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@ADreamOfLiberty
I oppose using force or deception to alter the mentoring relationship between parents and children when parents aren't using violence. There is a difference.
So you assume that Christian parent using deception and force on a child is okay, and you assume that its wrong for LGBT to use deception on a child?
The only difference I see is that its okay when a Christian does it and not okay when LGBT does it.
And also, assumption that Christian parents arent using force against children is false.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I just don't get to force
Exactly, which makes your opinion on what is ideal irrelevant, as anyone can just reject your opinion in favor of people deciding for themselves what is ideal and good for them, a much better system.
But you support Christians forcing their lies on children, so thats another contradiction.
Nothing else you said warrants a comment.
I figured you will run out of unproven claims eventually.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I see that you edited your comment.
A cheap tactic used by Gp as well.
People often want things they can't have or that are good in the short term but not the long term.
Irrelevant, as your assumption that people shouldnt get what they want because they often want things they cant have is false and even goes against the very idea of liberty you claim to support.
Also, you dont decide what is good in long term for others, people decide that for themselves.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
People only want to be homosexual if they were already homosexual.
Irrelevant assumption.
They're owed a thousand years of indoctrination? Good luck justifying that moral theory.
Well, not exactly thousand. Maybe about two thousand of years.
That was not implied.
Well, my bad.
You said that the only moral way to convince someone is through reason, but at the same time you defend Christian indoctrination of others done through no reason, so one cannot really know what you really think because you contradict yourself so much.
It's an assertion supported by the relative value of outcomes. I won't take your word that it is false.
Thats false too.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
The version with an objective and sound arguments concluding it.
More assumptions.
Interesting that you find the claim that homosexuality isn't the ideal outcome homophobic.
If person wants to be homosexual, it is an ideal outcome for him.
And you claiming its better for him to be with a woman is obviously homophobic.
I dont see why you act surprised with the obvious.
I'm not OK with it but I won't use force or deception to prevent it. It's the way our species works. You don't get between a mammal and his/her children. It won't end well.
Ah, so you are just scared that parents will beat you up because you saved their children from being indoctrinated.
However the LGBT cult has infected corporations and schools. If I had bible quizes at my work place you can bet I would be just as pissed.
Christians were infecting schools and corporations for thousands of years, and still infect children today.
But still, what you are saying is an assumption that its somehow wrong for LGBT to infect schools and corporations.
Similarly I wouldn't dream of using force or lies to prevent an LGBT cultist from trying to teach their children (in the rare case they have one) their values.
Ah, I see what you mean.
No, actually, I dont.
Your idea of parents having right to indoctrinate and harm children is wrong, even if you apply it equally to both Christians and LGBT.
But you cant apply it equally because, as previously explained, Christians had their fun for thousands of years and LGBT needs fun too.
1.) It's immoral to force kids into your education system2.) Therefore the only moral way to educate kids is with the full and honestly gained consent of the adult and child3.) Thus if a parent has an objection to only one subject or claim the choice is between teaching that one claim and teaching nothing4.) It's better to teach everything else minus that one claim5.) The only moral way to convince someone is through reason. Teach kids reason and then when they are adults and can evaluate your arguments correctly make the argument. This is the difference between indoctrination and debate
Bunch of assumptions, plus a false claim that Christians are convincing their children through reason.
Perhaps.
Not perhaps, but masturbation is certainly healthy.
That is not the issue I am contending. I am saying that if you've got a kid of a flat earther and the parent forbids teaching round earth it's better to teach the kid logic so he can cure himself of the delusion rather than making an issue of it and having the kid withdrawn from your school entirely
Thats an assumption. And false.
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@HistoryBuff
I am not a Christian anymore.
You can unblock me now.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Liberty says you can't steal money to buy schools which indoctrinate kids against parent's values.
Your version of liberty, yes.
Reason says if you try you're going to get guillotined.
No, thats what you say.
I also want the best for people, and the best thing for anyone in general is to find a lifelong partner of the opposite sex (and same species) and have 2-4 kids. That is what makes people happy. I've seen overwhelming evidence of that. Having promiscuous sex may hamper that goal. Having a baby with someone you aren't really compatible with (say because it was an unintended pregnancy in high-school) really hampers this goal.
As much as your homophobic assumptions are fun to read, they are also false.
If people can't have that due to sexual orientation beyond their control, I still want them to have the best life possible; but 'we' should never do anything that would convince an impressionable young mind that they are in this category. If they are, they should come to that conclusion based on the undeniable evidence of their own urges.
So you are okay with Christians brainwashing their kids and putting them in categories, but God forbid if someone teaches a child that gay is okay.
...and children can be made to believe anything when they're young enough. But they grow up, and when they do they look back and realize that they would have believed anything they were told. Then they feel resentment for being used.
Well, yes, children do feel used when Christians indoctrinate them into their cult. I dont dispute that.
But for you, its only bad when LGBT does it!
You want to kill an idea long term? Force it on the young. They may not all deconvert but those that do will never relapse. I have no doubt the same is in the process of happening for the LGBT cult and I dearly hope the coming sexual conservatism doesn't harm more innocent people than are already being harmed.
Your "forcing idea" would just result in that you cant teach kids anything, maybe other than scientific facts.
Its a scientific fact that masturbation is healthy, so really, I dont even see why you fight battles which you will obviously lose.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
I dont see how is my opinion on age of consent relevant to masturbation?
Traditional parents are the problem, as they literally brainwash kids into believing God hates them if they masturbate.
I remember reading a story about a girl who got hit by lightning while masturbating, and some Christian trolls said "God punished her for sinning (masturbating)".
You have to understand that Christians and traditional parents are the fortress of evil and most of anti-reason.
I dont know why someone like you defends traditional families.
I thought you are into bestiality?
Anyway, you say "convince adults".
Thats nonsense.
Christians cannot be convinced into anything, since the reasoning ability usually dies when person is religious for too long.
You say rebelling is evidence of brainwashing.
Is it?
Well, many children rebel against their Christian parents, but also many children get turned by brainwashing and continue to spread Christian hate to themselves and others.
You say "teach kids reason", but masturbation is reasonable and healthy, so good job using logic there.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Also, religious people spread lies such as that semen retention turns you into some sort of a super human.
Of course, the entire science disagrees.
There is not a single study which ever pointed to any benefits of never masturbating.
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@ADreamOfLiberty
Actually, children are often shamed for masturbating or watching porn.
I think sex education is supposed to include that there is no shame or harm in masturbation.
It would greatly help children with religious parents, since we know all the lies religious people spread about masturbation even today.
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There are only two main ways to have a country:
1. Where people disagree
2. Where no one disagrees
USA, Sweden, Japan... have a lot of 1.
Russia, and especially North Korea are much closer to 2.
Its hard to say which one of those two is better for the country, but countries like Sweden, Japan and Switzerland are definitely better than Russia by far.
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@zedvictor4
Catkins dandelions and raspberries have short seasons, so you will need to expand your dietary range.
Catkins exist from february to late may.
Around that time, I will have strawberries.
Also, I will have raspberries somewhere in summer.
Later, the apples and nuts might show up.
Dandelions dont have short season.
They grow from february all the way to winter.
Its the flowers which have short season.
Dandelion greens are pretty much available all the time except in winter.
If you look at dandelion flower, just look at the greens which grow with it. Those greens are almost always available.
I dont live near ocean or sea, but I do live near river and forest, and I have some land where I have some food growing.
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Happiness, no matter how long it lasts, once it disappears it feels like it lasted for a very short time.
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@zedvictor4
Have you researched water lilies yet?
I dont think there are any here where I live.
I notice everything which grows in high amount.
I need at least 1200 calories daily.
I dont really get much from finding one plant.
Thats why I need to collect at least 100 dandelions per day, at least a few kilograms of raspberries to gain weight.
I can get lots of calories from raspberries or strawberries because I can eat lots of them.
Tree catkins I am not sure. They do work as food to stop hunger, I am just not sure how much calories they have.
I might also have to gather some apples, I have trees growing near, if they produce in time, depending on how long I can put up with this experiment.
The biggest issue is not hunger. I dont even feel hungry.
But lack of taste is such a big problem.
Catkins taste like dust. Dandelion greens and flowers have virtually no taste. Its almost like chewing paper.
Thats why I am looking forward to raspberries and strawberries. They will be nice change.
I basically cant stop thinking about tasty food.
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@zedvictor4
And cooking makes foodstuff more digestible
I know.
I might try cooking catkins if they dont become softer soon.
And dandelions produce their own sugars, you need a yeast to promote fermentation.
I know how fermentation works, and you dont need to buy yeast, because dandelions and fruit usually have wild yeast on them which works similar to convert sugar into alcohol.
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@FLRW
Thats a good way to calculate.
I guess its possible that I was not drinking enough water recently.
I tend to drink about 2 liters per day, but I probably should be drinking closer to 2.5 liters or maybe even 3.
But its kinda hard to not drink for 8 hours, and then drink 3 liters in 6 hours.
Its possible, of course, if I drink 700 mililiters once every 1.5 hours in those 6 hours.
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@ebuc
Skyler
Thats a very good name.
It fits for a man or woman scientist, chess master, or some strong guy, or some feminine guy, or a really cute woman.
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I noticed something in life.
If I eat food all the time, I dont really enjoy it much.
It just becomes something regular, which brings no much joy.
But if I deprive myself of food for a day or two, I start thinking about food, and all I can think of is food, and once I eat it, it feels really good.
Additionally, if I only eat some food, but not too much, if I am not overeating at time when I eat, the feeling becomes even better.
This stands as counter to over eating.
When I researched about satanism, I learned that it teaches overeating.
At the time, it seemed really good.
But now I am looking at other extreme, which is eating only a small amount of food in a day.
I use same logic with water drinking.
After I wake up, I dont drink water for about 8 hours of the day, and then after some time of thirst, I drink lots of water at once, about 700 mililiters, and then few hours later another 700 mililiters, and then some time later some more water.
It seems that
"thirst and drinking"
"Hunger and eating"
"Depriving of something and something"
These are opposites which are best when they each exist for some time, and then get negated by the other.
Even masturbation feels better when you dont masturbate for a week or for a month.
Of course, there is an ideal ratio.
As a general rule, its okay to not eat for one day or two or for most of the day.
Its usually okay to not drink water for 8 to 10 hours unless you become too thirsty.
Its okay to reduce amount of calories you eat as long as you are still getting all the vitamins and you are not losing weight too quickly.
Its okay to eat once or twice a day. In fact, it probably works better for health if you are not constantly eating and digesting food.
In Japan, people live very long and they have a rule where they dont "eat until full".
They dont practice things such as "eat until you are full and cant eat anymore", because they think its bad for health.
And it feels good to stop yourself from eating before you feel like you had enough.
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@Mall
Well, you can either debate either not.
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@Mall
Sure.
If debate is 3 rounds with 2000 character limit.
And topic should be "People should be gay sometimes" with me as Pro.
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@WyIted
I guess the real difference between Christian and non Christian sex is that it spreads less diseases such as Aids and monkey pox.
You are right. Non Christian sex does spread less diseases.
10 Countries with Highest STD Rates
- South Africa. 37,272.5 per 100k. Next: 6 Facts About International Mother Language Day.
South Africa is 80% Christian.
It must be 20% of atheists who spread all those diseases.
Those evil atheists!
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@WyIted
Did you know that Christians when they have sex also put their penises into women
Its possible, but if your sex Ed is limited to that, you might not successfully prevent monkey pox.
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@n8nrgim
The problem is more about finding that food in nature.
I know its a good food, but the nature doesnt currently have it in offer.
What I have plenty of right now are catkins and dandelion greens and some other greens like clover.
Dandelion flowers should appear soon too, and catkins should stop being tough and green and should become flowers soon too.
I read that catkins are tastier once they become flowers.
Raspberries and strawberries I should have soon. I dont have them right now.
Sure, I would love to find a sandwich in nature, or some chocolate, but nature simply doesnt give that.
At best, you can make some treat from raspberries.
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@WyIted
I would teach sex Ed the way
Tell us what your sex Ed teaches.
Does it teach the typical Christian nonsense story of bucket and flowers?
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Green catkins are hard to chew, but I will try catkins which have flowered. They should be easier to chew.
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@Double_R
Its a common mistake people make.
They want to prevent others from doing what they will regret.
However, failure and regret is how we learn what we want.
Besides, anything can produce regret.
I would say maybe some high rates of regret and harm could justify banning something, but trans people want to have support and support helps them.
They rarely regret seeking to do what they want, but even if they did regret, it doesnt really prevent them from doing what they want, and judging trans people and misgendering them certainly doesnt help them.
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@FLRW
I have noticed that I feel better when I eat edible plants that grow in nature or that I grow myself.
For some reason, fast food from stores, despite being very tasty, doesnt seem to improve the mood throughout the day.
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@FLRW
I am certain that some of the food I gather will have those two. I think raspberries might have them.
Although I cant wait for dandelion flowers to appear, not just for food, but for dandelion wine.
Last time I just put bunch of dandelion flowers in plastic bottle, added sugar and water and closed it.
In about 7 days, it became good alcohol.
Although this time, instead of adding bought sugar, I will add raspberries.
I wouldnt really recommend people to do this tho.
Its much easier to buy better alcohol at the store.
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@zedvictor4
Dandelions are extremely difficult to eradicate without herbicides.
I see thousands of dandelions growing around.
Its free food, basically.
Of course, I make sure not to eat from areas near road, because thats polluted.
Wild meat, fish and other seafoods would be your best source of B12.
The problem is that I dont like fish.
As a kid, I used to go fishing and I would catch a fish or two every day, sometimes even three or more.
However, I never ate them.
As for hunting, I have no experience in hunting.
Sure, you can hunt birds, they are everywhere, but I really dont want to eat them.
I am more of a gatherer than a hunter.
Hunter gathering is very time consuming and labour intensive, which is one of the reasons we developed other systems of nutrient provision.
It depends on what are you gathering.
Hunting takes time, fishing takes time.
Gathering dandelions takes less than half an hour.
Catkins are easy to gather as well.
The only food which I have problem gathering are raspberries, it takes a long time because they are tiny.
But they are easy to eat.
The only real problem with being hunter gatherer is eating all you gather.
Eating raw catkins, for example, is difficult unless you mix them with water. They take too long to chew without water.
You can also cook them, but I kinda want to try raw diet first.
Dandelion root is even worse to chew, which is one of the reasons I avoid it.
Raspberries and greens are easy to chew, but raspberries are kinda difficult to gather.
Of course, I have the advantage of having lots of raspberries in my yard, which is why it feels like cheating to gather them.
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Its not the death that I fear.
I was non-alive (dead) for millions of years.
Its the dying that I fear.
Dying can be very painful.
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@Mall
Is it wrong to insist on the l.g.b.t.?
I think that people should be gay.
Does that count?
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I have been doing lots of research, and I think that I am ready to have an experiment where I live on food from nature for a longer time.
Mainly, I would focus on this food:
1. Dandelion greens and other edible wild greens
2. Tree catkins/pollen
3. Raspberries
4. Dandelion flowers
5. Willow seeds
6. Grass pollen
Including raspberries in this list feels like cheating, but I do like sugar and I am not sure how will I manage to go for months without chocolate if I skip on raspberries as well.
I already ate lots of tree catkins raw.
I know the ones I ate are safe to eat.
They are just harder to chew than regular food.
But they seem to be available in great amount.
Not all are safe to eat.
The only thing which I am curious about is how nutritious are they.
I know squirrels eat catkins, so there probably is some good nutrition in them.
With dandelion greens and any greens, I will make sure to wash them.
I dont want to risk getting sick from unwashed food.
Grass pollen is something I am uncertain about, but I will give it a try.
Edible willow catkins should give me plenty of food, and I want to try those willow seeds as well.
As for nuts and fruit, they become available later in year, and at that point I will already be ending experiment to view results.
I will be taking vitamins, as I am not sure how would I even obtain B12 in nature from plants alone.
I will begin experiment as soon as enough green edible plants appear, because I dont want to start on catkins alone.
I will not be eating dandelion roots, because that kills the plant entirely and its unnecessary with dandelion greens available.
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Science has already proved that Christianity is child abuse.
Making children dumber is child abuse.
Religious people are dumber.
"To investigate, Daws and Hampshire surveyed more than 63,000 people online, and had them complete a 30-minute set of 12 cognitive tasks that measured planning, reasoning, attention and working memory.
The participants also indicated whether they were religious, agnostic or atheist.
As predicted, the atheists performed better overall than the religious participants, even after controlling for demographic factors like age and education.
Agnostics tended to place between atheists and believers on all tasks.
In fact, strength of religious conviction correlated with poorer cognitive performance.
However, while the religious respondents performed worse overall on tasks that required reasoning, there were only very small differences in working memory."
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@thett3
The onus is on him to prove why his opinions on what’s good for my child should overrule mine
It was already proven by science.
The closest thing is custody
Since you werent able to provide any logic to that claim, but just contradicted yourself over and over, there is nothing for me to respond to.
Am I supposed to debate against your feelings?
Science already disproved Christian feelings plenty of times.
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They are legally required to care for them, nurture them, cloth them, and provide for their health and education.
So that includes sex education.
This is too easy.
Children are the legal property of their parents.
This contradicts with what you said above.
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@thett3
Simple only if you believe that children are parent's property.
If they are not your property, then you do not get to dictate them at all or harm their well being just because your imaginary rules regarding well being arent in line with science.
Well, its not simple even if you believe that children are your property, because raising your property badly would harm other people's property.
But lets not promote slavery. I thought USA abolished that.
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@thett3
So you hold opinion that you have a right to control your child's indoctrination, so indoctrination is not something bad in your view.
And since your indoctrination is obviously not any better for the child, in fact, Christian indoctrinations are often worse, one can conclude that the only argument which you have is based on ownership.
You assume that you have right to ban education from children just because they are your children, but that is obviously wrong.
And since you cant own children in any sense, it follows that your argument falls apart.
Then you make the argument of well being, but everyone knows that sex education is good for well being, where Christian indoctrination is harmful since Christianity promotes child abuse.
Further, individual parent doesnt decide what is well being. Thats for science to decide, not for your triggered Christian ideology to decide.
Then you make the argument that "unrelated individuals dont get a say", but that is classical misunderstanding of a Communist society we are evolving to.
There are no unrelated individuals, because if you raise your kids badly, it harms everyone else.
Then you contradict yourself by saying "Sex education is good for well being. Parent does whats good for wellbeing" and then "Parent has right to deny sex education (to deny well being)".
Then you say how fornication is a sin, how you dont want for kids to get STDs...
And you follow a classical but naive mindset that "if you dont tell kids about sex, they wont know about it until they are 18".
Kids learn about sex from their peers, so your struggle to keep kids in ignorance is about as useless as Jesus's suicide.
As much as your Christian ideology is silly and one can make fun of it all day, you should at least try to defend it better because right now it seems like you are not even trying.
You should have taken notes from time when I was Christian.
Really, I put effort, but even I was eventually sick from all the sick things I had to justify when defending Christianity.
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Tim Pool says we should abolish the police.
Everyone would be speeding in traffic all the time.
Ordinary people care very little about stopping crime themselves.
If I saw a gang robbing a store, would I try to stop them?
Would I risk getting shot for someone else's property?
I agree that there are problems with the current law system, but to say that we should just abolish it is a fantasy which I doubt anyone can take seriously.
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@Greyparrot
Lol, yes you are correct. the polls definitely say Trump will lose California Electoral Votes by double digits.
Its 54 electoral votes that will likely most if not all go to Biden.
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@thett3
but you have no right to indoctrinate my kids
Do you have a right to indoctrinate your kids?
Because if yes, then I dont see what is your opposition to indoctrination.
If no, then you agree that you have no right to teach religion to your children.
It seems that no matter where you turn, you lose.
Also, do you think that you have a right to ban your kids from education?
Obviously, no, you do not have that right.
So really, education about sex only triggers you because you think sex is a sin.
And what do you mean when you say "your kids"?
It obviously doesnt mean that you own kids or are allowed to dictate their life as if they are your property,
so I am curious what kind of rights do you think you have when it comes to "your kids"?
You raised a good point about that you pay money, but I think we can all agree that that doesnt turn kids into your property.
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@Greyparrot
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@Greyparrot
It seems that Biden is winning in latest polls.
And there is still 10 more months of Biden oppression, followed by possibly 4 more years of Biden oppression.
Vote Biden! Oppress MAGA!
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@FLRW
Yes, God is the smartest being in the Universe and he created pediatric cancer.
He probably did it because he wanted to prove that he can do all sorts of horrible things to people and animals and still trick so many people into believing that he is all good.
Imagine creating a world in which one animal cannot survive unless the other animal is slowly eaten alive. God created that world!
And because Adam ate an apple 6000 years ago, children have cancer today.
To Christians, that is fair and makes sense.
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@Intelligence_06
this is probably something I see myself doing in a few decades.Sometimes, I just wanna die because life's hard and dying with coolness points is cool.
Life is hard, but dying tends to be harder.
Have you considered moving to live in a forest instead of dying in a few decades?
The main reason why modern life is hard is because almost everyone is living close to poverty, and many things can happen which can send you into poverty.
Working 8 hours a day 5 days a week is a privilege.
Many people have to work 10 to 12 hours a day, often even 6, even 7 days a week.
Also, there is the after work effect.
When you come back from work you feel so tired that you cant really enjoy anything properly.
And you are so tired that you have to rest for entire day and then free time passes really fast, it feels like you dont even have free time.
The only way to have actual free time is to reduce sleeping hours, which is horrible as you lose ability to even feel good, and the time at work seems even longer.
There is alcohol which can help to negate all the suffering, but coming drunk to work can have its own bad outcomes.
In conclusion, the day when society stopped being hunter gatherer is the day when we condemned ourselves to live like shit just so that few rich people can have everything they wish for.
It was a trade which benefited only one side.
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@Greyparrot
Managed by those with the will to wield it.
Ah, you are a poet.
Although poems usually have more than one line.
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Ah yes, gotta hate people who move to USA illegally to find better life.
Didnt your ancestors move to America illegally or are you guys actually native Americans?
OwO
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@Greyparrot
Trump was not morally accurate back then, but surely we should assume that he is morally accurate now.
Well, actually, it would be stupid to assume that Trump is morally accurate now.
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@Greyparrot
Grab ’em by the pussy. You can do anythingGp: that statement is accurate
Its not morally accurate.
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@Sidewalker
And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab ’em by the pussy. You can do anything.
Thats the guy who fights for conservatism and family values?
One must appreciate the joke.
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