Lunatic

I give up. Mafia had a good run yall

Don't worry, you won't have to worry about a scum vig if we can't even get enough people to start the game :)

RIP

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I have the game, I think ive played a the first levels because I remembered that level where you escape with the ruussians

oh I stopped researching at some point thinking it was gonna be pointless with scum getting 4 questions

/in

Both were from the same level too, interesting. 

I am actually surprised Reznov and Kozin were both in the game and both town. Got that theme analysis wrong af. 

I am glad I didn't make it into lylo. Sure mharman and cerulean were in my POE, but I think there were others I scum read more. And I was also pretty back and forth on whtieflame. For some reason I just can never let go and fully trust him lol. I am not sure who I would have thought was his partner though. Good job to mharm and cerulean for pulling through, I liked the fake claims.

Well balanced game pie. No obvious critics stand out to me. I think mharmans role is powerful, only in that town tend to take results so seriously. But I think the more results burn a town the less likely they will be to follow them blindly in the future. 

:p mines all mafia too lmao

Sweet justice lmao

After just playing scum with him in the last game, your chances were probably slim. 

That’s a joke btw ^ no mind reading requires

A what? I’m straight bro…. But thanks

for some reason he’s holding out on that info. But yeah I was thinking it is a wierd move for pie to make town lynch proof since hes such an “objective” mod and usually has strong opinions about balance. Making town lynchproof doesn’t feel like a pie move. That said I don’t scum read moozer behaviorally, so even if we’re wrong having a strong confirmed town going forward is good for Poe and could force scum to waste a nk 

Nothing you type reads like a joke. No laughing emoji, no lol no lmao no nothing, sorry bub I don’t read minds 

Nothing you type reads like a joke. No laughing emoji, no lol no lmao no nothing, sorry bub I don’t read minds 

Anyways talking to Whiteflame I think we decided there is too much doubt on earth. Between his claim, and overall behavior, the people wanting to lynch him, etc I feel earth is kind of an easy mislynch here and I don’t wanna get hit with that “well technically it was earths fault” yeah yeah been burned there before.

But today is the last day we can probably test moozer. If he is actually lynch proof I don’t think we can test that in mylo/lylo. At the very worst we get a solid townread player who we don’t have to worry about and a no lynch instead of risking a last second decision mislynch. Talking with Whiteflame we think moozer is the best option for today. We will have to be more active and engaged dp3 and make something happen, everyone should be full claiming tomorrow. If we don’t have results to work with in dp 3 it is what it is, should have chose better targets.

For today, vtl moozer.

lol how?

Your whole basis for this is that you think I scum slipped? Come on dude, kind of weak.

Wouldn’t make sense since I’m the only one sticking up for you lol if I was scum you’d think I’d be advocating your lynch here

Lynched* obviously it would be a mislynch if he was town lol

If earth gets mislynched here and is town…lol

You already role claimed so what would be the point in not giving the rest?

Alright, we have until 4pm my time today to accomplish a lynch and I might be asleep by then so I am going to post now. I do want to apologize that my activity hasn't been stellar this game, my sleep schedule is out of whack again, and also I don't really know how much I wanna invest in the theme in this game with out crazy a lot of these role justifications are, so my motivation to actually do theme research is out the window. I feel like pie is trying to say the theme doesn't matter and to focus on behavior with this game. That, or he actually thinks these justifications are good and I just live on another planet then him.. idk who knows. I'm sure he will justify these in the end game but they seem so wild to me.

I am gonna go through the list of my reads and tell you my thoughts on each person. 

Earth- I am back and forth on him. His obliviousness to day phase one and the entire conversation about his own character, combined with his weird target with whiteflame, doesn't make a ton of sense. Also motion detector is just a very minor off powerful role. That said I did expect his character to be in the game as he is a prominent side character in the first mission. I did explicitly say in dp1 it would be weird for whiteflames character to exist, and NOT earths character. I feel foolish for town reading him for this alone, but I also don't want to be burned by earth's obliviousness here. Like if we mislynch him for horrible use of his role I feel like we didn't learn anything except "Oh earth did an earth thing, silly him" when town just got burned by that from him last game. So I kind of want to give him an earth pass, but at the same time, there is literally no justification provided. Pie at least kind of attempts to explain (if poorly) my justification. Bullish's was horrible, but wylted's actually kind of made some sense. Pie is so inconsistent with the justifications I honestly am at a loss here. I guess lynching earth wouldn't be a huge town loss here, but assuming we mislynch him we are going to be down to MYLO tomorrow so that is a risk I have to decide I am willing to take and atm I am a little wishy washy on it. 

Whiteflame- I think hes probably town, but yes, I am still a bit suspicious of him. I can't help it, I am naturally always suspicious of whiteflame when I am town. I recruited him to the mason particularly because I suspected him and felt like I could get a better handle on him from discord messaging, see if we echo each others thoughts. For the most part we have, and I do want to town read him for that, but there are a couple of red flags with him this phase that I did point out to him already. The first being I think his focus on getting people to overly think about wylted's use or lack of use of his action got people to divulge a ton of information for free. Whiteflame should have known from the get go that Wylted didn't use his action since mine went through and he didn't strengthen me, so right away this whole thing was a waste of time. I get a lot of this push also came from earth, which was why I was initally suspicious of earth. But it resulted in basically every town member telling whether or not they acted or not, which means now mafia know who is an active role and who is a passive role and have enough POE to work out what to do with their night actions if they are smart. He also divulged our existing in the mason pm a little prematurely. I kind of wanted to formulate a plan and keep town guessing, for example I am not the worst night kill as a neighborizer isn't a huge threat role wise. Maybe baiting I was some super confirmable and powerful role could have helped draw the night kill, or some other gambit. Maybe hinting that I was in a standard mason PM. I hadn't worked out a strategy yet, but  I didn't want to fully out as the neighborizer yet and I think whiteflame could have reserved in outting that information. I think it would have come out regardless so its not the end of the world or anything, and it also helps town POE here as well as mafia POE, so I am not holding it as a major point against him. My main worry about him being scum is that when I was scum with him in the past I saw first hand how freakin good he is at piecing together who is what based on POE and mafia counters, so with him kind of asking everyone whether they visited or not that was a big red flag to me and if whiteflame is scum, he can tailor his night actions around that information tonight. For the record I confronted him about all this already in the neighborizer pm, and he answered in a way I largely liked and felt he would say as town. I could just be allowing myself to be manipulated by him, so I am taking my read on him with a huge grain of salt for now, but OVERALL I think whiteflame leans more town to me than scum. His behavior feels very townish to me both in the day phase and in the mason PM, and ultimately I feel constantly being suspicious of him will bite me in the arse, so if he is scum I think its something that we will have to figure out in MYLO/LYLO because I don't think I am willing to lynch him today.

Banana- leaning town still, yes its hard to read inactivity, but her play is basically the same as it was in the last game. She's chipping in when asked, and maybe she's not providing ground breaking information or reads or anything, but her "compliance is key" gameplay feels similar to her last game. The only time I've seen her as scum she was overly emotional and reacted poorly to pressure, some thing I haven't seen from her yet. I am also still kind of leaning on mod pscyhe a bit that one of the vets is scum, and so giving her a bit of a pass. I think we should push her claim next day phase if she hasn't provided any useful results or analysis by then, but for now I am willing to give her a town pass for today.

Moozer- scum lean, based purely on his role-  I like his effort this game, and I do feel like we are getting a moozer who is genuinely trying his best. I also kind of mod psyche his not being scum here, but the only problem I have with him at the moment is his role. Roles that revolve around not getting lynched are generally not town aligned, and I have a problem thinking that pie would put a role like that on the towns side. It's all wifom at the end of the day, and mod psyche so I feel like its a hard thing to justify, but this just leans into what I think pie would or wouldn't do. Ultimately I can see moozer as a viable lynch target today because the worst harm that comes from it is a no lynch, which isn't the end of the world. 

Cerluean- Null, lean town? After just playing in the last game with a mostly inactive cerulean, I can't read him based on his activity alone. His thoughts have been coherent for the most part, and I did town read casey before he replaced. If people were interested in pursuing cerulean for a claim before the end of the day phase I wouldn't be against it.

Mharman- Null, In his response to banana explains his activity by being bored or disinterested in mafia. I have to decide if I buy that, if its true, it sucks because Ive said before that town mharman usually feel really easy to read and posts massive clumps of paragraphs game theorizing, and usually it is pretty easy to tell if he's town. That said, he was town in the last game as well and his behavior does kind of echo the lazy feel we were getting from him in the last one. So I am just gonna throw him in the null category for now as well. 

Conclusion: I am down to push for information from one of cerulean of mharman before the day phase ends, of just straight up lynch test moozer. If it came down to lynching earth I could be convinced to do it, but like I said, I can see that one biting us with it being an "oh it was actually just earth being earth" in the end, where we learn nothing from our mistakes in the past. Thats where I am at, a few more nulls than I would like here, but I think scum is blending in well. I still like to think scum is in the vets I just have no clue and no SOLID reads which is unfortunate, but also a sign that scum is playing well and more evidence that scum are probably vets. 

NGL your justification for reznov makes like literally no sense. Mine is also kind of a stretch is the only reason I haven't jumped on it. 

I feel like whiteflame and his claim was the larger focus of the latter half of the dp... lol

Thats a good point. That target makes no sense actually now that I think about it. He had to have known he was gonna get a motion detected from that, what was he accomplishing?

Earths claim is solid kind of, but What are your thoughts on the game right now? I’m a bit lost in the sauce. I do have a scum read developing but it’s not solid and I don’t feel I have enough to pursue it heavily. Also I don’t have an idea for the partner yet.

Surprised you didn’t react much to whiteflames claim. You are both from the same level btw, though your character is more prominent and one I figured would be in the game.

Unvote.

We know I visited Whiteflame so there’s that for the motion detecting result.

Been talking with whiteflame, earth is also my scum read. I noticed his behavior seems different than late, hes been active and interested, but not really "helpful" and I feel like theres more going on with him behind the scenes. I am trying to feel out who his scum partner is if he is scum, but i'll have to think on that one harder. for now, 

Who are your scum reads atm? You don’t have to do a. Whole list maybe just your top 2-3

I feel like we’ve given mafia a lot of unnecessary POE this day phase with having people claim to be roleblocked or not. Been kind of waiting to see where this whole thing is going and to see if it was worth it or would pay off in a scum read or if we just gave info away for free

I know I’ve seen it scum sided but I can’t remember the games off the top

Why would town need an ability that prevents them getting lynched lol

I didn't initially see the part of wylteds role that says he kills himself by using the role, so I assumed since my action went through that he didnt. But now we are getting confirmation that several roles have gone through, so it's likely he didnt at this point. 

Bullish not checking in until literally after EOD is unfortunate. But we move on. I’ll be a bit busy this afternoon but will post some thoughts later tonight at work. Going to be shifting my views around from last day phase based on who I think would likely kill Wylted and why.

Day phase ends this evening btw

Yeah, I am actually okay with the bullish read people are having. He is literally getting a free pass for trolling, and has not even tried to further the game. Bullish is not a noob, and is very capable of providing coherent thoughts.

If we get one more claim, I would be okay pursuing it from him. 

I'd definitely say at this point your leaning more into the roll over category, and there is reasons why m!whiteflame rolls over in some places, but would argue as in others (as you are doing now). While initially I think I was more shocked at the idea of you claiming over one vote, your rationalization for why you would do it kind of makes sense if you are actually telling the truth here. So I am picking and deciding to find it more weird that you don't seem to have a sense of direction for the game, and even are now not mentioning the moozer read or even sticking by that one, which was kind of what led me to suspect you in the first place. 

So what happened with the moozer read? Did you change your mind on it?

Yes but you are a debater. Since when would you let me "bully" you out of a read if your read was genuine? You just typed out a paragraph to respond to me here, so your willpower to try and convince me is clearly not evaporated. When I started that pressure you could have responded to it by further justifying your read on moozer, why you think he is more likely to be scum, why maybe I am giving him too much of a noob pass or a mod psyche pass, etc etc. Instead you rolled over and claimed completely over one vote. While I am considering the reasons you mentioned town would do this, the lack of defense for your initial position made me assume you realized the read was also scummy, and was why you stopped pursuing it. In place of you stopping to pursue one read, I would have expected t!whiteflame to then prepare a new route for us to pursue, but it seems you have decided to entirely go on the defense here. I am really trying to understand this behavior from a t!whiteflame stance.

I think getting at least one more targetted claim, not random would be wise. My choice for voting mharman was the same as for voting you, his choice in targeting moozer. He has since posted more reasoning for the lynch, so I will have to evaluate and see how natural it feels. I can see bullish here as he is a vet, and seems to have elected to mostly troll this game, which feels kind of unusual. 

It's his moozer suspicion. I came into this game keeping an eye out for people who would pressure banana/moozer, who aren't noobs, but are probably most likely to be  mislynch targets based on their limited skills/abilities. I have my own reasons for town reading the two at this point, but the chances that both would be exactly scum seem low to me. I am thinking scum is among the other 6 vets in this game, and with how slow paced the activity for day one has been, I was on the lookout specifically for anyone trying to push a ml on one of those two thinking it would be an easy lynch, as thats whats kind of been happening lately. Scum going for easy mislynches. 

What direction do you wanna pursue this day phase? Asking cuz there’s one day left. ATM you are kind of my only hard scum read so while I’m pushing other options, chances are it could come back to you. I know you said you are okay with being lynched but the more I think of it the more that doesn’t sit right with me. I’d expect town Whiteflame to want to get things on track and hunt scum, not roll over on his belly and accept what he thinks is his fate. That’s what earth did last game, and you don’t strike me as that type of town player. If you were to play it that way it would make me think you were scum just hoping to get back under the radar and praying the direction turns a different way. 

Viktor Reznov is even on pies quotes. I’ll say if Reznov isn’t in the game it’s gonna be hard to buy that whiteflames was put in over Reznov lol 

Just curious why did you claim your role as well when you claimed?