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@WyIted
Bro his pleas and begs for what he was doing wrong looked so townie. I can’t believe you guys didn’t pick that up lol
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@Mharman
GGs everyone.Good theme choice Luna, I love COC
Thanks man. I love playing with my COC too.
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I’m about to go to sleep, I don’t think there’s enough in Owen to justify a lynch. I’m okay with a no lynch this day phase atm.
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I have no qualms with Austin’s explanation and actually figured that most of that would be the case here. I am fine with it all. Only thing is I thing he may be dismissing earth from the the POE too easily. Regardless I do think Austin is town. And I do think lying as town can be beneficial when done correctly. In Austin’s case I mostly would have been disappointed if it ended in savants mislynch or resulted in power roles being forced to claim, but I don’t think the fallout here was too detrimental and I agree overall it did bolster a lot of activity and town reads for me.
Yeah I’m okay with all of that.
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Im fine ending in a no lynch. I don’t have enough to evidence to push a lynch on my scum tears so time expiring is ideal. I don’t imagine that will happen, but it is okay imo because it was a productive and active day phase and power roles should have enough to go on to make relatively informed decisions tonight. We don’t need to end in a potential mislynch here over policy. Just think about it. I’ll likely be asleep when the do ends
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@WyIted
There is a sort of justice in it though. I don't know who is town but If we assume that all 3 of the people mentioned are town and it looked like we were going to lynch lunatic or savant at one point than he deserves it.Town doesn't deserve to lose a member this way but it is a type of justice.
Tbf I don't think either of us were extemely close to getting lynched, it caused a ton of activity, and it's garnered a lot of activity and reads. The RVS part of it definitely seemed to work.
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I am likely to be the only one to see austin as town here. I can see being wrong on it. Austin is a very aggressive scum player like I did mention before. I just don't really see the scum motivation in a lot of what he did. Like he could have just stuck to his guns on the dreamer thing and didn't have to come off of it at all. I feel like we will mislynch austin because of this whole debacle, but it's kind of out of my hands.
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Ik lynch all liars and stuff, but yeah it still doesn't make sense for austin to play it this way as scum. If I was scum and I would have rode with it and tried to take down as many people with me as I could. I wouldn't just come out and admit I tried a town gambit and got it wrong. Also him town reading two of the people in his "dreamer results" the way he did earlier just doesn't make sense from a scum perspective and setting up mislynches.
Either way I know savant isn't going to let up on this now and probably mharman or earth either. I think whiteflame and maybe wylted will see the light, joebob will probably just wagon the highest lynch train, and ulttimately, I think austins screwed himself.
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@AustinL0926
would you believe me if I said it was a softclaim/soulread into reaction test gone wrong, and I townread everyone in thread rn and think Owen is scum by POE
Bruh... I'll buy it... But I doubt the rest of the town pool will. And I'll say your lucky pie isn't here lol.
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@Earth
Not sure. He keeps saying that he knows savant is scum mechanically but now he’s saying he’s not. Idk what that means and he refuses to elaborate. Earlier I was operating under the assumption he had accurate results. I might be dumb and missing something. That’s why I haven’t made a stance on whether I think he’s scum yet.
I don’t see any mention of Casey making this a swingy game and a role that just immediately catches scum doesn’t seem realistic. Add to that Austin saying he doesn’t know for sure he’s scum means that Austin could be interpreting something wrong and just strongly believes savant is scum. There is another option of what Austin could be by I don’t wanna say it publicly and if he is that role I think he is playing it badly and town is screwed. But ultimately I don’t know and it’s up to Austin to clarify that if he wants us to lynch savant. Behaviorally I town read savant so I’m not gonna blindly pursue a lynch on a town read if he’s not 100% sure about it.
What are your thoughts on it?
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unvote.
I don't really felt like I accomplished much with the joebob pressure, but he's at least active and posting. Still kind of scum reading him.
vtl earth
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@JoeBob
yes I saw those, but I didn’t know that meant they were made up. I mean I only ever saw him saying it was between WyIted you and Savant. Just because he doesn’t think it’s savant doesn’t mean he’s faking it. But even then, why would Austin fake the results? That would make him look scummy and he knows it.
I don't know why he made them up. He could have been trying a ploy, could be a third party lyncher, could have had a strong gut read, who knows. I had been calling it out early that I thought it was a town ploy, but now I am not sure what the motivation is. Only austin can answer that, and it doesn't really seem he wants to.
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@Earth
Jesus Christ. There was a time Austin would have been policy'd for lying like that.
pie would probably do it. But Austin does have a pretty main character so that makes it hard.
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@JoeBob
On one hand, his role does seem like something that would be a good fake claim. Since you know who is scum and whatnot, it seems likes. Good way to skate by. On the other hand, his role is likely to draw some attention, which is why im more inclined to believe that he’s town. But if he is town then it truly is between you and Savant.Savant has full claimed and you haven’t. Now I can’t tell wether this is just you being you and not wanting to full claim, as you did say you shouldn’t full claim. So im mixed on it.
Why is it between me and savant? This is why I asked if you are caught up. Because we already now know that austins "dreamer" results were made up. He's admitted it twice now.
1st time: https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/11342-ace-attorney-mafia-dp1?page=19&post_number=549
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My town reads:
Wylted - Character, behavior
Whiteflame- Behavior
Savant- Character, Role, Behavior
Null:
Austin- I buy his character based on the little research i've done on the theme, but it doesn't seem like one austin would have left out. I just really don't know what to make of his play this day phase with the pseudo results. I am gonna have to think about this one for now.
POE:
I think there is likely at least scum are in earth, mharman, joebob, and owen. Maybe two. I could see being wrong on one of my town reads, but it is early in the game, I imagine I will refine these reads later on. This is just where I am at now.
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@Mharman
Got a PM response. She declined to answer if TPs could win with town.
Figured
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@JoeBob
for the most part, still confused but that’s normal
What are you confused about?
what do you want from me
Thoughts, analysis, general participation, or a willingness to solve the game. I know you were looking for tips on scum hunting earlier, but frankly there really is no set in stone answer. You have to kind of analyze and think for yourself. Would so and so do this? Does this feel natural? What does your gut say? There's no recipe for finding scum, there is general things you can look for. But like WYlted said, if you've ever suspected someone was lying to you IRL, use those same principals in the forum to try and find scum..
Anyways you seemed focused on the savant thing still. He has full claimed, and austin has now come out and basically admitted that he doesn't know for sure that savant is scum. Given that development, do you have any thoughts on other players? If you still want to lynch in that pool, who and why?
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Don't feel too bad bout it. The town usually loses a player on day 1 anyway. Doesn't make a huge difference if it's me or someone else, as much as I'd like to make it to day 2.
Scum savant kind of accepting his fate in dp1 of mahabaratta ^
He's actively fighting for survival here by pushing other lynches, which seems indicative of his town meta.
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@JoeBob
What’s your read on Savant?
Are you caught up?
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@Mharman
What are the consequences of a tp lyncher getting a lynch anyways? I gotta look that up
They win. Sometimes the mods will allow them to join win with the winning party. I did in my last game, though, admittedly, makes third party feel kind of useless. I just did it because I know how people tend to dislike non joint winning third parties.
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@Mharman
What are the consequences of a tp lyncher getting a lynch anyways? I gotta look that up
They win. Sometimes the mods will allow them to join win with the winning party. I did in my last game, though, admittedly, makes third party feel kind of useless. I just did it because I know how people tend to dislike non joint winning third parties.
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@Mharman
I initially dismissed the idea of a tp lyncher, but now that I think about it, Pie did tell me he thought someone was a tp lyncher last game… Lemme go check my discord messages with him I think he said it there
pie thought savant was lyncher last game, and that was plausible given his behavior.
Even so, imo tp lyncher is incredibly bastard in a 9 player game if town has no way about finding out about them… really hoping Casey would ignore Pie if he ever told her to put that role in a game….What are the consequences of a tp lyncher getting a lynch anyways? I gotta look that up
Why is it bastard? A 3p lyncher has to convince everyone to follow them. It's only bastard if town blindly follows them. Moozer was a 3p lyncher in recycled roles, and he almost didn't get the lynch on savant. When he did it was more or less for external reasons, rather than any case he had against savant
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I'll be the first to admit I don't always have the best scum reads, but I will say I do feel like I am pretty good at town reading people. And Savant doesn't feel scummy to me. I agree with whiteflame that behaviors that might normally be looked at as "scummy" should be kind of overlooked in savant's case because he does have a tendency to grab on a point and run with it, and while I still think the possibility of a 3p lyncher is plausible, I was merely suggesting it as a possibility. Savant seeming more sure of it aligns with his usual "grab on to something and run with it" as whiteflame lightly suggested.
Anyways if you look at him as a whole his behavior does seem very town assuming he knows he is town, and is buying into the same "results" we all are. Scum savant with inside information would have a better time picking a lynch here or just 1 v 1ing austin from the beginning. This feels like savant is genuinely confused and frustrated but still trying to take the route best for town. Also the last game I remember savant being scum in was mahabarata, and his behavior doesn't match with his more submissive seeming behavior in that game. Granted he was new, he did lightly defend himself but he more or less went along with the lynch.
Everything is pinging me that savant is town here. I could be wrong but I don't think so.
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@AustinL0926
Again, worst-case scenarios don't matter without probabilities. What motivation do I have to draw attention to myself like this early on?
This type of wifom was actually why I townread you in pie's recycled roles mafia. Turns out you are very aggressive and bold as scum
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@Earth
If anyone is about to get lynched, it's you Savant.
Why? Are you caught up? What do you think of austin admitting he's not 100% sure about savants affiliation?
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@whiteflame
It's also strange that his character and WyIted's are so closely related (they're sisters) yet somehow would come from distinct alignments
I don't know a ton about the series, but I was watching youtube videos on the way to work, and saw one that said that the one sister was dead. Not sure if being dead =/= not being in the game, but its worth considering that it was a character that might have been asked about by the scum team.
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@AustinL0926
Something is clearly not adding up here. You have to realize that
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@AustinL0926
I am not gonna ask you to full claim. But can you at least confirm that the part of your results with me and wylted in it being bullsh1t to some degree? Because your reads and actions seem to indicate that’s it’s really only ever been savant
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Post 528 by savant is really townie btw. And I agree entirely. Under the theory that Austin is 3p lyncher I’d rather just have him lose by not fulfilling his wincon. Then he can help town later since he’s already in second place. Doesn’t make sense to give scum a numbers advantage
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Driving to work, will be back in an hour or so. I’ll wanna wait for Austin and Whiteflame to give some thoughts here anyway
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@WyIted
Yeah its kind of on austin at this point to decide if he wants to elaborate here. I just don't really understand why he would do the dreamer thing at all. I am also kind of wondering if he was a certain role pie had not long ago... but I don't want to specify too much on that.
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Behaviorally my top two reads are earth and mharman. For reasons explained earlier, which might have got lost in the madness of the dreamer results.
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I-I've gotta find someone to pin this on... Someone like... him! I'll make it look like HE did it!
This was the qoute in the OP. And it's starting to make a lot of sense. lol
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@WyIted
Wylted, it's possible bro. I'm looking back at the first couple pages and he had savant as his lynch immediately and had us in his town pile when we had only made a couple of posts. This has been more or less consistent with his thoughts and analysis the whole day phase. The only thing with him being scum I have an issue with is why he wouldn't want me and you claiming, and why he would pass you off as town knowing he could mislynch you. It's like he actually has results on savant or something and knows we are town.
This is why I kept thinking that he was town pulling a reaction gambit.
Now my thoughts are changing a bit. I am wondering if he is a 3rd party lyncher, whose goal is to quickly lynch savant dp1 and then try to side with town (why he is putting us in his town pile). This theory makes more logical sense to me than him straight up being a town investigator who got extremely lucky with a mafia in his results dp1. Like that is insane and I don't think casey mentioned this would be a real swingy game, just that it was a rolemad game. Pie helped him too, and pie doesn't really design like that.
Something is up with austin here, and third party lyncher kind of sounds like the most plausible option right now. His actions don't seem town or scum motivated to me. But then I have been fooled my austin before.
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@WyIted
Bro I also feel like something isn't right here. Like literally the only reason my vote is on savant right now is because of this result madness.
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@Owen_T
Or we could just do the exact same thing with you first.
Getting these kind of vibes lol
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@Savant
Make the point then. Clearly I'm missing it.
No.
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And he'd have to use one of his asks to see if Mia is in the game, or he'd have to be Mia and realize there are two characters with similar names. All in the span of 2 minutes.
Or he asked about mia being in the game beforehand....
Or he was still scum and thought austin was claiming mia, and was like "wtf I asked the mod and mod said she was in the game" and CC'ed austin knowing his claim was safe, then mistakenly still realized that he wasn't claiming mia. He could have made the same slip and still been scum.
I don't really want to keep arguing with you about why he could be scum. I am not gonna opt for lynching him here regardless. I am merely pointing this out in the case that both you and me flip town, and town angry lynches austin, austin flips town, and everyone just goes "WTF wylted should have been confirmed town".
No, really never was. And it would still have been town's mistake for just disregarding him as confirmed. That's all.
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@Savant
I don't think it's WyIted, and I think that zero investigative roles are unlikely. Lynching you is the most logical play from my perspective.
Your close, but still missing the point I am making.
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@Savant
But would he come up with the similar names idea in 2 minutes? I doubt it.
Everyone doubts it which is precisely why it would be a genius move for him.
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@Savant
I'm pretty confident that either Luna is scum or that a town investigative role will catch Austin tonight. Help me lynch Luna, and you can assume I'm scum tomorrow if he flips innocent. I really don't want to get tunnel vision, but I just don't see my read on Luna changing this day phase.
There’s one major flaw with this logic that you are not seeing. Don’t make me spell it out for you.
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@Savant
He would have had to come up with that strategy in 2 minutes. Maybe he was just waiting for someone to claim one of those two so he could claim the other, but that's a lot of planning ahead for something he might never get the opportunity to do.
Wylted is not a planner. He makes big risky moves that could either backfire or pay off. I’ve seen him do it before many times. You saw him lynch a claimed super saint last game. I’m not trying to say that it’s definitely wylted, but it’s totally something he could do.
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Do you think co mod Pie would add a mafia Magistrate when he was a mafia Magistrate not long ago?
To be completely honest idk, but I would lean no. I think if savant is scum he is likely another role and just trying to buy an extra day phase. Or he is a role that works similarly to magistrate and thinks it would pass off looking like a magistrate.
And I also said I’m open to the possibility that we were underestimating Wylted and he could be the scum as well. I was town leaning savant before Austin verifies that this wasn’t a gambit so I really don’t want to pretend like I have all the answers here, I just know I’m town.
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