such as we can't go to war with Russia, but we can supply Ukraine; or we can't go to war with the entire middle east, but we can supply Israel).
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@badger
Sorry for the delay, I've been moving.
Do you find you can keep up with women's sexual appetites? I cannot. Serious question now. It's hard to keep it from feeling like a chore. Sometimes I feel like I'm prostituting myself for clean laundry and home cooking.
Depends on the woman, but usually no. I have a below average drive in that regard.
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@prefix
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So as Wylted said, awful votes may be reported and will usually be deleted. But the system will always be subjective as it depends on people donating their time to casting votes.
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@skylartayler
What's your favorite dead language?
You have a suspect link in your first post, so we need to confirm you're alive.
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@badger
@WyIted
dick
A bit above average. That said, almost any partner will care more about other aspects of love making.
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@ebuc
You're welcome. Best of luck finding good entertainment.
If I go to rewatch that show, I'll probably just buy it on Google, since it's available there. I just dislike spreading my movie collection out into different platforms, so I try to stick with Amazon.
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@Greyparrot
Ironically, I was relatively safe while in the military, only to have 2 near death experiences after: once at a plywood mill and again on a tug on the ocean at night.I was told as an infant I was also supposed to have died from spinal meningitis, but I have no memory of it.
Do I want to know what you were doing out in the ocean at night? ;)
Also that so many people survive to adulthood these days is weird. Like normal for us because we live it, but historically it's very weird.
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