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@WyIted
What did he claim anyway, I forget?
Something confirmable. I don't think he gave anything specific, unless he did and I just forgot.
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@Lunatic
@Mharman
Maybe not, but it's still a risky move.
Lunatic, can we get a vote tally?
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Okay, so 420 really threw a wrench in the works here. He's about to get modkilled, which will leave us with 6 town and 2 mafia. If we mislynch somebody today, that puts us at MYLO tomorrow, which is nuts. The consensus here seems to be that if we are going to lynch somebody, we lynch either Whiteflame or Pie. I'm not crazy about either of those tbh. I don't like the idea of killing WF due to him claiming cop (I realize that Wylted's role sheds some doubt on his claim, but it's still not a direct cc), and I'm not entirely convinced by the Pie train either. I really don't like the idea of being at MYLO DP2, which makes me think that maybe we should just No Lynch today.
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Alright, I went to see some live music last night and have several notifications and a bunch of pages to catch up on. Give me a moment here to get caught up.
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@ILikePie5
I think it may be of use for everyone to state what type of thing they are—like a Building, Troop, Resource, Boost, etc to lock scum into categories for their fake claims.
I'm fine with claiming that. I'm a Troop.
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I'm going to give my reads on the situation here.
Wylted - I'm never sure how to read Wylted, especially during DP1. That being said, he has apparently claimed Neighborizer, a confirmable role, and did so very early, so I highly doubt he's lying about it. I don't think Wylted would be the type to claim such a role and then say "Oh noes, I was roleblocked!" Can't see it.
Whiteflame - This is the one I'm most conflicted on. On the one hand, he's an un-cc'ed Cop with an early claim, which is a good sign. On the other hand, both Pie and DD found his explanation of his role based on his character to be a bit sus. Right now, it feels like I'm viewing an argument about whether Dart Monkeys in Bloons Tower Defense having an upgrade that lets them see camo means they have camo vision, except I've never played BTD before in my life and don't know what a dart monkey is. Maybe Whiteflame just genuinely misunderstood his role PM, or maybe he's fakeclaiming. Either way, it's not a good look. For now, I'll say I'm slightly sus of him.
Pie - I'm not really sure how to tell apart scum Pie from town Pie. He's a very active player either way. Nothing he has done so far gives me obvious scum vibes. I'll put him in null for the time being.
Savant - Savant always comes off as slightly scummy to me for whatever reason, but particularly here. I just don't really follow his logic for scumreading Pie, and I don't get why he's so confident and assertive about his scumreads this early in the game. In terms of Savant's vibes, I simply do not like them.
DD - This is my first game with him so far, so I can't do any meta-reads. I'm still not crazy about early conspiracy theories, but he has been giving reads and trying to get players to be active. Slight town read.
Mharman - A few large reads posts and not much else. I can buy that he's been busy with other stuff. It's the Fourth of July weekend after all. Null read.
420 - He could be just playing dumb at the advice of his scum buddy, but if that was the case, I honestly feel like his partner would be telling him to be a bit more active. 420 has just been doing so little that I feel like his townslip at the beginning was more than likely genuine. My strongest townread at this point.
Barney - He hasn't really said that much yet. Barney tends to make fluff posts and such, but even so, I'm not impressed with the lack of substance in what he's written so far. Null, very slightly leaning towards scum.
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@Savant
Earlier everyone was calling me completely insane for my reads. Now we're agreeing that whiteflame is town and 420 is not an automatically safe town read. Maybe it's time to consider my other read that everyone ignored—that is, Pie being scum.
I mean, clearly we aren't all in agreement that Whiteflame is town, given that Pie is sus of him. Since I know basically nothing about CoC, I have absolutely no idea what to make of his description of his role, though I will say that Cop is a pretty ballsy claim to make right out the gate, since a claim like that is ripe for being counter-claimed. Maybe Pie has some more information that would give us good reason to sus him of fake claiming, but for now I lean town on Whiteflame.
As for Pie, he could be scum, but so could anyone else at this point. I have a null read on most players right now. Why, specifically, do you believe Pie is scum? I'd like to hear your whole argument.
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@WyIted
Savant is 62% to be scum and whiteflames odds of being scum are around 40%
How do you figure that?
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@WyIted
I'm not going to get into this with you right now. All I'll say is that I really don't think there's anything compelling here. If some stronger evidence comes out later that suggests Savant and Whiteflame are scum, then I'll reconsider, but for now, they're both null reads for me.
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@WyIted
That scum slip is about 90% accurate and if you ignore a similar one in the future just because sometimes the 10% is true, you are doing yourself a disservice
Gonna be honest here Wylted, you were going off basically nothing in UPick, and I think it's crazy that you got the whole town to go along with you in voting out JoeBob. Like I said, I only went along with it because I was scum. Based on Whiteflame's response to DD, I don't really think there's anything here either.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
The current conspiracy theory is that Savant noticed my VTL on his scum buddy then notified Whiteflame of it via... I think Discord was the standard last time I was here... so that he could respond.
I'll be honest, I don't really make much of this conspiracy theory. Last game, Wylted came up with a theory that JoeBob and Moozer (they're not in this game but have played in the previous few) were the two scum based on a perceived scum slip, despite JoeBob having a confirmed protective role and Moozer essentially being the DP3 innocent child (Wylted pushed the theory on DP2). I didn't really say anything and just went along with it because I was scum, but if I was town, there's no way I would have just let it slide.
My point here being, behavioral tells can be worthwhile, but there's a difference between reading someone's behavior and looking too deep into every little thing and trying to make connections that aren't there. Plus, I'm willing to buy Whiteflame's explanation tbh.
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@ILikePie5
So this post rings alarm bells for me. If you guys read the previous game, Casey for most of the game was just reiterating what I would say. Here he is sort of reiterating what Savant said earlier.
Respectfully, I think it's clear that I added on to what Savant said as opposed to just restating it. Also, Savant seems to be null-reading 420/Underdog at best, while I still think he's most likely town. I just am not yet willing to dismiss the idea that he could be scum. For now though, I townread him. Actually, right now he's the only one that I townread. Everyone else is null for me.
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420-1776 just gave a blatant town slip.So blatant that it could easily be a scum strategy.
I don't know much about Underdog or if he's ever played Mafia before (I'm assuming he hasn't) but I will say that one time I was playing a game of The Resistance (social deduction board game) with my grandma. It was her first time playing the game and she kind of played dumb the whole time and acted like she didn't quite get it. She ended up being one of the spies and totally pulled the wool over all our eyes.
That being said, I think Underdog is still more likely to be town than scum, but it's something to keep in mind.
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@WyIted
So 420 claims to be underdog here
Good catch. I just sort of skimmed through that 'debate' and didn't really think anything of the fact that Underdog had decided to be a judge for whatever reason.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
The people saying 420 should claim just because they are new are retarded so I'll go back and note who did that, I remember seeing at least one.
I'm fine with not getting a claim from them yet, but I would like them to answer Pie's other questions about how familiar they are with mafia.
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@whiteflame
Glad you had a great vacation! I've never been on a cruise before, but some of my family has, and they all enjoyed it.
That being said, I don't know why we're jumping to the conclusion that there isn't a theme split. Don't see anything about that in the OP.
From the signup page:
This is probably the closest game to a "role madness" game I think I've made in a while. I just was having some fun with the set up here. There is no theme split.
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Wylted is being Wylted as usual, I see.
I have to admit, I don't know much about Clash of Clans. And by don't mean much, I mean I know basically nothing whatsoever. Should we get everyone to reveal their characters? Granted there's no theme split, but it still might be useful to lock the scum into early character claims.
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Sorry, the current mafia is Lunatic's Clash of Clans Mafia. Austin's Player's Choice Mafia was the previous one. Got that mixed up, whoops. Minor mistake.
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Current Mafia:
Austin - Player's choice mafia
Signups:
None
In the Hopper:
Casey_Risk - Ace Attorney Mafia
On Hold:
Mharman - Gunplay Mafia
RationalMadman - 8 player game, unknown theme
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Woohoo, my first win as scum, and my first win where I actually feel like I contributed to the victory! I made a blunder when I voted for the shirt and ended up letting Wylted get it, but it all worked out in the end.
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@Barney
@AustinL0926
It's alright. To be honest, I didn't see myself surviving this DP anyway. I didn't see that watcher thing coming, though.
Austin, we have enough votes now. I'm out.
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@ILikePie5
Also, I have information that basically confirms Casey as scum.
Very curious what this information you're supposedly privy to is.
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@Moozer325
No offense, but that’s a pretty scummy role to claim, especially with all these vigs floating around.
I don't agree. As Wylted already said, if I'm town and I get lynched at this point, it's not really a huge deal because it prevents the mafia from doing the NK for the third time in a row. This makes it a good idea for the town to kill me. It wouldn't be very wise for me to claim that role at this point in the game if I was scum.
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I'm at work again as usual. I've just been crazy busy this week. I'd appreciate it if you waited to vote me out until I get home and have the chance to properly defend myself. For now, I can't talk too much.
My role is that if I am lynched, no one can die the following night.
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@Owen_T
I have a few ideas for debates, though no one seems interested in the ones I try to start. Some debates I have an interest in possibly starting:
- Pinball is a sport (I'd be Pro)
- The Christian doctrine of Atonement is ethically tenable (I'd be Con)
- Juries in the US should be informed of their ability to use jury nullification (I'd be Pro)
Are you interested in any of these?
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Sorry everyone, I way overslept this morning. We have to come to a decision today, and my feelings now are the same as last night.
VTL JoeBob
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Alright, a lot of messages sent, but nothing that really changes my mind on anything. I still think that Moozer is our best option, followed by JoeBob. But if the crowd is set on lynching JoeBob this DP, that's fine with me.
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@ILikePie5
Hold on a moment, I just got home and have some catching up to do.
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@Barney
ah nevermind, I misread hours as minutes!
Okay, I was going to say that we had a bit of time to discuss! Personally, I agree that we should lynch either JoeBob or Moozer today. I lean towards Moozer but it's not a huge deal to me which one we choose. If Wylted's theory is right, then we have this game solved.
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Okay, I said I would write a reads post last night but I was tired and didn't get around to it, so here it is now.
Wylted - Still a bit tough for me to say for sure, but the way he's been analyzing everything going on makes me lean town on him.
Barney - Town. His role is one that is very unlikely to go to scum imo and he hasn't been acting scummy.
Pie - He was wrong about Savant, but like I said before, I understood his reasoning. I believe it could have been an honest mistake. The fact that he used his ability to protect someone he thought was an investigative role (and Luna is one) is a good sign. Could still be mafia, but for now I'm not interested in voting him out. Slight town lean.
JoeBob/Moozer - I had a townread on Moozer and a nullread on JoeBob DP1, but now I slightly scumread them both, mainly for behavioral reasons. Wylted's theory that Moozer had a scumslip is interesting. I don't want to read too deeply into every little thing people say on here - that can lead us astray - but it's worth keeping in mind. I do think it's weird that Moozer called himself a 'stalker' instead of a role cop or detective when stalker is explicitly scum-aligned. JoeBob is more likely town of the two due to his role, though it still leaves an uncomfortable amount of protective roles in this game. Maybe it's just a townsided game (one of Austin's friends said it was) but idk how to feel about it.
Lunatic - Claiming an investigative role like his would be a pretty bold move for a mafia, though the nature of it means it would be hard to directly point out if he was lying. Still, his claim that exactly five people took an action last night seems to add up, so that gives him some towncred. Luna is likely town in my book.
Earth - His role is obviously confirmed. Adding Moozer to his neighborhood is a questionable choice imo. It could just be a mistake, and behaviorally he's come off as town to me so far. However, I didn't really suspect him in the last game I played with him and he was mafia. Earth is an experienced player. That said, I'm not sure if his role would be one that Austin would give to scum, and like I said I've been townreading him so far, so Earth is probably good.
Short verson: Barney is my top townread, JoeBob and Moozer are my scumreads.
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I'm at work for the night, as usual. I'll post my reads when I get home.
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@WyIted
No the theory is thay joebob is in a scum chat with him and talking about giving out the commuter role and moozer made a Freudian slip when he meant to say vig, or the post I linked wasnhim.being fed what to say and he just copy and pasted one line too much
Okay, I get what you're saying now. That's an interesting theory.
What are everyone else's thoughts on the matter?
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@Moozer325
No I meant to say vigilante. Also, that post was not about my role, it was in reference to the shirt that WyIted got.
Okay, I guess that makes sense, but that still leaves three protective roles in this game, which is a lot. Then again, one of Austin's friends said it was a townsided game, so maybe that's just how it is. Idk
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@WyIted
So joebob has claimed commuter and moozier made a Freudian slip about commuter here
So, let me get this straight. Savant had a 1x BP, JoeBob can make someone a commuter, Barney can make someone BP, and Moozer apparently has a role that allows him to be a commuter as well? Either Austin made a super townsided game, or someone isn't telling the truth here. Either that, or I've gotten something wrong here.
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@ILikePie5
Yeah, the way Savant was acting came off as scummy to me, though honestly I feel the same way as Austin -- Savant always comes off as a little scummy to me in every game. I didn't scumread anyone else though, so lynching Savant just made sense to me.
I agree that we should get Pie's role now. Pie, your role please.
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@Lunatic
My role is passive, so I didn't take any actions last night.
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Alright, I'm at work right now so I won't be able to talk in this thread too much, but no one died last night, so the doctor must have picked the right person to save, and either Wylted decided not to shoot Pie (unlikely) or someone/something prevented him from doing so.
Who protected Luna from being lynched today?
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@Lunatic
Hold up who wants to help me flip this wagon back around on pie wtf is that logic
It's too late to do that this DP. I'm pretty sure Savant has five votes on him already.
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@AustinL0926
@WyIted
we just need to murder him as hard as we can as a lesson anyone.
I'm not into voting someone as revenge for a mishap, but like I said, Savant is at the top of my list regardless. If the town wants to lynch him, I'm fine with that.
Austin, can we have a vote tally?
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Alright, I've read up on all the posts that have been made since I was last online, though I have to admit that I skimmed through some of the back-and-forth between Savant and Pie. If Savant is town, then he's tunneling hard on Pie. Again, I don't think this is necessarily a situation where one or the other must be scum. I'm not convinced Savant is mafia, but I think Pie's reasoning for suspecting him is pretty reasonable all things considered.
Right now, my PoE has it down to Earth, Luna, JoeBob, and Savant. Barney and Wylted are likely town due to their roles and I've been townreading Pie and Moozer. I guess we could push Luna or JoeBob for inactivity, but Savant is the only one in my pool who actually tilts scum for me. I'm not going to vote Earth this DP.
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I never expected to get the shirt anyway and I'd like it to go to a town member, so I have no problem voting for it.
VTL RESVLTS
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@Savant
Wylted should get it, I don't know why this is even a discussion.
Wylted doesn't really want it though, and Earth wants us to ignore it as well. Barney can't vote for the shirt, so even if everyone else was on board, we couldn't give the vig power to anyone.
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@WyIted
He said it is. You only get a straight affiliation confirmation on rare circumstances so you have to just see if he is lying when it comes time to confirm and you have to judge for yourself if the role is scummy. There are no straight answers in these games.
Fair enough, I suppose. I've been townreading Pie so far, so while I would still like to know what his supposedly confirmable role is, if we're not going to get it this DP, I'm fine with that as long as he genuinely does confirm himself next DP.
I'm down with the plan to lynch Savant, but before I vote, what are everyone's thoughts on giving away the 1x vigilante power? Moozer just said he'd give it to Pie, while Earth didn't want us to use it iirc. Personally, I'm not sure how to feel, but I think it'd be a bit of a waste to let it go to no one.
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@WyIted
I'd just like to know whether Pie's role is actually confirmable or not.
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@ILikePie5
@Savant
I'm fine with trying to get a claim out of Pie.
Pie, your role, please.
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@Savant
Tomorrow never comes.
If Pie doesn't actually confirm himself tomorrow, I'm down with lynching him as a result.
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@ILikePie5
@Savant
WyIted is the most likely town right now, behavioral reads don't change that at all.
Eh, I think Barney's role is at least as likely to be town. It wouldn't make much sense for him to be given a chance at a bonus kill that can only go to his partner and could end up in the town's hands instead. Though I agree that both Barney and Wylted are more likely town than scum just based on their roles.
It might be worth getting a claim from Pie, but a lot of people are town reading him so that's going to be difficult.
Pie has claimed to have a confirmable role that he can confirm tomorrow.
Just for clarity Pie, can you actually confirm your affiliation or just your role? Also, for the sake of the town, would you mind saying what your role actually is?
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@Savant
I don't know how he convinced people that the shot should go to a random person rather than someone who is role-confirmed and whose role is most likely town. Likely town getting the shot is better than some rando getting it, but for some reason Pie would rather just role the dice.
That's not really true though. Pie was very straightforward and clear in saying that it should either go to himself, Luna, or Earth, and that since Earth can't take it since you stole his vote, it should go to him or Luna. He was also pretty clear about his reasoning for scumreading you. Personally, I'd give the 1x vig to either Pie, Moozer, or Barney, but that's just me. The point is, I don't think this is necessarily an either-me-or-him-is-scum situation.
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