Elminster

Pressure wf with me 

Wf doesn't want to claim a universe because it reveals his role. 

This implies there are not multiple bad guys. That his universe so clearly has an overarching villan that it gives away that much. 

I'm willing to pressure on this (not for role but for universe)

To tie him to it and test what he's saying. If he claims something that's not overwhelmingly obvious. We may have hit money this game. 

More likely he is trying to see other universes claimed before he claims so it's safe 

Help with wf first 

Actually before speed

I want him tied to his universe before we kill speed so he doesn't have time to wait and see what other people are claiming. Keep in mind luna gave no flake claims 

Kinda in sync with pie on this 

You said that for me. You soft claimed already early on and it tied you to it. 

Actually happy you said that because it makes even more sense .

****** if you have something that is not at least similar to this , just say me or inform us that you do *******

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You are sephiroth. Damn that cloud and avalanche for trying to stop your goals. You've always had the best intent. Sure you want to destroy the world but it's to bring about paradise and ressurect jenova. No one understands you but all you really want is to bring about world unity. You are deathrpoof because you are connected to the life force and can't truly die. 

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Everyone so far has you are (bad guy). He flips why they are bad and explains how they are morally justified with the actions they did in their universe. You are town 

When someone else claims something without a justification for why what they are doing is right , I'll entertain it. 

I've asked anyone to just type yes if they had one. 

No one has and every character claimed so far fits that mold or has a justification that confirms that thought. Including mine 

Then you are objectively the outlier 

Actually can you claim your universe. I want to tie you to this 

My bet is you are simba or mufasa and wanted to claim something in the same universe but weren't 100 percent scar would be a safe bet

So you went with something that was super safe. 

I keep asking for an in-depth description about why your character thinks he's doing the right thing and you refuse to give it lol 

I promise you that's a commonality 

You mean make a villan theme and use two from the same show. I promise you I could dig up a load on ddo lol 

The group is one thing but it's also the fact that it's not polarizing. That's the one common thing up to this point. All town players are polarizing

I also have a horrible time with reading supa as always. He takes other reads and tries to put his on play on them without giving much thought himself. 

Usually this is a town tell from him imo but I don't remember a scum supa other than that live game where he was stumbling all over his words and backtracking. So I think this supa is consistent with his 

"I'm lazy town meta "

Actually if anything it's worse for you because even if you wanted to risk scar at that point you coudnt lol. 

He's absolutely trying to justify the actions. That's no trying to over complicate it. It's literally every role so far and the characters can be easily seen as fitting that mold. Ill write a generic descriptor for an example (not my character )

You are sephiroth. Damn that cloud and avalanche for trying to stop your goals. You've always had the best intent. Sure you want to destroy the world but it's to bring about paradise and ressurect jenova. No one understands you but all you really want is to bring about world unity. You are deathrpoof because you are connected to the life force and can't truly die. 

The only reason I'm saying he's prob mufasa or simba is because as scum that's a random af thing to claim. He's prob a protagonist in lion kind and just Google bad guys and found the same wiki I did 

He could claim scar but not enough information. He would have no idea whether scar does or does not exist. He only claimed because of the slip in live so it was fast pressure and he hadn't seen all the other claims so he went with the super safe one. Thats my bet. He wasn't at risk of being lynched so he didn't have a reason to risk big and gamble with a big character. He was saying something so I would get off him and trying to deter the tunnel he knew I was going to inevitably put on him for the slip 

Will go in depth as to why should he the target from my perception

1) it's going to be hard to shake that slip in live mafia. I almost want to get him out just to rid myself of it. It's going to bother me the entire game because I will non stop read into it 

2) His character and justification make no sense. It's a group of characters to start with which could be alright but the justification is so weak and it's basically a copy pasta from the pic I linked. All other characters in this game aren't just "bad" which is where I think he fucked the fake claim up.  They are bad, but from their poe luna wrote a description to justify them as town because they see their actions as moral. Speeds it's just so far off from this. I feel even as a vanilla they would need a reason to be bad for good reasons. He doesn't have that. 

3) science. If he flips scum. I'm going to death tunnel wf 

4) even if all that is wrong and we happen to be off. We need to lynch dp1 and he's a vanilla do worst case we don't lose much and it's not putting pressure on someone that may claim a power role. 

When you combine all that he's certainly the best target and I don't see anything happening to change course on that. 

Basically on the same page. This was a high iq fake claim if it is one. To risk claiming that with no information given this game and to be able to tie it to miller. 

Him killing alpha is when they starting giving him a turn toward good. So if it's inverse mafia it fits perfect because began has technically been good and bad 

Negan is also the perfect villan. If anybody would be town in a antagonist is town game , negan def would be. He's prob the most ruthless, hated , loved villan of any show ever. It's like sephiroth in the game world 

Town is from different things. Doesn't mean he can't overlap scum. 

Negans like 5-8? I think. The arc from where he killed glenn up to the whisperer arc where they started trying to humanize him while keeping him a bad ass 

I'm not saying you had scar. I'm saying you had simba or mufasa

And you were probably scared to claim scar because he could exist 

Give a very hard justification and paraphrase.  Big summary

Re: drafter  +1

What he said. If there is another outlier that gives credence to that weird claim they need to speak up. But I suspect that it's all main antagonist 

To put this out there. I know these often get pegged as schemey af and I'm often wrong blah blah. People look way to often and when I'm wrong and not how often I'm right

Last game I called wf as scum after his first post and had speed identified as his scum partner 2 pages after that which is why speed said he killed me. 

The past 2 weeks in live I have literally reverse engineeried 5/6 games and carried the last call in all of them. Also was the target of every np1 and np2 and was alive because if self docing or protective roles.  Sure when I'm wrong I'm really wrong. But on balance I'm right just as often if not more often. 

Look at his claim, the reason he felt a need to claim, what he claimed , and the justification and compare it to the rest of the characters that have a grey area and in depth justification about why they did what they did. 

The longer we don't have pressure. The longer they get to develop fuckery 

Not to even get into his justification is basically copy pasta from a Google search 

Not even trying to death tunnel but it's just a lot 

1) the slip saying what he said about whiteflame implying that he knew wf was intending to play diff 

2) the vague character being a sore thumb around all the other main town characters 

3) the vanilla claim 

4) a group of characters. 

And also he pings me as behaviorally off. This is a good science lynch either way because it can show If it's all big characters or not

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If town has a minor character or a group of characters , just type me 

But as of now this is a good target 

Yeah my character affirms this. 

It was a huge text block saying why I did what I did. Certainly not a grey area character but he spun it as such and the rest are major characters that are claimed

If he flips scum it's probably white flame and he done doofed 

To add to that. After I called that our he was immediately typing up a storm. I expected a 2 page post. 

He prob felt pressured to claim because he know I was going to type the slip and went with they hyper safe one. 

I think we agree for different reasons. I think most of town are major villans. This one sticks out like a sore thumb. I'd even wager vanilla would be a bigger character 

I would have bought scar but it makes me think he was scared to claim it 

Character * sorry 

Low-key thoughts 

He got simba or mufasa.

Was scared to fake claim scar because it could be in the game so went with hyper vague character. 

Can you hard paraphrase your role. 

Calling this now 

You are simba , took the kingdom away from scar and blah blah. What an asshole. 

I feel like he may actually be simba lol

Hyennas is just a weird claim because it's a group and they all have different names and personalities. 

I don't think your doing anything different so far but it's what speed said and how he said it. We had just finished the last game of the night and were taking about the prior game. I said you were one of the people who had typically very easy scum tells (at least imo), along with max 

Speeds response to the was something along the lines of, and this is almost a direct quote 

"Yeah I feel bad for him with what happened to him last game , but in this new one he's making an effort to change up his play"

And I'm like holy shit bro 

Speed said he means it in the sense of how he sees you playing but that's not how I heard or took that. That's the only reason you were brought up in that context. 

As I said I don't want to death tunnel in him and ruin the dp but it's something to keep in the back of our mind. 

It was the context of how he said it, going to try not to read to much into it. But the way he framed that was

whiteflame is sometimes really easy to read, but hes doing something different this game. So its hard not to. Its unfortunate that came up because it was passive but when I hear shit like that I have to say it because its going to affect my read on him all game

I'm going to do my best not to death tunnel him but that and now with the vanilla claim, he's certainly on my radar 

I have to say this 

speed word for word on accident

"Whiteflame is doing well this game, he has changed up his strategy"

I have to type this because i heard it and its going to bother me forever now. WE were discussing me catching whiteflame in a prior game and that was his response to it.  By this game he is referring to this forum game saying how white flame has changed his playstyle 

Agree with the former part of drafters post. It may have something to do with bad but for the right reasons. 

It's def open to interpretation but it's leaning that way

So it could be protagonist are blindly good or good and serve no purpose.  Mafia will not claim protagonist either way so it's likely not worth analyzing. 

Antag vs protag 

What we want to look out for is a antag with a weird justification. 

But in that case I would think negan is hard town vs miller. Because most of his motivation is driven by doing what he has to do for survival. 

Supas claim just seems off but the fact he was willing to claim it and risk a cc if he was scum makes me feel better about it 

Has lunatic ever said anything about him not using or liking millers in games ?

Miller would imply* 

Fucking phone typing op 

Dying

The split is very likey antagonist as town vs protagonist as scum. 

And yeah I agree began turning good is a good justification for him being miller as miller would I play a progtagonist that's an actual antagonist but supa didn't even mention that