Total posts: 10,910
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
Btw Earth said I receive the dream, not have/had it.Idk if that gives me towncred. Analyse his language elsewhere to tell if he would say that.
What was your dream results?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
His partner is Lunatic. Luna played the other side yet never hammered Savant despite all that talk and pushed a massclaim at the same time.
I was not even online when the hammer happened. I thought we were going to do a mass claim, and I stated multiple times that I wouldn't vote until we decided on what we were doing with that. Also you think I am scum because I didn't hammer TOWN? What the hell kind of backwards logic are you expecting people to buy?
Created:
Posted in:
So...literally the same thing you're accusing me of? If you policy lynch me rather than playing to my win con, is that not "game throwing" by your standard? I mean it's a strategy meant to encourage certain long-term behavior, which is the same as what my strategy is. Why is it game throwing when I do it but not when you do it?
It’s not fair, and no you’re not being held to a different standard. I tried pulling this garbage years ago and I rightly had the same crap done to me. I’ve since seen the light. It’s game breaking to let one person do something that no one else can do, fourtrouble had a similar thing he would do where he wouldn’t play games if he rolled scum and people got pissed at him for that. It allows you easy scum games and it’s just not fair
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@whiteflame
@Mikal
When I was pressuring you a few games back two games in a row. You got to a spot where you told me to fuck off and just lynch you basically. Everyone gets there. My point is lynching him to prove a point is something scum would do or allow to happen
Mikal’s logic seems worse than usual this game. Wondering if that’s a scum tell or a dumb tell.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Mikal
Surprised Luna is going along with the mass claim. I think it makes sense. Just not sure a town Luna would agree and figured I’d have to fight more
Ah you missed all the times I tried pushing mass claims and got in giant flame wars with drafterman than
Created:
Posted in:
Mafia gains more than Town from this Massclaim, don't you see?It helps them aim their secondary powers.
in the case where they don’t have fake claims provided it hurts them as well. Like I said earlier, what does it matter if they know at power roles if this helps us catch them? Lack of familiarity with the theme, plus a high chance of CC means they will be forced into gambling a high risk character and better have a sensible role to back it up, or more likely they just claim something obscure and those will be easy to weed out. Even if we don’t get a lynch correct in dp1 the odds of finding scum will be relatively easier to narrow down by locking them in like this the further we go
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
But do you hold the same fiery stance if Mikal does what Savant did?I do.
Check previous games again. I literally have done it.
Created:
Posted in:
Anyways, I think I am caught up now.
TL;DR my vote will be on savant after we tally up the votes of who is in favor of the mass claim or not. My vote is officially yes for the mass claim.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Savant
Well if town is gonna lynch me anyway it doesn't matter if I claim, they'll see my full PM the next day.
Mafia is just as much a social game as it is an investigative one. You attract more flies with honey than vinegar. Look at AR, he is someone that most people dis-agree with in general based on his daily behavior on the site, and he's one of the most widely town read people in the game right now. Why? He complied. Dreamer isn't even usually considered a good claim! The behavior you are emulating right now is behavior I would have expected from AR, the throwing a fit, causing a tantrum about not getting his way etc. In fact I came into this game fully prepared to just outright lynch him assuming he was going to pull those shenanigans. You were the last person I expected to act this way.
And then killed at night w/ the power role. But if I always refuse to claim I won't always get lynched for it and can use the power role.
Oh you will, mark my words. That or we are gonna have some really stand still games where at least two players are just throwing, because I will match your energy in an instant and ruin this game for you and everyone in it until you realize the folly of this. And I will actively encourage and petition everyone else to do so as well. You aren't the first special snowflake to try this sh1t.
Why would I want to help the town when I'm scum?
Ah so you admit this strategy mostly helps scum thanks for that.
Mikal has literally said he uses the same strategy and apparently wins a lot with it. So it's not anti-town to use except when I'm scum, in which case I want the town to lose.
Mikal is lying. Anytime he has tried to do sh1t like this its backfired and resulted in his lynch and often times his teams loss. Theres a reason he quit playing for a few years. He talks like this to to bluff, but it almost always ruins the game for everyone else involved, even when he's done it in live games. Mikal talks big, but the last few games hes played here have been different, and thats because he DID learn the hard way. Go and check his past games under his "elminster" account. He was frequently lynched dp1 for doing this type of sh1t, and eventually he just quit. I say this and it sounds harsh, but mikal is actually a very good friend of mine, despite all this. I don't encourage this behavior from him either.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Savant
Not anti-town. Some claims would get be lynched even if I'm town, and sometimes I have power roles. If I always refuse to claim, town is better off in those games.
If you think town are constantly mislynching you, you need to let that be towns fault. Mafia are going to try and take advantage of any mislynchm its their wincon you can't blame them. But if town are fvcking up they need to take accountability for it. Them mislynching you last game was towns fault, and hopefully a lesson was learned from it. I saw a few people in the endgame mentioning that it was a bad lynch, meaning people realized from their mistakes. Unfortunately it is a team game, and you being mad that your team fvcked up doesn't give you a right to try and game the system so that your team doesn't fvck up any more, because thats not fair to everyone. Imagine a world where every did the same thing as you and outright refused to claim. Nothing would ever get done, lynches would be random af, and the game would suck. You can't play a team game as a solo player. Convince your team why mislynching you is bad without playing these stupid games. If you can't do that, why are you on a debate site?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
We've played in thousands of these things. We never let anyone else bully us out of playing by being a retard. We bully them back. Fvck that sh1t. Whats 5 games out of the 1000 we play? Savant wants to play a hardass so will we. Just perma vote him until he realizes that town will never get anything done or accomplish anything with at least two players who wants to play the same way he does and never comply. He wants to die on that hill? So we do we. Mafia can get their win percentage up here for a few games in a row until he wants to stop throwing his fit. Doesn't matter to me, just hurts the mods. But this is what I mean about town needing to draw a line with sh1t like this. You can't just let one person do it and not others. It's not fair. There needs to be a precedent. Like I said if its me and Im being pushed for a reason I dont agree with, I debate them and tell them WHY its a bad reason. But if I get to l-1 im claiming. If I feel town are being retarded maybe I lie about my claim. If it gets me lynched, its whatever, I just blame it on the town. But I will still fvcking comply. You can't let one person get away with this non sense. Royal paladin tried doing it. F-16 tried doing it. Budda tried doing it. I've tried doing it. We all got put in our place and were eventually shown this is a selfish pr1ck way to act, and eventually stopped that nonsense for the greater good of mafia. We don't fvcking quit because of terrorist threats. We fvcking fight fire with fire and lynch their asses.
*ends war speech*
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
@Savant
That's gonna be difficult for all the games you don't host, cause I'm probably gonna play in all of them.
The difference between me and pie, is that I won't black list you, ill just support lynching you every game, or just straight up killing you as scum and ensure you have a horrible time playing in every game until you stop this sh1t. We've done it before to people who tried this nonsense we will do it again. I suggest pie changes his mind and join me in the attempt to just lynch you in every game instead of quitting mafia.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Savant
I think scum would have found a reason to hammer me, hence I suspect that scum were both on the wagon. That means Casey and Pie are the most likely team from my POV.
I am ready and willing to vote you, for all intents and purposes you can consider yourself hammered. I am waiting to see what resolved of the mass claim situation, but Im a couple pages behind still. If you think your claim can help your lynch, by all means, provide it.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
Savant WF makes so much sense.
I don't know if whiteflame would be so quick to savants defense if mafia, thats my main thing. Whiteflame would probably just bus.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
I don’t. I’m guessing. Either way, I’m not rewarding a non-compliant player. It sets a bad precedent. And if he’s going to continue doing this, I’m not going to play if he’s playing. It’s anti-town.
X1000
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
Why does Savant get special treatment?If myself or others behaved like him theyd have been hammered long ago.
Never thought I would hear myself say this, but AR actually makes a good point here.
Its why I think town needs to have a solid position on what to do in situations like this.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
No that’s stupid cause it means some people can wiggle out with “garbage justification”
What if the mod just gave generally garbage justification? We see it all the time. No offense, there was the same debate with some of the justifications of claims even in your black ops games. I am sure Ive been accused of bad justification multiple times as well.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Savant
Have you said whether you're on board yet? I think everyone else is besides AR, and he already full claimed.
I am on board and trusting mikals knowledge of the theme enough to break the game. I also played skyrim a bit when it came out, and theres probably a few characters I remember though much of it is in the fog.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
Even if somehow Savant is Town, it helps Mafia FAR more than us forore outs to occur.The primary thing they dont know is who is rpotective and who isnt. That is vital to hide.
Its 50/50. No matter what claiming early also hurts scum, they have higher chance of being CC'ed, which makes them more likely to come up with obscure fake claims, IE easier to catch. Who cares if mafia know who the power roles are if we've basically caught them dp1? It backfires only if mafia somehow just had amazing fake claims (mafia tend to suck at fake claiming on this site, not to mention very few people know the theme except for mikal, who I recall you town reading).
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Casey_Risk
Hey, I'm here, and I'm dead inside. Sorry, I saw the posts AR tagged me in about how if not Savant, then who and how since no one wants to change away from Savant? And I had to stop and think about that for a bit, and then I just did work until my shift finally ended, and now I'm home and ready to crash. I'll revisit in the morning, but I still don't feel good about a Savant lynch right now. I'm too tired to coherently explain why, just read what I wrote earlier I guess.
Fair enough, I am not all the way caught up yet, but in general I do think town needs to draw a hard line on what to do in "refusal to claim" scenarios.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
I’m fine with the mass claim. For the record though, I think it’s a cheap move, but it’s technically the mod’s fault for not providing fake claims or the opportunity to get a fake claim.
Ill take this as my answer from earth, I am assuming you already asked him if there was fake claims and he said no
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Mikal
At that point we should just full claim me thinks
If we do this, the best way is popcorning full claims. Unfortunately the "post at the same time" rule doesn't work in forum mafia the way it does on live mafia, its just won't. No one is ever on the same time. But you can still keep an eye on their activity and use it to sus them based on how long it takes them to respond, and how long ago they were online, taking into account that online system can be fooled.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@whiteflame
I get that you’re frustrated with him refusing to claim, though he made clear that he wasn’t going to do that under pressure. He’s hardly the first and won’t be the last. If that was part of a pattern of behavior he was trying to blend in or at least not stand out from past play, I would probably have voted him already, but I’d have to believe that he drew attention to himself as scum by changing up his style substantially, then essentially dared us to lynch him. I just don’t buy that view. It’s possible, but not the most likely explanation.I take him stalling as him needing time to fake. Therefore no matter what he claims now I stick to it.So he’s scum, he’s had almost 24 hours to come up with a fake claim, but hasn’t quite managed it yet and is daring us to lynch him just to gather some more time to… decide to claim all of a sudden? If he does suddenly relent, he still has to somehow avoid getting CC’d, which isn’t going to get any easier without more claims ahead of him. It would also come off as pretty scummy after being this intransigent.
If savant is refusing to fake claim, its not for lack of "being able to find a fake claim" imo, it's just that its clearly working for him. Threatens town with a d1ck comparing contest and towns too nervous to mislynch to take the contest. Okay but that breeds a lot more of that behavior in the future, it's something we've seen time and time again with people (even myself).
Personally if I am getting pushed to claim early and I do not agree with the reasons, I'd just lie as town about my role (if I am a power role, otherwise just be truthful). Refusing to claim outright is almost always scummy, or seen as scummy, if we don't lynch him now he's gonna be on the back of half the playerlists minds the whole game. I think there needs to be a clear line with this drawn. If savant had a very good reason drawn out for why he shouldn't claim that is different, but if he is playing drastically different that needs to be addressed. And I take that even acknowledging the comments he made dp1 about no doing his list thingy. Savant has historically stuck to his guns more often like this in defending himself as scum than town, so no matter what its a tough pill to swallow.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Casey_Risk
In all fairness, I have been very clear about the fact that I've been busy due to working a lot of overtime and only barely have time for mafia. This is something I've been saying for the past few games in a row; I'm verifiably not making this up. And I will admit, I did think that your stubborn refusal to comply was scummy at first, but now that I think about it more, I don't think you'd self-sabotage like this as scum unless there was a clear benefit to your partner, and I just can't see how that'd be true in this instance. So I will
People overestimating savant might save him this day phase, thats actually surprising.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Mikal
RM can sit there. I really want to explore full claiming
Are you talking just mass character or role claims as well? I am not opposed to it, if you really feel like you can break the games theme split, or find just bad claims in general. I have supported mass claims in the past, the problem is some mods like to throw players through a loop. For example, in whiteflames game a mass claim definitely would NOT have worked. For one, there was no guessing that theme split, and for two both me and you were convinced that earth's character stapphyloccus HAD to be some sort of power role based on it being one of the most well known bacterias for its danger in spreading, despite all the evidence that presented itself to us that we also knew he had to be a vanilla. A mass claim that game could have resulted in an earth mislynch. So you really have to know that the mods got a generic style of game going on for this to work. I can't remember if earth games are generic style or not, but it could work. Just remember you risk outting all the power role characters on the off chance the mod isn't doing anything wonky with the theme or split, but hypothetically you could also just catch all the scum with it too.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@whiteflame
Alright, I’m caught up and while I understand where these votes are coming from, I can’t agree to voting Savant. This frustration and his responses so far come off as a townie who doesn’t give a damn about being the lynch if he’s backed into a corner like this again, and considering how I saw that play out last game with the Enabler claim, I can see where it stems from.If he’s doing this as scum, literally making his responses as frustrated and obviously scummy (like that Godfather claim) as possible, then props to him for making this look like an authentic townie meltdown. I just don’t buy that he’d do all this after shifting up his gameplay for much of the game, especially at L-1.
Interesting... Like this reads as scum buddying (to me the reasons people are scum reading savant seem pretty valid) but you've also been accused of scum buddying him multiple times at this point, and you'd know how this stance would look as scum, so maybe it's legit?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Savant
Hmm...I actually think AR is town here. If he's scum, he has to know how bad he'll end up looking when I flip town. I'm inclined to agree with Mikal that scum are probably being very quiet right now. Or maybe it's Casey, who has been online but isn't really engaging in the conversation beyond very slight pressure a few pages ago.
Town, in general, shouldn't care what they look like when hunting for scum, you know this. Their only goal is to find and eliminate scum.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
Lunatic is the most likely partner.
Bruh you have no clue I just saved your life for literally no reason if I was scum. If I was scum you'd be dead already lol
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@AdaptableRatman
No its NP I never ever said dp.It can be RBd (asked this) but the wording imllies it is guaranteed refund because ots worded as if I definitely dream once per game.
I assume you mean once per night phase, not game?
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Casey_Risk
Luna could go either way but there is an actual scumtell I picked up on in the last game that made me lightly sus him (I was actually considering making a case for him and Pie being the team before Banana came in with her claim). Pie knows what I'm talking about, and so far I haven't seen it yet. Plus, there's another, subtler thing that's hard to put into words, which I'll get into later.
hmm
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
What range is the first name of your character in?
M-Z
btw will be going into sleep coma shortly, just got back from fishing trip been up almost 48 hours
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@WyIted
cant remember who else to tag, maybe it was casey? But Ill say I was mostly joking about earlier. Mostly. If AR is going to play normally and not throw that is, if he is going to play or act like he normally does though I am down to do it still. Anyways, my initial thoughts are that he is probably town and not being a massive cuck yet, so I am willing to give him a chance.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
You don’t get to decide that, so claim when you’re L-1 or get replaced because otherwise if you are town, you are throwing
I mean you've seen him do it before so why egg it on? Id join you in lynching him if there was a good argument for it and he was being stubborn, but if were talking to him about just making him claim for the sake of claiming, I don't think he deserves that. I'd do that to AR, because he is a cuck, but everyone else is basically deserving of respect.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Savant
Also, I won't be doing the percentages thing, it's way too time consuming. If that means I get policy lynched, so be it.
Thank god, it was extremely confusing anyway.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
I was lowkey kind of demoralized after hearing you could send an action the night you died and hearing earth retained the justice. Too many bases to cover for what we had considering we played a perfect game til that point so just happy it’s over now
Created:
Posted in:
Gg, we had to gamble no matter what going into the final day phase. Couple things through us through a loop. One being pie would have still been able to send his gift even if we killed him, two being the justice not being used up after we roleblocked it. We discussed possible options for over an hour and no matter what every single option had a game ending method for us to lose by considering those two factors. We had to gamble there was no safe play. We even assumed pie probably sent a gift to mharman and that it was a tracker, but I mean nothing really to stop his bait. Mikal wanted to but I told him fvck it, if he’s baiting we basically lost already anyway.
I had the game basically solved dp1 tho, knew earth was vanilla and staphylococcus, knew one of pie or Casey was investigator, etc.
Ggs
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Mharman
Yeah I gave it to Mike, not sure why he hasn’t confirmed yet…
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@Mharman
I did not receive Lunatic’s gift.
Was going to send it to you, but figured you were the night kill for sure.
Created:
Posted in:
Here is my full claim paraphrased to the best of my ability.
You are Clostridia! You are a set of spore-accumulating microbes that are most often found in the dirt/earth and are particularly well known for your pathogens. That’s because Clostridia have some of the most pungent toxins on the planet, some of which have even been re-used as treatments for everything from craggly skin. You have easily spreadable species, with the two most dangerous being Clostridium botulinum (botulism) and Clostridium tetani (tetanus). Since these two species are known to spread easily, you are investigative inventor. You have a 1x gift of a botulism, and a 1x gift a tetanus you may give out to a player during the game. Both of these are investigative abilities, but you will not be told which is which. You win with the town.
Night phase one I sent earth a gift of botulism, which was apparently a 1x justice.
I will withhold for now who I gave the second gift to, in case they want to do some questioning before revealing any potential results. I have no clue what ability they received from tetanus.
Also Night Phase 1 I received a message saying "you have been visited by your friendly neighbor mikal, who is affiliated with the town." So that is what I meant by being able to town confirm someone. A few people picked up on that already, but yeah, hes town in my book.
POE leaves exactly what wylted was saying before. Pie and banana. And yes I do think pie silenced himself, mafia have no real reason to silence him if he was town, he would be one of the biggest mislynch targets for them at this point. Silencing himself accomplishes two things in his mind:
1. It gives him town cred (he thinks)
2. It gives him yet another day to delay claiming, which if he gets a mislynch today, he basically won the game without ever having to claim.
I regret not forcing a mass claim yesterday before voting for wylted. There was no reason for everyone not to have full claimed at that point.
Anyways, yeah POE is banana/pie. I am willing to hear everyone thoughts and we can discuss this as normal, but game is solved from my pov.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
If yall have nothing else to say can we just vote Wylted and move
Just waking up, but sure this one seems pretty cut and dry.
Vtl Wylted
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
I literally had him DP1 lol. Yall just gaslit me
What do you mean “yall” when did I gaslight you
Created:
Posted in:
He admitted that he visited Earth. Earth got Frozen (aka roleblocked). If Wylted is town, the only way Earth gets roleblocked is if Wylted targeted Earth AND Earth targeted Wylted. Earth did not do that.
I assumed he’s trying to say his role block and the freeze are separate.
I also was rereading the DP yesterday and Wylted mentioned cell wall when he was paraphrasing his PM. But then when I mentioned cell wall, he was like wtf are you talking about. We also know that Mharman is confirmed town as the Doctor. Doesn’t make sense for Banana to CC, so she’s likely town. Earth is likely town cause it doesn’t make sense to fake that, and whoever gave him the Justice is confirmed town too
Agreed for the most part, wylteds justification being bad is a big reason I suspect him. He mounting is I would maybe throw banana back into the pool if Wylted is scum because I can see him encouraging her into a CC play against mharman if they are a scum team, otherwise yeah the move is more likely town.
Created:
Posted in:
Yeah I’m not sure that I would call that a scum sliip, that’s not to say Wylted isn’t scum though.
Created:
Posted in:
-->
@ILikePie5
Wylted literally scum slipped
Wait what did I miss
Created: