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@Discipulus_Didicit
If I die tonight follow your heart on that Pie scum read.
Too late, bud. I would have helped you on this earlier in the day phase, but your flip-flopping here and accusing a claimed cop is way more suspicious than Pie's behavior. Also you can't accuse me of tunnel vision when I literally just took my vote off Pie.
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@Casey_Risk
See above. Also vote Discipulus_Didicit.
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@Barney
@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@WyIted
@420-1776
And town protective should 100% be on our only cop claim (whiteflame). We can sus him later if he fails to deliver results, but losing an investigative role like that is too big a loss, especially in a game that Luna says is very swingy.
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@whiteflame
Right now your head is on the chopping block, and we are in danger of losing our only cop. Even if Discipulus_Didicit is town, leaving him alive will always be a liability. I recommend voting against him if you don't want to be mislynched.
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@420-1776
Plz participate or you're going to get lynched. Vote against Discipulus_Didicit if nothing else.
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*un-cc'd, not confirmed. Though to me it seems pretty much the same.
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@Barney
@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@Discipulus_Didicit
@WyIted
I hate that the bar is this low, but defending a confirmed cop makes Pie less scummy in my eyes. Discipulus_Didicit could easily be scum given how quicky he jumped on lynching an un-cc'd cop.
VTL Discipulus_Didicit
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@whiteflame
@WyIted
I guess it's probably time to be fully transparent even if it ruins the utility of your role.
No, it is not. Only a negative IQ town would lynch whiteflame right now or demand that he give more information to scum.
Whiteflame, hold out. It's not like the town is going to lynch you because you keep quiet.
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@Mharman
My mind doesn't think their defenses are tenable, but my gut hates the prospect of lynching someone who says they can self-confirm and someone who is a claimed an un-CC'd cop.
Why is your gut being more rational than your mind here? A few games ago, I was an un-cc'd cop, and it's because I was actually the cop. What reason would you even have to suspect us, separately from not being 100% convinced by these claims? Why would you rationally want to lynch an un-cc'd cop or a confirmable player day 1? It makes no sense.
This explanation seems pretty scummy, ngl. You're advocating for lynching two bad lynch prospects on day 1, and your explanation about your gut and mind still doesn't make much sense.
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Alternative Theory #1: Pie-Disc
I was wondering that as well but that main theory makes me suspect Mharman as possible scum. Guessing teams this early on is basically an exercise in futility though. Easier to just find the scummiest players.
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@ILikePie5
Really desperate to throw suspicion any way the wind blows, aren't we?
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@Discipulus_Didicit
are you just against lynching claimed cops DP1?
Yes, I am very against that. Also the fact that he claimed that and is un-cc'd makes him confirmed as far as I'm concerned. Luna said nothing about giving counterclaims, and he told us he gave mafia hints in Invincible. I don't think he'd give scum info and not tell us.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
I didn't know WyIted as well as I thought I did.
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@WyIted
In all fairness, I don't know who either of the people we quoted are. But we were throwing around appeals to authority.
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@WyIted
I am fighting this battle. George Santayana said that those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
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@Barney
@whiteflame
@Discipulus_Didicit
@WyIted
@Casey_Risk
Your case is garbage.
Yep, that's Pie's defense. Nothing of substance there.
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@WyIted
Maybe Mharman. Since I suspect Pie of being scum, that lowers the odds significantly of each other player being scum, and Pie could also be throwing out the name of his scum buddy since it's unlikely to lead to a lynch (both reasons that Mharman is far from a certainty). But I don't want to let Pie slip through my fingers again. If I die the first night and people forget that Pie is suspicious, we could just get a repeat of last game.
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Unfortunately, no one wants to stick their neck out by attacking someone, so instead we get a vague "one of these three people might not be town" which does not scare scum at all.
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@WyIted
I'm also hesitant to just start throwing more names out to get an easier lynch. Giving several options to choose from plays right into scum's hands since it tells them exactly who they have to target. I'd also rather fight tooth and nail to lynch scum than lynch town just because it's easier to agree on.
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@WyIted
Well it's actually just Pie. Mharman and Disc are possible scum, but I'm less sure about them.
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Mharman or Discipulus_Didicit are as likely to be Pie's partner as anyone, but I will have to reread their posts to see if there's anything sus there.
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Barney and Casey could be scum, but I'm hesitant to pursue those options since Pie is going after them. Also notice that nobody else has jumped on the "lynch Pie" train, even though that would be a great opportunity for scum if I was tunneling.
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@WyIted
As far as the buddying is concerned. Me and pie often talk on the phone like once a week
Buddying someone in mafia is different from being friends with them irl.
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@Barney
@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@Discipulus_Didicit
@WyIted
almost feel like we should just kill 420, based on the fact that when he is using the underdog account he has no issue responding to every other post I make
So you thought he was solid town before but now want to lynch him? 420 is null imo.
It's becoming increasingly clear that most people don't have solid leads and we don't want to lynch no one. Certain people are confirmable or claimed early and shouldn't be the lynch today: WyIted, whiteflame, and me. Going after someone else gives us a 1/3 chance of hitting scum on day 1. I was hesitant to go after any of WyIted's initial town reads, since he said he rarely gets those wrong. But now he's suddenly changed them, so I don't know what to think.
Lynching Pie is the safest option. I've already made my case against him, and he doesn't have a confirmable or important role. That makes him a safe lynch. Even if you don't think he's scummy, he's certainly not close to confirmed town, so going after him is preferable to lynching no one. He's also harmed the lynch effort by pursuing people who claimed important roles or can be confirmed. He defends himself by saying "xyz is the Meta so we should do that" as a general cop-out, which is what he did last game. I'm sure he thinks he's being "objectively townie" right now and that wf is "objectively scummy," but that hasn't been reliable before.
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@WyIted
Is your vote even on pie?
Yep, it never left.
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@ILikePie5
So why are you sussing me for wanting to No Lynch, which I literally usually never want to do.
Because you're afraid of getting lynched based on WyIted's reads. You know we are likely to lynch someone WyIted has not town read, so you want to avoid lynching or lynch one of those other people.
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Also the sooner we lynch scum the better, because they probably have a crazy powerful role given how swingy Luna said the game is.
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@Barney
@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@Discipulus_Didicit
@WyIted
Here are some good reasons to vote Pie:
1. Most of his defenses have been calling me ridiculous without really elaborating, which I have noticed scum tend to do. He knows I'm getting strong scum vibes from him and that I've sometimes been right before, so there's no reason for him to just dismiss me out of hand if he's really town. Yet that's exactly what he's doing.
2. After Wyted said he was sure about his town reads and claimed early, Pie began buddying him and trying to sus the other people WyIted hadn't town read in order to keep POE as large as possible. Whiteflame claimed cop, yet Pie still considers him super scummy based purely on character connection (which has repeatedly not been a good way to identify scum). Town Pie would be against lynching WF this day phase with an early cop claim, but scum Pie doesn't have a choice if he doesn't want to be targeted by WyIted—he must get us to lynch someone else WyIted is not town reading, so he's throwing suspicion at all of those people.
3. I will likely be confirmed town soon or lynched tomorrow, so there's minimal risk to giving me the benefit of the doubt here. If I'm scum and lying, you will get rid of me tomorrow. If I'm town, you know I've had a lot of accurate reads before, and we have little else to go on this day phase. We'll just be going off of "vibes" no matter what, and Pie has been scum read or non-town-read by WyIted and myself, who are both probably safe (and if I'm not safe, I'll probably be lynched).
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@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@WyIted
I think it may be optimal to No Lynch as of right now
Another scum tell from Pie. Means we're probably close to getting him and the other scum.
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@ILikePie5
Yeah I think I'm similar to that
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@whiteflame
Even if you were right in previous games, though, it doesn't necessarily mean you're right now.
Maybe. I'm just saying what my intuition tells me rn.
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@whiteflame
he seems pretty dead set on viewing Pie as scum for reasons that frankly don't make a lot of sense
My reasoning never makes sense, but it's usually right.
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@Owen_T
You can spend them to lift debates or posts to the top of the thread.
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@whiteflame
@ILikePie5
@Discipulus_Didicit
@WyIted
@420-1776
Doctor/healer/bg should be on whiteflame tonight since he's the cop. Which means I will probably be the night kill, but I'm willing to make that sacrifice.
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@ILikePie5
@Mharman
@WyIted
Whiteflame: Scum. I can’t find a good reason for him being townie. The cop claim is waaaaay too sus for me, especially him saying he can get a result tonight.
Ok, so scum are probably Pie and Mharman.
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@whiteflame
How do you feel about Pie rn? You're the claimed cop, and he's still looking for reasons to sus you.
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@Casey_Risk
Well now I've got a pretty good reason in that he's sussing the claimed cop. That should make him everyone's top scum read. Pie knows he has to sus all of WyIted's other non-town-reads because one of them is probably getting lynched today.
Earlier he tried to get me to accuse 420, and he instantly used my answer to scum read me. I think setting something up like that would likely come from scum who wants a reason to get another player lynched.
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@WyIted
Earlier everyone was calling me completely insane for my reads. Now we're agreeing that whiteflame is town and 420 is not an automatically safe town read. Maybe it's time to consider my other read that everyone ignored—that is, Pie being scum.
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@thett3
None of that sounds super unlikely, but I think a lot is still up in the air. I think we might get parts of Project 2025, but the craziest parts probably won't happen.
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@ILikePie5
I made a promise to Wylted
Ok, that explains jumping on the train. You are still my top scum read, but I won't hold that particular decision against you.
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@WyIted
Even when made aware it is scummy you are still breaking up reads.
You said if I was scum I would stop breaking up reads because I would know it would look scummy. It's just too obvious of a WIFOM, so you're not going to get me that way if I am scum. But yeah, I will prove myself tonight.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
Yeah but you should be very hesitant to lynch someone who will probably be confirmed tomorrow. If I'm not confirmed, I will likely be very suspicious tomorrow even if I'm not 100% tmrw's lynch target.
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@WyIted
Look how quickly Pie jumped on the train. Also, WF's behavior wouldn't give him away as scum even if he was scum. When WF says he's busy because he has an event, he means it. He could be scum or town, but something as simple as inactivity/buddying wouldn't give him away.
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@Discipulus_Didicit
If you lynch me today instead of waiting a day because of the slight chance I might not be confirmed, then I don't even know what to say.
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@WyIted
I need a better reason to vote for whiteflame. Something comprehensive like the case you made against Austin two games ago.
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