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@RationalMadman
Wow, let me know if you ever want to chat like an adult.
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@RationalMadman
Arrogance?? not sure what the other thing means. How about we just have a discussion without any preconceived ideas and personal insults? I tried to just give you an objective idea...
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@RationalMadman
I think in my religion what you call God is what I call Fate.
You are the result of an individualization of the One you have no real religion other than in the mind, you are a creative expression of an eternal Creative conscious awareness that pervades everything that exists just like energy. The reason you exist is because you were granted the freedom to become a soul in duality (creation).
God's the personality that was granted the power to rig the otherwise random Fate.
Fate does not exist without God, if fate exists it's because the Creator exists and fate should have some purpose. God can't be granted anything, all things come out of God, including you.
That alone exists, not even fate, just pure awareness. Fate means nothing without embodiment, time and space lol. The Creator exists without embodiment, time and space.
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@RationalMadman
The Creator has no form, like electricity or energy conscious awareness is same thing, it pervades all of creation, embodiments and forms are nothing but channels for It to express its power and creativity. Awareness takes on form just like electricity and energy, that's how God is omnipresent, the Creator is both in form and formless. All things come out of this formless Reality.
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@RationalMadman
You are incorrect.
Lol, pure awareness has no embodiment, only when a soul takes on form does male or female manifest silly. In a singular reality there is no such thing as a male or female it's just awareness. Pretend you have no form or embodiment just consciousness, look around you where do you see genitals?? The pure state of the Creator is the still balance between all duality, in other words there is no duality in God, there can be no separation. Without separation male or female is irrelevant Madman. Think....
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@RationalMadman
The Creator (God) is nongender, you're still working within duality. The conscious state of God is much higher that that actually. There are certainly demi-gods and higher spiritual beings that have a female and male nature but not the One. The only thing that creates dual nature (male, female, good bad, light, darkness) is when the Creator splits into duality below the pure worlds of consciousness. In the absolute realm of God there exists no such thing, it's a singular Reality. Having said that is where we would argue over whether which side of male or female rule the created worlds....and that can be seen or observed in nature. But the male principle and female principle only exist when the center balance of the oneness of God begins to oscillate from that center point, this is where God begins to express Itself in either form.
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@keithprosser
Apart from the hydrogen atoms! The scientific account of creation is a far, far more wonderful story than any theogian invented - and much nearer the truth.
They are one and the same, did you forget about that process I told you about already? oh never mind you ignore anything outside materialism. Creation myths and stories just attempt to reflect that there's a Creator involved, the process (of creating or evolving) is what we observe through science.
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@zedvictor4
Theism and Atheism are merely labels we attach to alternative conclusions.
Okay, but it also symbolizes the direction of your thought patterns....of course which is why you label yourself that. A mentality is just basically a way of thinking, an attitude about or toward something. If what you think controls your experience atheism is indeed very limiting for the individual. Especially in light of the reality that spirituality is a cultivation, as well as observation from experience. If I were to believe or accept atheism I would never be able to experience what transcends that.
The relative data or "evidence" is all very similar if not the same.The difference between the so called theist's and atheist's conclusions, is all down to a slight variation in how we process the same data or "evidence".
Agreed, I call it perception or perspectives. This is irrelevant though to an atheist or even a Theistic mentality. Yal can deny you don't have a mentality but I don't see why.
We have imputed and processed the same data as each other and have concluded that:I do believe in a god.I do not believe in a god.The only real difference is the inclusion or exclusion of the word not.
Not really, this of course controls your output or what you can experience. Your atheism is your worldview is it not?
Though I personally conclude that I neither believe nor disbelieve in a god.So what will you label me?
Did I label you? did I label anyone other than what they consider themselves? Atheism isn't just a denial of God or gods, it's a way you view the world. Is it not?
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@keithprosser
Utterly wrong. The only thing atheism does is stop people from imagining a non-existent super-being is involved or responsible.
Thanks for the opinion. But great example of what I was saying lol.
Spirituality doesn't have to involve a god.
While I think that is an ignorant statement let's say it's true....it still involves a transcendent reality (more than materialism or naturalism). The catch is that how can you have a transcendent reality without a Creator??
Atheism requires one to explain and understand things in terms of the real, not the imaginary. If spirituality can only be understood and explained in terms of the imaginary, that could only mean spirituality itself was imaginary.
Again, pure opinion and mindset from what you have accepted, none of that is a fact Keith but thanks for that opinion. If you didn't carry an atheist mentality perhaps you could consider this isn't imaginary but an objective reality. What you term "imaginary" is only based on your false conclusions from an atheist belief system. This of course controls all your paradigms which controls what you accept or discard.
Atheism means you can't get your spirituality and meta-ethics 'off the shelf' - you have to work at it. Atheism is not the easy option - theism is for those who like things on a plate - theists just have to learn the rules of their church.
You act like you don't know me, get real. Nice try though.
Atheists aren't limited to materialism... they are only 'limited' to doing without a god figure, which is no limit at all.
They are limited to materialism, get real. They are also controlled by it.
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@TheAtheist
What is an "atheist mentality"? Atheism is the lack of belief in God because of absence of evidence. How does it have a "mentality"?
Mentality- "the characteristic attitude of mind or way of thinking of a person or group."
The type of "mentality" that arises every time I have a discussion with an atheist. Not really an insult just an observation. Perhaps this could only be noticed from an outside perspective.
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@n8nrgmi
there's too much evidence to just write off the supernatural,
Exactly. It's basically so obvious it's weird that atheists won't consider it, even more strange they keep parroting there's no evidence for spirituality or Theism (or an afterlife). For a group to be so persuaded by evidence it's almost as if they don't even know what evidence means or what it consists of.
unless you just have a deep seated need to not believe.
The worst aspect of accepting an atheist mentality. Mostly that it's so limiting for the individual, it also forces them to not accept anything outside materialism.
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@RoderickSpode
Why would the soul have to exist before the physical body? Are you saying we never had a beginning? Or, we weren't created?
If the soul is distinct from the physical body, and God creates souls then the physical body had no part in the creation of a soul, it existed prior to that, the material body only supplied a conduit for the soul to experience this world. When you exit the physical form you will be present in your astral body, which people call a spirit. However the true source and form of the soul has no embodiment, it is one with God again, it's only your bodies that confine your experiences to parts of creation. These "bodies" are what the soul enters into...
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@janesix
Perhaps spiritual laws are in place to counteract the unfeeling and uncompromising natural laws.
What if we said natural laws and ethical laws?
I guess that would be pretty much what the Hindu's call Karma, whatcha think?
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@RoderickSpode
I agree that we can only change something in the present. But I don't see any law, natural or spiritual that suggests that if the creator removed restraint on time travel, or gave us the ability to do so, the time traveler would exist in a very real setting whether traveling backward or forward. Why wouldn't it be real?
I guess it would be real as long as it was present or in the moment, away from creation and into pure awareness time does not exist in the way we experience it anyways so the only thing we truly experience is what is in the "now". But, if we were to be revisiting the past per say, we would be present but what we witnessed of the past wouldn't be, it's simply revisiting energetic imprints that have already transpired. It would be more like the Christmas Carol movie I'm afraid, where you could see what was taking place but not able to interact with it. Beyond that I'm not really sure I could only speculate but good points. As we discussed though there could be loop holes with minimal abilities.
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@janesix
I apologize if my phrase appeared to be antsy! It wasn't my intention. I only meant I am unsure if natural and spiritual law are different.
Haha I just have seen you say this before so I know you don't really like to use that terminology. They are only different in the way I described them, spiritual can be natural but then you have no way to articulate the distinction between purely physical sense perception and higher frequencies of experience that transcends that.
Perhaps spiritual laws are in place to counteract the unfeeling and uncompromising natural laws. Which is pretty much what you said, and makes sense
Sweet, it does make sense. Good way to put it.
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@RoderickSpode
When we travel by plane we travel into the future,
No, the soul is always present in the moment.... if you were to experience another plane it's not in the future but in the moment. The only difference being you are experiencing higher frequencies of existence. To soul travel or switch planes the soul is basically switching its attention, but it's still in the moment just like if you were to travel anywhere. This is also how spiritual experiences occur.
albeit only a fraction of a moment. not enough to notice, but during that fraction of a moment, it's a very real experience. We're not simply observing the moment from an observational point afar. I don't see why it would be any different if one were to travel the speed of light, and travel into the future.
I'm not going to say you can't travel into the future because the Akashic records include the future as well I believe, I just don't know how it could be done where you are present there. This technology is something I'm unaware of at the moment.
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@RoderickSpode
Why would the soul have to exist before the physical body?
That's obvious, the soul exists apart from the physical body as the physical body only prepared a vehicle for the soul to exist in this world. The soul is sent to inhabit the womb from birth to experience a new life but it was already in existence. Just as you entered into a physical development as a soul you will also exit it at death.
Are you saying we never had a beginning?
All individual souls have a beginning and were sent into creation and duality, however just before that individualization the nature of the soul itself had no distinction from the Creator. Basically a soul is an expression of God, a soul comes out the heart of the Creator and this was always your first true origins not the physical body, not the material body your parents created for you.
Or, we weren't created?
Yes, as explained above. Only just before you were individualized and covered (with bodies or sheaths) you were one with God. Right now, you believe all you know is what you experienced at birth until present lol, dirty little trick but masterful also. The Creator is quite bad azz. The cool part is that every soul comes out from the Creator as a creative expression of God, this is what makes it so beautiful, what makes souls so unique and special in their own ways. The soul is given the freedom to become and think what it wants according to its own perception and experiences, and of course this is how you become an individual.
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@janesix
I think the ancient Egyptians conformed to natural and spiritual laws
Wow that's something I haven't considered yet, I tend to be more fascinated with the Native Americans culture and would probably say the same about them, do you see any similarities there?
if indeed they are even different,
No need to get antsy, again it's just a term to distinguish that which we we experience as purely physical senses as opposed to higher frequencies of awareness. Spiritual can be considered natural if you get real technical.
through ritual,temple dimensions and alignments,music,art etc. I believe this is why they were able to keep their civilization going for three thousand or more years. I don't think their society was ideal, but I think it was kept in some semblance of civilized order for millenia. I am currently researching this theory, although I can't recall at the moment where I learned about it. For instance, their music and art had to legally conform to specific standards. I am sure their buildings and temples did as well. I am unable to confirm this idea at the moment, but I am finding it fascinating to research.
Yeah I've done minimal research with Egyptian culture, obviously I'm aware of the mysteries surrounding the pyramids and that's very interesting, I'll have to look more into this one!
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@keithprosser
Read the "Tiger's Fang" by Paul Twitchell. Not really relevant to the OP but it gives you an understanding of what incarnations and demi-gods are and why they exist. All these "God's" and higher beings come out from one Source. It's very likely that the god described in the OT experience rules a part of creation, perhaps created this material universe. But in order for the singular Source to have any form at all It must incarnate and does so to channel power and creativity. Most people don't really know or understand that Polytheism is indeed compatible with Monotheism, in that you can have a singular creative Source that incarnates lower and higher souls/beings. If you really consider this it's very interesting and answers many dilemmas and questions.
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@janesix
Do you think the world would be a better place of societies followed the laws of nature?
In some ways, others not. This might sound strange, but just as we have natural laws that stabilize this material universe so we have "spiritual" laws that stabilize what transcends this world. Just using the term "spiritual" as a means to describe what we perceive in higher consciousness. However natural laws can be brutal, they care not for sympathy or the weak, if we were to follow just natural laws basically it would come down to strong survive and weak are consumed. Of course this must be in this part of creation for it to evolve in a realistic manner coming from a purely physical/material frame of mind.
If we were to follow the natural laws that apply to chemistry and physics the way our body responds to chemistry concerning health this would be another planet to experience, health ailments would rarely be an issue because nature has all the answers that correlate with that aspect of our experience, as well if we were to apply the natural AND the spiritual laws together understanding the difference between the nature of the two we would be doing pretty darn good. Especially for society and collectivity as a whole, but purely natural laws have no sympathy or concern with the subjective experience of humans and their welfare. Fortunately there does exist a balance so that our experience isn't entirely consumed because of weakness.
and what if parts of those laws were numerical?for instance, what if we created our buildings in accordance to natural numeric harmonic laws?
Not sure, but interesting thought.
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@TheAtheist
Guys, guys, what are you doing here? I made this topic for theists to explain to us why they believe in God. This isn't about whether theism is valid or whether there is evidence that God exists. Only post what is relevant to the topic: "why do you believe in God?"It's hard for me to find someone in real life with whom I can talk about religion,
"Lets give it a try, let me know what you would like to discuss."
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@janesix
Principle meaning this....
"is a proposition or value that is a guide for behavior or evaluation. In law, it is a rule that has to be or usually is to be followed, or can be desirably followed, or is an inevitable consequence of something, such as the laws observed in nature or the way that a system is constructed. The principles of such a system are understood by its users as the essential characteristics of the system, or reflecting system's designed purpose, and the effective operation or use of which would be impossible if any one of the principles was to be ignored."
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@janesix
Can you give me an example of a spiritual principle and it's application.
Sure, I'll give you a real simple example. These can apply many ways, it can be physical, mental, emotional or spiritual...just things you would apply to yourself in either of those ways.
Most people are familiar with the Bible so here is a good example.
Matthew 6
33But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
Here's another one...
Romans 8
5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be [b]carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the [c]carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
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@SkepticalOne
The negative aspects of religion are more deeply felt by non-believers
Not always the case at all, now what about the positive aspects though if you wanna be fair?? when you evaluate religion and spirituality as a whole you will observe both the positive and negative sides of it (as I have). The question is, is how long can you justify rejecting Theism because there are some negative sides to it. Do you know why there are negative sides to it? because there are people involved, this is a dual environment no matter if it's spiritual or non spiritual. This part of creation has the full swing of duality including the religious arena.
(unbelievers of a particular religion or unbelievers in general) and often unknown or dismissed by believers.
I can be free to discuss with you the stupidity of religion, that's easy! you want me to start?
Where else can a discussion about this be had if not forums meant for discussion?
The point of course, is that it's more an atheist forum really than that which spirituality and religion can be really weighed and articulated. It's usually just atheists trying to shut down beliefs or mocking them, not really debate or consider them. Rarely do I see what you call a "discussion" lol. That would be great.
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@janesix
I am still unsure of what you mean by "application".
Application of principles, practices and discipline that produce results. I just call them spiritual principles, these range from simple to complex, just things for the individual to practice to help them transcend or connect with that reality.
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@TheAtheist
Well there's lots of answers to that question. Usually a Theist has multiple reasons or justifications for believing in a Creator rather than a single reason ranging from obvious to vague and I would say that cross referencing plays a huge role in strengthening a position or belief. Since spirituality is of a different nature (as opposed to physical sense perception) and transcends the physical/material experience cross examination is very important. All that really means is that one can support or cross reference what they think they observed with another source that is congruent with that nature. These sources can be found in a wide range of references including literature, religion, spirituality, NDE's, OBE's, soul travel and personal encounters AKA spiritual experiences.
This is actually the cool thing about Theism is that it's built over a period of time. Spirituality is a progression so it's a cultivation, that means at no time does a person have every reason to believe and also at no time is there just a single reason. It's a culmination of intuition, personal experience, cross referencing, application and observation. It starts with a persons natural observation of the world, their curiosity of what they see, the understanding of a deeper reality, the natural intuition that they are not just a physical body ect ect….then comes the interest and study of that nature, what things mean, how they work, what makes sense and what doesn't...what is all this about??
Believe it or not all these things can be answered and experienced, spirituality is an objective reality not a subjective one. All that really means is that a persons personal opinions and feelings are irrelevant to what actually exists. In this case there's an obvious objective reality beyond the physical sense perception.
It's hard for me to find someone in real life with whom I can talk about religion
Lets give it a try, let me know what you would like to discuss.
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How long can a grown old man remain an idiot while he himself is the living truth lol?
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@disgusted
If you weren't so stupid and ignorant parents are nothing more than those who supply a physical body for a soul and hopefully teach their kids to be independent and inept in this world. In other words your mommy had nothing to do with what you really are lol, when she mated with your uneducated daddy she brought forth a little disgusting body that your dirty little soul could inhabit, simple enough?
The only thing debatable about whether or not you had a right to live is your character and stupidity, but your soul had nothing to do with your mommy and daddy little boy.
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@keithprosser
In other words the "Kingdom of God" can be experienced in this world before we leave this body, at the same time there is a source for that Kingdom. And that source transcends this physical world.
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@keithprosser
Luke's Jesus explains that the kingdom of heaven is not Israel or any physical place but a 'spiritual space' that is everywhere and nowhere. It is aspace one cannot enter with one's body but does so with one's mind, or spirit.
As I said it's both, to deny Jesus accepted a literal Kingdom of God is not very accurate, it's also a paradise, a dwelling place. The point Jesus was making is the same one I was making, that the "Kingdom of God" is not restricted to any location it can be demonstrated within oneself. The Kingdom of God in this world is in the midst of believers, when you leave this world there are literal Kingdoms, planets, places and things just like you see here.
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@zedvictor4
I will live as long as I do, with the same opinion.
Very unfortunate and why I always say atheism is a dead end trap. It controls your mind and thoughts to the point you can't accept anything else.
Unless the Big Guy should happen to stick his out head from behind the cloud that he's hiding behind and politely introduce himself.
Spirituality is a process, therefore that is not conducive to what you actually need. You might even say it was just a hallucination. Grow up a little, this is about application and observation, a cultivation....if you want to observe you have to connect with a method that will get you there.
Which is what one would expect an omni-sensible God to do.
You come straight out of the heart of God as an individual soul, you are already apart of that.
As it stands I'm pretty confident that the Kingdom of God exists only as brain data, which will dissipate upon death. You've been led to confidently believe otherwise, which is just fine and dandy.
Thanks for the opinion, have any questions?
Of course, we end up as ever with the same old, same old. You cannot prove the unprovable and I cannot disprove the unprovable. No matter how much we might rant and rave.
Try asking Victor. We can start there.
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@Dr.Franklin
I think your mixing up Heaven and The Kingdom of God
That would be the source of this Kingdom, the only point here is that it's not restricted to any location. The Kingdom of God in our hearts of course is not literal, it's symbolic that we don't have to be in heaven to witness God or spiritual principles rather that observation is always available to those who apply. Don't get me wrong though, God is present throughout all of creation, but there certainly are places that are labeled heaven. Jesus exists in an actual Kingdom not a figurative one. Do you know what a kingdom is?
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@Fallaneze
It's an open ended question and we will never truly know the answer.
Are you speaking from an individual stand point or a collective one?
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@Dr.Franklin
My first claim was that it is both, what good would there be a Kingdom of God in our hearts if a Kingdom of God doesn't exist lol? why would Jesus talk about some Kingdom that only exists in the heart, no, when you leave this form you will still exist. If you still exist there must be a place for that existence.
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@Dr.Franklin
I know, what’s your evidence for your first claim
Are you serious?
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@ludofl3x
the soul exists prior to the physical body period,
Well for one I was addressing a believer, so the statement I made was one that should be obvious to a believer. To an atheist this requires much more attention so the answer would require much more details, which I'm willing to get into depending on what frame of mind you are in.
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@ludofl3x
How would you like me to confirm that? through the evidence that correlates with that nature or an explanation? which do you prefer?
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@keithprosser
Deb is a genius, but hopefully he will put that genius to a good outlet. I believe eventually he will. His atheism is quite shallow TBH if you follow his posts, his curiosity will overshadow that problem. Atheism needs depth and good teachers, but teachers that can satisfy their fabricated need for scientific confirmation. Spirituality has that quality.
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@Dr.Franklin
Because many things can transpire there. There's more than just the "Kingdom Of God". Which is symbolic for the pure in heart, where they might dwell.
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@Dr.Franklin
The afterlife is not representative of the Kingdom of God.
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@zedvictor4
The Kingdom of God is in some peoples heads.
How long can you live with a bare assertion?
- In fact the notion of a Kingdom of God is probably in most peoples heads, given the free flow of associated information.
Associated knowledge/information? yeah that's generally how people learn lol.
Though he level of importance attributed to the notion of a Kingdom of God varies considerably, depending mostly on the intensity of our formative conditioning. (Childhood brainwashing).
You can label it whatever you like that's your choice, but if you want to get real start by asking questions. I'll entertain them if you like.
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@Dr.Franklin
The Kingdom of God is not a place, It's actually God ruling over our hearts!
It's both, when you leave this world there will be places for you to journey. The Kingdom of God is symbolic and literal. Meaning there is a place but it also can penetrate the depth of your being. So while you can inhabit the Kingdom of God you can also transmit it.
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@RoderickSpode
To make a long story short time travel would only be looking at what took place, kinda like the Christmas Carols where you can look back in time. You can't change anything of course but you can change the Karma of the individual by adjusting behavior and attitude in the now.
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@RoderickSpode
Well, for now I'd prefer to focus on the reincarnation issue, and then possibly go from there because this is what stands out in my memory.The reason I said "I don't believe in reincarnation, at least not in the traditional sense" is for the very reason you just brought up. (i.e., a believer receives a new resurrected body.....aka reicarnated new body).If I'm a created being, then I have no reason to believe that the human body I now occupy isn't the very first form of life I've been given. That prior to this life, I just didn't exist until God breathed the breath of life in my current form.
If you believe in the soul then you know God didn't breathe into your current form, the soul exists prior to the physical body period, I don't think there is any argument about that. If then it is true that you existed before the birth of the physical body then it is true you have a soul....which existed before the birth of the physical body, then it is true you reincarnated. You may not like that term but it is what it is.
I'll throw a strange question at you.I'm a firm believer in the possibility (and impossibility) of time travel. In secular terms, time travel is possible in theory, but impossible in practicality. We just don't have the technology to even come close to such a notion.
You can't time travel but you can revisit experiences. While you can look back in time and revisit certain experiences you can't time travel in a way that it is reality, where you are creating things. The only time travel possible is that which has already happened, this can be revisited in the causal plane, the Akashic Records. Look up the Akashic Records.
From a more divine perspective, time travel is possible in similar fashion to how the construction of the Tower of Babel was possible. But it was rendered impossible by the restrictive hand of God. Same principle. Time travel is possible if we acquired the near to impossible technology, but I believe rendered impossible by the restrictive hand of God because God will not allow man to turn back the hand of time to right their wrongs. Man is judged by what we do individually, and there's no chance of going back to change it. The only way out of our dilemma is to put our current lives in the hand of the savior.
Or in the hands of yourself. You are a savior, that's how cause and effect work. You are the living truth.
So, I believe time travel, if God allowed, could cause an onteological problem. In other words, if God allowed a human to travel in the past, and rewrite history so to speak where he doesn't rob the bank, thus not subject to criminal justice, it would cause a problem in the day of judgment.
Not sure what point you're trying to make TBH, time travel is only possible through the causal plane. And even then you are dealing with things that already happened. That can't be changed. In true time travel circumstances can be changed, but once something has happened it can't be changed, only corrected. So if you were to make it in any travel of time you could only help not correct.
How would time travel, unless you think it's absolutely impossible in every way, or time is not really relative, affect reincarnation? Or would it? Could a human change their future reincarnated role if they went back in time, and changed portions of their lives that say, gave them negative karma effects?
Reincarnation is based on what you do and the effects it has on creation, if you want to change something it must be done in the present.
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@RationalMadman
You cannot prove that your consciousness is not physical inside of the simulation.
That depends on what method one wishes to explore. It is impossible to prove it to another person, but quite possible to prove to the self. Since spirituality is individual perception it's also based on observation. Since we have a nature that exists outside the simulation we can also connect with that reality.
Souls are only real if we are in a simulation. Even then, the soul itself is probably simulated too just on a higher-up level of reality.
Basically yes, these of course are just frequencies of energy to be experienced at various conscious levels. The soul itself is not simulated though, it comes out of a singular conscious Reality, which enters a simulated type of experience. The nature of the soul is identical with that outside the simulation.
If the body is a simulated avatar for the soul, you cannot ever prove that inside of the simulation, it's literally impossible.
Unless you were to alternate your attention, again proving it to the individual not collectively. Then we take what we learn individually and share it collectively so that people can become aware of it.
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@Deb-8-a-bull
These Soul things you guys are on about. It seems fitting.It almost feels like it makes sense.Of course we all have a soul.
Now you're getting it! see, it seems fitting because you are not just a physical body. You know this inherently but you are forced to believe because of your current perception. You think all you are is senses that the physical body experiences, but if you're a little more intuitive you will observe that the physical body is just a vehicle or a mask, like if you were driving a car or operating machinery, or looking through the physical form.
But if there is any logic used to get to." WE ALL HAVE A SOUL " it must be carried on to.And when we die our soul dies with us.
No not at all and that is why the evidence contradicts that false perception, because your consciousness is not created by a brain or the body, your soul is the awareness or consciousness that inhabits the physical body. This is plain to see when we look at the reality that the soul can exist outside the material body after brain death.
But it don't.It doesn't.
It does, and the evidence in is NDE's and religion (spiritual encounters). To say it's not is a denial of the facts. Facts are that NDE's are a reality, they explain that the soul is not dependent on a brain.
So the first claim is. ( WE ALL HAVE A SOUL )I like the sounds of that.Let's go with it.AGREE.
Now you're getting it, only that you are not lol. Which is it Debate, are you going to go with evidence and intuition or are you going with the bias of atheism?
I estimate six plus billion people out of the eight on earth if asked. Do we have a soul would say we do. IDK
Probably true, and while the fallacy ad populum voids claims it's also an indicator of the facts.
Now you goddists being so knowing on all of life's great mysteries.( NEXT CLAIM )WHEN WE DIE OUR SOUL LEAVES US AND '' whistles " out of your body, and lives on so to speak,Then it's claim after claim.
It's no longer a "claim" when the evidence mounts up like a giant slap in the face that says hey! you exist outside the physical body and material sense perception! look at the actual evidence involved!
We are this soul.It goes upwards in the sky
Not really, when you leave the physical body you will experience a suction as if going through a tunnel, this is your soul separating from the physical body. This is a fact, not a guess or an assertion, you can go upwards or downwards lol.
Sooooooooooooo.Do we have a soul or not can't be answered FULL STOP..And with this FACT, bloody claims sprout.
It can be answered, in many ways try asking a question bro.
But ummmmmmmmm, it's only common sense we don't have these extra special things you guys call souls.
No not at all, you started off saying "These Soul things you guys are on about. It seems fitting.
It almost feels like it makes sense.
Of course we all have a soul."
You're only inconsistent because you have no idea where to put your trust. But if you trust your initial intuition and trust in spirituality you will find it will never fail you.
I feel like a mean bastard, for saying that now.Of course we all have souls ( disgusted doesn't )
Disgusted has a soul, but it's real rusty lol, kind of like an old car that's been in the garage too long. The guy is obviously spiritually decapitated.
The soul is simply the you away from the physical body, if you can imagine your being still existing apart from that. Your consciousness is not dependent on your current material form, the brain is nothing more than a conductor or component that confines your experience to this body but consciousness itself cannot be destroyed, you will always exist one way or another. You can never separate yourself from that reality.
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Soul travel and astral projection should be seriously examined and studied by anyone interested in knowing whether or not all this soul stuff is real and objective. NDE's are the most flat out examples of proof and evidence that the soul can travel outside the brain. Soul travel of course would be thrown into the ol pseudoscience category to be ignored but it's the most compelling source of evidence because the soul can literally travel outside the body and experience an objective reality. This is not induced by the brain of course lol, because we all know from first hand experience that the brains perceptions stay within the confines of the brain. However, even after brain death consciousness will survive and does so through countless testimonies and religious sources. The soul can literally watch its physical body from the soul outside that body, and has been recorded through NDE's and spiritual experiences a million times over, that's repeatable and a clear example of demonstration of that which correlates with the reality of the soul.
I believe that in the future objective experiences due to soul travel will be what merges spirituality and science together, it will inevitably happen especially as the curiosity of man grows and the science behind creation and the soul become more well known. I can articulate exactly how the soul is formed, what it is made of and how it enters creation...why it experiences what it does and why it does not experience certain things. I can articulate the nature of consciousness which is the nature of the Creator, how the soul inhabits form, how the soul has transcendent experiences, how it leaves the body, where it will be when it does, how the Creator formed the universe and by what processes ect ect...all these things can be articulated because it's objective, it is what we will all eventually know anyways.
Astral projection-
"is a term used in esotericism to describe an intentional out-of-body experience (OBE) that assumes the existence of a soul or consciousness called an "astral body" that is separate from the physical body and capable of travelling outside it throughout the universe."
Soul travel-
Soul Travel transcends astral or mind travel, and rote prayer, elevating one into profound spiritual areas. Whenever Soul reaches the far orbits of the inner planes through Soul Travel, the human heart opens to God's all-consuming love.
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@n8nrgmi
i am not as new age or spiritual as eternal view
Lol well there's not much "new" under the spiritual umbrella TBH. Creation and the worlds that transcend this one are vast and incredibly dynamic there's really nothing new I could bring to the table besides explanations. Spirituality to me is an application more than beliefs, it's more a lifestyle or practice and so I apply whatever I think is applicable because of my love for the Creator. My passion for God serves as a platform to experience whatever God has to offer, and the eternal God is far more creative than anyone could ever get with or imagine.
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