Total posts: 2,481
-->
@Avery
Morality: an innate sense of fairness.
So how does an impartial judge fairness if everybody’s definition of it is inconsistent, inconsistency doesn’t make much sense.
Created:
-->
@Avery
So do you regard someone as immoral that doesn’t share the same feelings as you pertaining to murder?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
Then swap out free will with perception if it makes you feel better, either way He doesn’t interfere.
Created:
-->
@Avery
innate fairness judgement
That was literally your definition of morality.
Created:
-->
@Avery
not whether the music is fairly judging.
Can you elaborate on this?
Created:
-->
@Avery
Morality: an innate sense of fairness.
Okay, but how often have we seen arguments pertaining to music? Clearly some people feel that talent isn’t being judged fairly.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@3RU7AL
and strangely, YHWH commands people to kill early and often
I don’t follow.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
if God wants all people to believe in him then he must make himself known to all people and not just a few.
Maybe He wants His people to believe in Him through their own free will and not His own.
Created:
-->
@Avery
No, I don't.
Okay so define morality, because chalking it up to feelings doesn’t really set it apart from anything (e.g, music).
Created:
-->
@Avery
morality is just your feelings. It's an evolutionary advantage to think that they are more than that (i.e. divined by the creator Himself), but they're just evolutionary impulses at the end of the day.
So do you regard someone as immoral that doesn’t share the same musical feelings as you? https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/5467-what-i-realized
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
I can only speak for myself and He’s made Himself known to me. Don’t be so quick to equate ignorance with nonexistence, many people are ignorant in regards to rocket science yet we don’t discredit it’s validity.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
Suicide isn't explicitly prohibited in the Bible.
Thou shall not kill.
a religion built on the Bible
How can a religion be built on a book when people and their beliefs existed long before books ever did.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
My response addressed that appeal and the basis of Biblical morality: obedience (not survival).
You didn’t address my “suicide is a sin” argument at all, in fact you rejected it and put emphasis on a view you think most Christians subscribe to.
I'd be happy to hear your views
Well first of all I’m no Bible expert so you doubling down on scripture isn’t refuting anything because your argument is one sided. Second I say I believe in God for the simple fact of that’s how I was raised, and most religions seem to believe that a higher power comes in the form of a God, however I’m willing to accept the possibility of a deity taking another form. One things for certain is I believe in an afterlife.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
I am sure he is circumcised.
What does this have to do with anything?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
You need to work on your reading comprehension. I said, "Most all Christians would accept dying in a holy war is to the glory of God".
And you need to work on your observation of facts, fact of the matter is you don’t know most Christians to make bold claims about them.
How is it you're a Christian that rejects the 'Word of God'?
I wasn’t speaking on behalf of me, and not all Christians accept The Bible as the “Word of God”.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
It is a reach to say survival is justified by your particular god.
Not as much as it is a reach to call our wars holy, people are literally getting killed over oil, you call that holy?
You'll need to provide a different basis for your beliefs or concede no justification can be provided from the Bible.
I don’t need to concede anything because not once have I argued in favor of The Bible.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
while Christianity draws on both Old and New Testaments
So what do you call the people that don’t?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
The Old Testament is the foundation on which the New Testament gets its credibility.
How so when the two are completely different?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
How many times do you plan to move the goalposts?
I’m not, your just begging the question.
God doesn't provide a justification for survival anyway.
There are some that believe suicide is a sin.
According to your holy book
The Bible can be interpreted in many different ways, nonetheless there are some people that would classify themself as religious but don’t believe in the God depicted in The Bible.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
What is considered a strength is a matter of perception and opinion, it is subjective.
And so is yours when you say
so there would be little point in it.
Not all believers always have faith, some converted.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
Many self proclaimed Christians don’t follow the Old Testament.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
Their population growth has outpaced the flood. Proof the flood did not reach their shores.
What is this flood you speak of?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
Groups are beneficial to individual survival (among other things).
How do you justify the value of survival without God?
How do you justify values like fairness and equality with your particular god?
By believing in a God that’s fair and equal.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
Theirs a strength in the number of believers.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Double_R
A desire to be worshipped, and to act on that desire by creating an entire species and then instructing them to do so, demonstrates a serious deficiency.
Maybe if your judging on the standard of the average person but God isn’t an average person.
Without said deficiency, none of this would have been necessary
Who said it was necessary? This was solely His choice, He could’ve chose different if He wanted to.
To claim only god can judge it is to claim that you are not capable or perhaps not allowed to think for yourself and form you're own opinions
But we’re not discussing opinions now are we? We’re discussing perfection which is completely out of both of our leagues.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
those who do not have faith would be unresponsive to such teaching, so there would be little point in it.
They will at some point, whether or not it’s too late is the question.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
why didn’t he provide irrefutable evidence for his existence, that is basically make himself known to everyone on this planet.
Maybe to teach the lesson of faith, I know that’s a turnoff for a lot of nonbelievers so I offer deductive reasoning as an alternative argument.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@SkepticalOne
Groups without cooperation and smooth social interactions are less likely to remain Groups.
How do you justify the value of said “Groups” without God?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Double_R
The need for worship demonstrates a serious deficiency, which contradicts the idea of him being perfect.
Simply wanting something isn’t an imperfection, only God can be the judge of that.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
For starters here is a list of nuclear powered countries prepared to deal with a genocidal God and it’s believers.India, China, N Korea,
And you know this how?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
cooperation and smooth social interactions
How do you justify the value of those concepts without God?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
Islam, Christianity and Judaism believe their God is a genocidal lunatic.
They believe that or you believe that?
The other religions are nuclear powered countries prepared to deal with this genocidal God and it’s believers.
A lot of bold claims here, care to support any of them?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Shila
The Bible portrays God as a genocidal lunatic. I am sure there is some evidence of morality to justify his genocidal behaviour.
The Bible can be interpreted in many different ways, nonetheless there are some people that would classify themself as religious but don’t believe in the God depicted in The Bible.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
Yes.
Then how do you justify the existence of morality without God?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
as far as I am aware no such evidence is available.
Are you aware of morality?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Elliott
We have no strong evidence for his existence
And you know this how?
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
Says the individual who has done nothing but argue in circles.
No, this individual knows when he’s giving a thread more posts than it deserves. Since I’m a nice guy I’ll leave you with the last word since you seem childish enough to want that ✌🏾
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
That’s EXACTLY what an intellectual coward would say.Mr. Dunning Kruger.
Is that all you got? Because going around in circles is a waste of both our time.
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
Your intellectual cowardice knows no bounds.
No, that would be your cognitive dissonance my friend 😉
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
You clearly do not.
Hence why I contrasted your two quotes together right?
That is your claim. A claim in which @3RU7AL asked you to substantiate. To date/post, you refuse to meet your burden of proof.
Keep the same energy for 3RU7AL dude, that’s all I ask.
Created:
-->
@SkepticalOne
Good. Now hold yourself to that same standard.
And what standard is that? The one that doesn’t accept ridiculous claims from you? Sure, don’t have to tell me twice.
Created:
-->
@SkepticalOne
Would you accept that from me?
Nope
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
Childish banal retort.
Hence why I called it easy, are you now catching on?
Created:
-->
@3RU7AL
@TWS1405
You completely dismissed (classic denial) the fact that I showed you did in fact assert a claim and failed to meet your burden of proof in substantiating it.
The only claim that was asserted that failed to meet the burden of proof was 3RU7AL
abortion is NOBODY'S preferred outcome
Now this is an absolute claim that’s impossible to prove for the simple fact that you don’t know EVERYBODY, so how about you keep the same energy for him before you come at me.
Asking for a name (or names) of those “some people” you claim to [know] as an example to substantiate said claim is NOT a contradiction in terms.
Do you even read what you write?
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
More than you, that’s for sure.
Well I disagree, you see how easy that was 😉
Created:
-->
@TWS1405
1st, losing semantics argument.
I guess the burden of proof is on you to prove that claim.
2nd, burden or proof requires you to do it; otherwise you’re just demonstrating the Dunning Kruger Effect.
Except the burden of proof isn’t on me, I haven’t made any claims causing reasonable doubt.
nowhere in the thread does a name need to be mentioned
You need to provide an “example,” which means by name
Contradiction at its finest 🥱
Created:
-->
@SkepticalOne
As far as I am concerned, personhood of the unborn is a distraction to the abortion debate - the definition is unimportant.
Yet that’s what you decided to critique my argument on 🤦🏾♂️
Created:
-->
@SkepticalOne
Nowhere in that link does it say science is a false authority, and what makes you so sure the capricious legal system is correct? Before you want to accuse me of fallacies you might want to get a good look in the mirror.
Created: