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@Casey_Risk
If it saves you time don't respond to my other post. It is meaningless. All we should be talking about is the game solve and why you would be opposed to it for any reason.
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@Casey_Risk
I don’t see how this isn’t a game solve unless you think the scum is exactly Vader.
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@Ultracrepidarian
Hammer Casey game is solved. If she’s innocent then I hammer you next dp and town win no matter what
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@Vader
Hammer Casey before you crash. We just solved the game. And if not you just got a free scum win but oh well
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@Casey_Risk
Btw I hope you know this is all POe based, you played a fine scum game if it’s not ultra but yeah POE solves it here
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Does anyone here actually think Vader is scum kingmaker? If not then the game is solved.
Lunch Casey I hammer ultra. Literally no way scum win.
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@WyIted
Lynch Casey today, have me hammer ultra tomorrow and it should be full proof, right? Like if we do this it’s impossible for scum to win unless Vader was scum king maker which I’m doubting more and more and almost willing to bet the game against that logic
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@Vader
Last comment before I go to work: why the hell would I kill Mikal if I was scum? He had me town locked. Think about who had incentive to kill Mikal, from his last post he said to lynch between Casey, Wylted/earth, and ultra. Wylted/earth iwe now know is town, ultra likely is or was a ninja. Poe puts it at Casey and ultra if you think he’s ninja. From your POV this should be Casey tho.
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@Casey_Risk
Okay, so a couple of things. First, the third shifter on my position is coming back, which means I can finally stop working crazy overtime, woohoo! I actually found this out yesterday, but I'm still super happy about it. I'm pretty busy at work tonight, but I have a little break for now and my shift will end at its normal time finally. I'll be more active after I get home, I promise, but for now I can only write this little bit.
Congratulations, I’m genuinely happy for you that your on a better shift!
Anyway, I'm beginning to rethink this game, and particularly my read on Luna. It's a strange claim with a really weird justification that I just do not get.
What specifically is strange about it?
More importantly however, it's another role that punishes the town for lynching it if I'm reading it correctly.
which is why I played it the way I did, to bait a night kill. Beloved princess is one of those roles that is always met with skepticism. I wouldn’t even have come out about it, but earth did have a point about multiple investigators and I didn’t want that to be the thing that throws town off its game when we are so close to winning.
So Mikal claimed Hated and Ultra claimed Super Saint on DP1, and Luna also had a role that could punish the town for trying to lynch them... And he not only didn't raise any suspicions about this, but went on to advocate for AR's lynch instead?
I don’t see multiple negative utility town roles as imbalanced, especially in light of the fact there was an innocent child and an every night tracker.
my read in RM was mostly behavior based, but it turned quickly into a policy lynch that I will defend all day. Town or not he was acting like a third scum member and was actively throwing. We got a correct lynch the second he was out of the game and are back on track to winning. I’ll defend that lynch all day.
Just to be clear though, Luna, how does your Beloved Princess work? If you get lynched, is the following DP skipped?
Correct, and if night killed a night phase would be skipped. I was fairly confident I would have been the night killed after that justice claim. I mean it’s still technically good that Mike died since he was hated and now mafia can’t take advantage of that role, but it isn’t ideal for lynch purposes because we could have bought an extra mislynch if I was killed.
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@Vader
Right now I have 2 scum reads, One is Luna and I have some pretty good reasons. For one I noticed throughout the DP he was breadcrumbling against Ultra for future days while opposing lynching him DP1 with Barney/myself and not believing Ultra and volunteering to hammer. I feel like his entrance into the game is pretty weak as well compared to normal games and really has just gone at RM, breadcrumbed RM to a tee and then just poofed.
What do you mean “just poofed”? Also rm was incredibly distracting and spam posting, that’s why I wanted him lynched in the first place, I’m glad we did too, he was basically third scum. I don’t understand your point about ultra. I’ve been resistant to that punch the whole game and he was by far the most popular mislynch dp1 if I hadn’t defended him.
Luna I absolutely HATE this claim. I think this the most optimal time you can choose to claim something like this. The strategy is there for why he fake claimed in the DP the Justice but I felt like he transitioned after getting pressure from Earth.
If I am scum why would I bother town confirming him instead of just taking the one v one, or trying to sell there’s two investigators, which is certainly plausible. Coming clean about being a justice makes no sense from a scum perspective.
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@Earth
I'm kinda sussing Lunatic's claim a bit. I think town would be a tad overpowered if it had all the powers in the graveyard plus a Justice and a Tracker. Ultra could be a ninja, but w/e.
Fine, I’ll come clean here, I am not a justice. I am beloved princess, I claimed what I did to bait the night kill. Justification for beloved princess is that RBGs political party wasn’t the same after her death. That’s why I said you were town here, because I know I’m not actually investigative and their has to be at least one investigative role otherwise the only visiting ability that’s blockable is the the bodyguard and kingmaker. Balance makes the most sense if your actually the tracker.
Anyways math is still the same, your results basically confirm ultra, so it’s either Casey or Vader and I’m betting it’s just Casey here.
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@Earth
Prolly Casey then. GG.
Vtl Casey.
In the off chance I’m wrong it’s just Vader but we can afford the mislynch and just lynch him tomorrow if that’s the case. Game is solved
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@Earth
@Vader
@WyIted
@Casey_Risk
@Ultracrepidarian
Thoughts ?
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Mikal posted the solve for this last day phase. The only difference is I know Wylted is town, unless he was a godfather or a lawyer. Either way, yeah we lynch Casey or Vader, but I’d need a pretty strong reason to buy a kingmaker as scum I guess
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The solve here is to lynch casey then if ultra is alive in lylo then it’s obviously him. The only potential flaw is if supa is a scum king maker. Which is technically possible but really hard to buy…
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Wylted/Earth is the same affiliation as Mikal. Wow. Really surprised I wasn’t killed. So it’s between Casey and ultra for final scum. There’s a small chance it’s Vader but I don’t really buy that atm.
I am gonna blank slate ultra here, I was town reading him mostly off of wifom but his lack of reads is disturbing me. I wanna hear thoughts from Casey and Vader on who they think the final scum is and why
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@whiteflame
Fair enough, hopefully you can post some more thoughts when your free. I too would like to hear thoughts from casey here.
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@Mikal
Whiteflame kind of feels like he is giving up, which I don't know how to read. I mean on one head you did basically say you were gonna yeet him, but I feel like he should know he could change your mind with the right presentation of arguments.
I don't know how to read it, because he did it in Jet fighters when you caught him and was actually scum (even despite me sticking up for him as town), but he also gave up pretty easy in game show mafia when (That one I understand was kind of infuriating spot for him). I am not sure.
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@whiteflame
I literally suggested that we softclaim based on our characters were alive or not, said mine was alive, and then no one followed up. I just didn't love Casey's suggestion for what to softclaim. I assume scum do have access to fake claims insofar as they likely got to ask questions given Pie's usual modding system, but I guess it's possible they didn't even after the issues last game without any fake claims.
Okay who are you tops reads right now and why?
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@Ultracrepidarian
Thoughts on the game? Who do you think is scummiest and why?
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@whiteflame
I don't know how you're getting this from my responses. I didn't come to a conclusion on the theme split, and I still have no idea what it is with so many claims on the table. I said that it was likely a great deal or all of our characters were modern feminists, and that giving scum a whole wave of feminists to choose from for fake claims was a dangerous proposition. Scum almost certainly do know the theme split and would not claim their own characters if given the choice, and I didn't want to give them a suite of characters to choose from that they knew no one else had because of softclaims.
I mean you deviated from something you normally do every game (push for soft claims) to not doing it in this game based on your own claim and mikals at the time (pretty sure thats all there was at that point). I am just saying its a stretch in logic to change a whole playstyle for this game based on very limited info like that. Why its scummy is that assuming there isn't fake claims provided, scum would have more incentive to not want to lock claims in early as they don't know whats taken and not taken yet, I can see you having an incentive to change it up in the case where you were scum, as opposed to just town here.
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@whiteflame
At the time, I'd assumed based on my character and Mikal's that everyone would be a pretty modern feminist. Scum finding out that, say, all of them were second-wave or third-wave would have an opening to craft a claim within first-wave feminism.
I mean I guess, but that just seems like a weak guess based on what was like one claim in addition to you knowing your own role at the time. I still don't see how you could come to a theme split conclusion based on such limited information like that. The one game I suggested not doing the soft claim thing was because my role to me was extremely obvious based on me being a masonizer and my name being "mason" lol.
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@Mikal
One sec computer. Give me 5 and want you and vadars thoughts.
Skimming through his dp1 posts, yeah theres really not a ton there that makes me town read him. The one thing I was town reading him for just went through the door with his most recent answer. Most of his posts were interactions with RM (so were mine) a few with you over the discord activity, a few joke posts with barney, and then he comes in late for a hammer. I don't see anything that screams "Whiteflame is town" from any of his dp1 posts, except for the one I mistakenly took for a power role claim.
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@whiteflame
I actually did try to start a softclaim yesterday and said that my character was alive, but that was a separate post.I didn't love that his softclaim ideas would substantially restrict who each person could be and make it easier for scum to select fake claims based, say, on which wave of feminism they were in. I wasn't implying that my character specifically would give away the theme split, don't think I've ever had a character that would do that. I don't think that post implies a PR, either, but you and I are both pretty familiar with using what we can glean from softclaims to both improve our claims and narrow down what everyone else is. That's what I was implying with that post.
What specifically makes soft claiming in this game different than other games where you have supported it? I don't get how multiple waves of feminism would be a significant difference?
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@Mikal
Here was his last read on earth/wylted. It is worth mentioning wylted had scum read him minorly a few pages before this and suggested he would be okay with whiteflames lynch.
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@Mikal
Can you check his reads. On my phone and see if me mentioned wylted at all.
okay give me a sec im cntrl+f through 30 pages of RM's spam
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@Mikal
Thoughts on wf ?
I wanna hear his answer to post 52
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@whiteflame
Can you explain this post for me?
"I like seeing all the various theme split ideas from Casey, though I'm going to exercise caution in how far we apply them. It's been a while since I've gone down the theme split rabbit hole, but it often got me lost in the weeds and had me ignoring behavioral reads. There might be some basis for pursuing softclaims as well, but I'm hesitant to narrow the field of character claims early."
I was townreading you so hard last day phase because of this. I thought you were hinting 1. That you had a power role, or 2. That your character made the theme obvious by softing your claim. Considering you usually are a big advocate for the soft claim thing and have started multiple of them as town, I thought you would have had to have a very special or important reason not to in this game, which is why I was sooo convinced you were town.
Your claim doesn't seem extraordinary though in this regard so I can't think of why you would have said this.
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@WyIted
I know he could be roleblocker and yes the actress came up for me but there is also a feminist that is like 10 pages back in Google so you have to filter using the word feminest and she seems entrenched in academia and known only to extreme libtards which savant is not as far as I am aware.
damn you bringing up actress just made it an even harder sell for me, that role is perfect for his character lol
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@WyIted
He could be just a straight up roleblocker though.
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From a cursory google search I see almost no relation to Bernstein being related to feminism but I havent actually opened a link yet.
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@whiteflame
I'll just come out and full claim.I'm Elizabeth Bernstein. I'm the Jailkeeper. The justification is that she came up with the term "carceral feminism" and has argued against strict punishments for sex workers. I picked WyIted/Earth as my target, which basically confirms that they didn't perform the NK. It was not confirmed that my role was successful, but I'm going to assume it was.
Why did you target wylted?
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@Mikal
Everyone full claim and if you don’t im Hammering you
Kind of feels like a waste of my role, but I am the two part justice (basically a weaker version of justice). As opposed to a normal justice who compares two individuals in one night, I have to choose a different person on a different night to compare them. Night phase one I chose mikal, since hes my strongest town read, to compare him against someone else tonight. I basically will get my result night phase two assuming I am not roleblocked or night killed, which I 100% will be so it's kind of pointless now since I have to claim. Justification basically being that I was lawyer who served as an associate justice for the supreme court and majorly important for woman rights, and that my party lost a lot of power after RBG's death.
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@Vader
Vader is pretty much confirmed. Role wise at least, but that is a tough role to buy as scum also. The only reason I would consider this maybe being on the scum side is because balance reasons, with an innocent child thats a lot of town role confirmation style roles. But on paper it feels pretty town so unless vaders behavior is pretty scummy, I am willing to town lean this for now.
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@WyIted
I can't help but to notice the flips are non whites and Ginsberg is potentially white but I get Jew vibes from her so I may have took it up
I highly doubt you actually think race is a theme split, just like you probably knew rape wasn't the theme split in serial killers lol
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Asked the mods. Okay so basically mikal's ability will count as a lynch, not a day kill. So we can assume if he targets a super saint, he would also die assuming ultra isn't lying.
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I am gonna ask pie/savant how mikals king ability will effect a lynch on a super saint, because I am very curious. I doubt they will answer but ill ask anyway.
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Well mharman probably protected the night kill, because I don't really see why scum would have targeted him. I was actually planning on pressuring him and barney today, so good job mharman if you actually protected the kill.
What do we think about getting the rest of the claims out today?
I will give vader a pass from severe pressure since barneys inactivity shouldn't effect him, but I would like to hear his thoughts on the game, if he has indeed caught up. Looks like we will have another confirmed player as well when we decide who made mikal the king also.
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Current Mafia:
N/A
Sign ups:
iLikePie5+Savant- Feminism Mafia
In the Hopper:
Lunatic- Atypical
Mharman
RM - Harry Potter theme
Mikal- Open dm concept
Savant
On Hold:
Wylted - Lulsec
Casey_Risk - Deltarune Mafia
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@Savant
Yeah but it's also about marketability.
eh tbh other than MAYBE debategate, I dont think any of the offered names are better than debateart
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Whats wrong with the name it has now? Its grown on me.
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@AdaptableRatman
I am skilled, very skilled. I dont care what you think.
You sound like trump lol
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I am down. Whats a few losses in the grand scheme of things, we've played hundreds of these. If someone wants to be a special snowflake they can get the special snowlfake treatment and get lynched. Im for it.
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@Mharman
The claim still bothers me as well. I just don’t think there’s a point to town super saint and Joan d’arc isn’t a feminist, just someone they prop up as an icon.
I refuted this earlier. Feminism wasn't a thing til the 1800s, Joan was alive in the 1400s. So tehcnically you can't say she was part of a feminist movement, but that doesn't make her a strong female figure that was important for feminism. If you google Joan of Arc the first line of the wiki page calls her a feminist.
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@Mharman
The claim still bothers me as well. I just don’t think there’s a point to town super saint and Joan d’arc isn’t a feminist, just someone they prop up as an icon.
I refuted this earlier. Feminism wasn't a thing til the 1800s, Joan was alive in the 1400s. So tehcnically you can't say she was part of a feminist movement, but that doesn't make her a strong female figure that was important for feminism. If you google Joan of Arc the first line of the wiki page calls her a feminist.
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@Mikal
No I mean Ultra. I think RM is town
Agree to disagree on both I guess.
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